Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Nigel Farage cries persecution, nobody wants to be his banker after ties to Russia

Options
1…2324262829…87

Comments

  • Options
    #752
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,474 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873537#Comment_120873537

    How far do you take it though?

    As pointed earlier in the thread , "Free speech" laws typically focus on Government actions limiting free-speech and not the actions of individuals/corporations.

    Coutts have decided that Farage is not worth the reputational risk and as you say another company could decide that Bernie Sanders or anyone else is not aligned with their corporate image and is a reputational risk.

    However that "reputational risk" element cuts both ways - If Coutts get lots of backlash from their clients about cutting off Farage then they'll back-track, likewise a company dropping Bernie Sanders or whoever.

    Either no one has the right to decide who they engage with or do business with, or everyone does.

    Neither option is perfect but I think on balance allowing everyone to decide who they do business with (outside of those explicitly protected classes/groups) is the lesser of two evils.



  • Options
    #753
    Rawr
    Registered Users Posts: 3,872 ✭✭✭Rawr


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873537#Comment_120873537

    If we were simply talking about a high street bank de-banking the guy for purely disliking his politics, that certainly shouldn’t be a factor. Everyone, including the most hateful bell-ends of the world need access to even the most basic banking to function at all in the Western World, and they should have that.

    But that’s not what has happened here. The hateful bell-end in question is in a strop because his fancy boutique bank for the ultra-rich wanted to downgrade him to a normal high street bank, likely due him not being all that wealthy anymore. I also suspect he was a headache for them (as he is for many people), and this is a fancy bank with very personal customer service. So they were likely watching his balance and waiting for the day when they had enough criteria to justify a downgrade to NatWest, and spare themselves from sharing a room with him.

    I’ve little doubt Coutts also deal with many other insufferable bell-ends, but I suspect those other people bank many many more millions with Coutts, compared to what Farage can currently muster. Those other people are likely worth the financial return to put up with the headache of them, but Farage may not be anymore, and they want rid.

    Farage was offered a transfer to the main Bank in the group, so they wanted to give him the option to continue business with them. But Farage wants to be special and is having a hissy fit because someone said “No”.



  • Options
    #754
    osarusan
    Registered Users Posts: 16,617 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    On the reputational/publicity element of it, I'd never even heard of Coutts before.

    Now I have, and the only thing I know about them is that they'll remove their boutique services from a customer if that customer might bring about reputational damage, as they have done with Farage.

    If I were some guy with a few million quid looking for a boutique bank, I'm not sure that Coutts are a more appealing or secure prospect than they were a month ago.



  • Options
    #755
    Shoog
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Shoog


    Farage is putting those clown boots back on for another circuit of the circus ring. The clapping seals just love it.



  • Options
    #756
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,492 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873557#Comment_120873557

    Probably worth pointing out that most people who pay off their mortgages, or spend their savings, aren't shown the door by Coutts. Private banking is all about building relationships, and Coutts would get a pretty bad name pretty quickly if it fired a lot of its customers in later life. (The dossier in relation to Farage makes the point that closing Farage's accounts has reputational risks for the bank, which need to be set against the reputational risks of not closing them.)

    Plus, the financial tests are just one aspect of Coutts's assessment of customers. As the bank for Posh People it's very much interested not just in how much money customers have but in who they know, the circles they move in, etc. Lord Snobley of Snobbington may not be asset-rich after he has handed on the estate to his son as part of an inheritance tax avoidance scheme, but he still knows all the right people and goes to all the right dinners, and he'll still be a valued customer of Coutts & Co.

    If Farage weren't such a controversialist, his paying down his mortgage would not have led the bank to close his accounts.



  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #757
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,474 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873652#Comment_120873652

    It's a distraction and a deflection.

    If people weren't talking about this regarding Farage then they would either be talking about how much responsibility he bares for the utter shambles that is Brexit or they simply wouldn't be talking about him at all because he's irrelevant.

    Neither of which is a good thing for Farage and his endless grifting , so he fires up this little controversy.



  • Options
    #758
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,393 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120872889#Comment_120872889

    Oh, I think plenty of people understand the type of Bank we're talking about here: never overestimate the Persecution Complex at the heart of this corner of right-leaning politics; notice the narrative has been trying to emphasise "political bias", Big Woke at it again, over the uncomfortable reality that this was a wealthy man getting rebuffed by posh, private bank. Farage, and his biggest fan on Boards, has been very deliberate to skirt around that part of the conversation. They know full well the optics of going to bat for what amounts to a financial Old Boy's Club isn't going to play as well as "political bias at the heart of banking!!"



  • Options
    #759
    osarusan
    Registered Users Posts: 16,617 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873608#Comment_120873608

    I don't think it's connected to 'Free Speech' in any way.

    What we're talking about here is a bank making a decision to remove services from a customer based on the potential reputational damage of having an association with that customer because of the public's perception of that individual.

    It's a typically cut-throat approach to business, and it sounds pretty dodgy to me, and as I said earlier, not something to be celebrated even if, on this occasion, it happens to somebody who's an utter bastard.



  • Options
    #760
    Kevrano
    Registered Users Posts: 158 ✭✭Kevrano


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873693#Comment_120873693

    Those are fair points. So he would have been kept on, if he wasn't seen as a liabililty



  • Options
    #761
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,620 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873537#Comment_120873537

    Whereas I'm not surprised at all to see some posters openly lie and ignore certain inconvenient facts such as that Farage was not denied anything because of his political views and that he was offered the same account as normal people.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #762
    TokTik
    Registered Users Posts: 1,454 ✭✭✭TokTik


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120803716#Comment_120803716

    This has aged like milk.



  • Options
    #763
    Nermal
    Registered Users Posts: 2,636 ✭✭✭Nermal


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873577#Comment_120873577

    "It's not his views per se, but the fact that he is so public about them". Comical stuff.

    This thread is a great example of the phenomenon of 'it's not happening' magically transforming into 'it's happening, and here's why it's good'.



  • Options
    #764
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,492 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873802#Comment_120873802

    I don't think anyone in the thread has actually said that it's good, Nerm.



  • Options
    #765
    Nermal
    Registered Users Posts: 2,636 ✭✭✭Nermal


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120785174#Comment_120785174

    Are you not embarrassed to still be posting in this thread?



  • Options
    #766
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,620 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873813#Comment_120873813

    No. Should I be?

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Options
    #767
    Shoog
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Shoog


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873813#Comment_120873813

    What seems embarrassing is that for some people their man got his cumupance - which loses them face and knocks them of their pedestal.

    Who would have thought that rich people had standards 😊



  • Options
    #768
    Kevrano
    Registered Users Posts: 158 ✭✭Kevrano


    So this seems to be where this is leading: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-66254596


    These people don't seem to understand what freedom of speech actually is.



  • Options
    #769
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,393 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873802#Comment_120873802

    I think this thread is a great example of how a critical aspect of the whole "controversy" is being ignored for the sake of ... I dunno, turning it into some Hill about Political Bias.

    Just to be very clear: a moderately rich man got rebuffed by a discriminating rich/posh person's wealth management company (sorry, "bank"); the reason reading like exactly like the kind of posh people's bullshít affectation of civility I'd expect from that kind of place. As someone already commented, this place provides what amounts to a financial butler.

    If you think Coutts are discriminating, for god's sake don't read any further into what the British Upper Class get up to. I don't care if it's Nigel Farage or Greta Thunberg; anyone wealthy enough who can frequent that kind of bank doesn't need us to defend them when they're asked to GTFO.



  • Options
    #770
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,474 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873739#Comment_120873739

    But it is "free speech" in its purest form though.

    Farage is free to say and do the things he does and people are free to love him or loath him for doing so , they are also free to chose not to engage with him or indeed to not do business with him if that is how they feel.

    The fact that the bank is making this decision not because of a genuine moral concern but because of the business impact of everybody elses moral concern doesn't make it any less of an example of freedom of expression.

    Like I said , it's far from perfect but it's probably the best option to allow it to happen and to allow things to find an equilibrium.

    Some people will be happy with the decision that Coutts has made , some will be angry and some won't give a toss.

    Coutts will deal with those outcomes and for them as long as they come out ahead financially then they will feel they've made the right decision and by extension so will the majority of the population (by virtue of Coutts not losing money/business).



  • Options
    #771
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,620 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120874102#Comment_120874102

    Did they learn nothing from the USA when they pulled this crap over there? I guarantee someone will come along who doesn't meet the threshold playing the "I'm banned because of my views" card and because of how banking operates, there'll be no evidence to the contrary.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #772
    astrofool
    Registered Users Posts: 16,622 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873537#Comment_120873537

    I'd have no problem with sanders losing access to private services from a private bank.

    I'd have a problem if he was denied a bank account.

    Just as I'd have a problem if Farage was denied a bank account.

    But he wasn't.



  • Options
    #773
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,620 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Farage lied:

    In a new statement issued on Thursday, a Coutts spokesperson acknowledged the "substantial interest" in the Farage case but said it could not comment in detail because of customer confidentiality obligations.

    However, they stressed "it is not Coutts' policy to close customer accounts solely on the basis of legally held political and personal views".

    "Decisions to close an account are not taken lightly and involve a number of factors including commercial viability, reputational considerations, and legal and regulatory requirements," they said.

    ...

    "We recognise the critical importance of access to banking. When it became clear that our client was unable to secure banking facilities elsewhere, and as he has confirmed publicly, he was offered alternative banking facilities with NatWest. That offer stands.

    And, of course:

    Nikhil Rathi, the FCA chief executive, also confirmed the regulator would be carrying out a review into PEP "to make sure those rules are being applied proportionally by banks".

    With regards to freedom of speech, Mr Rathi said anyone who felt they were not being treated fairly could complain to the financial ombudsman service.

    https://news.sky.com/story/coutts-bank-hits-back-amid-nigel-farage-account-row-12924062

    His entire narrative collapses upon the slightest critical examination.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Options
    #774
    Kevrano
    Registered Users Posts: 158 ✭✭Kevrano


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120874346#Comment_120874346

    I predict Farage will twist this into his silencing by "the Elite". The man's lack of self awareness is staggering.



  • Options
    #775
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,620 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120874385#Comment_120874385

    Of course:

    He told Sky News: "It's such a prejudiced, nasty document. It's the metropolitan elite loathing the views of the many millions of us that live outside the M25.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Options
    #776
    Shoog
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Shoog


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120874102#Comment_120874102

    Tories will be Tories. What this shows is that the toffs in the Tory party feel entitled to change the rules to suite their buddies - it was ever thus but it will sell badly to the public if they try it. Can they possibly lose the next election worse than they already are - probably.



  • Options
    #777
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,620 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120874405#Comment_120874405

    It's empty virture-signalling and nothing more. Paris is already the finance capital of Europe because of Brexit. Imagine what would happen if they told niche banks like Coutts that they had no autonomy over who they could have as a customer? The big banks would stay but they're not good enough for Lord Haw Haw but any small banks would likely relocate.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Options
    #778
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873437#Comment_120873437

    Nigel Farage can still do all the things he wants in terms of banking , he just won't have a personal "financial butler" anymore.

    But that was not the reasons the bank gave, as outlined by the document.

    You can keep framing it in terms of commercial viability, but that was never the stated reason to begin with.



  • Options
    #779
    Shoog
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Shoog


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120874504#Comment_120874504

    It was their own excuse for dumping the oink. They didn't need that excuse they could have dumped him anyway - it just was a fig leaf of cover. And yes they haven't done anything wrong.



  • Options
    #780
    McFly85
    Registered Users Posts: 3,069 ✭✭✭McFly85


    This is still a non story but Farage loves whipping his followers up to be outraged on his behalf.

    I said on this thread that it was likely due to risk tolerance, and it seems based on the carefully managed information that Farage has provided, is that reputational risk is what triggered the account closures. How is that in any way controversial?

    By offering him a standard NatWest account, the bank fulfilled its legal obligation to him. Nobody is being denied anything.



  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #781
    Kevrano
    Registered Users Posts: 158 ✭✭Kevrano


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120874397#Comment_120874397

    He is so bitter. His own actions have led him here, but he'll never ever admit that.



Advertisement