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Enough is enough? Dublin north inner city crime

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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    As you correctly stated, as long as you can afford it.

    I doubt that those who are starting these attacks, won't be able to afford the places you've mentioned.



  • Registered Users Posts: 483 ✭✭hymenelectra


    Respect is what I'd zero on in your comment.

    As I said earlier, the bigger picture I put on all this is the demoralisation of the population at large.

    The police would be viewed as an extension of the government/society. That's fair enough.

    Having respect for the government is a tall, tall order these days. And the way the country is running, if you can call it running, isn't anything to respect either.

    That's the moral point of view I suppose.

    The practical element of it, as in the sheer unaffordability and unavailability given by society is going down the shytter too.

    It's no wonder crime is on the up and respect and decency is going out the window. The country is getting the behaviour it deserves and, being balanced about it, there is no reason that this isn't going to get much worse.



  • Registered Users Posts: 483 ✭✭hymenelectra


    Well the squeezed middle have a snowballs chance in hell of being upwardly mobile. They're given juuussst enough reason to hold on and say this is worth it.

    But those on the bottom, they don't even have a snowballs chance. And they know it.

    Not that a young mind is a bastion of knowledge, but I can readily see the reasons behind their behaviour. The "fook it" point of view. They have every reason to hold it too.

    Also, for what it's worth, the squeezed middle are well on their way to that same stance. The future is grim.


    Just to add, all this in the face of never before seen wealth. Its a crooked old place.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,218 ✭✭✭snowcat


    I lived there too. The Guardia get poor pay but they have utter respect from the community which results in good morale. You do not mess with those police. They always carry batons guns and handcuffs and will use them. During a recent festival they were clearing the streets to allow the cleaners to clean up. A drunk tourist went play dancing in front of them and promptly ended up being launched into a doorway, a local would not dream of messing with them. You are not allowed to film them either.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKRCFh4Saio



  • Registered Users Posts: 483 ✭✭hymenelectra


    I'd go further, perhaps, and say that those who can change things aren't just not galvanised to do so, they may be incentivised to the opposite.

    I still say hpusing is at the heart of this, and that it has been purposefully inflated by each and every government action for over a decade. Top priority.

    That large swathes of unprofitable social housing are falling into no-go zones could be mighty profitable for private housing assets elsewhere.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,818 ✭✭✭Northernlily


    The boy that stabbed the Mongolian lady to death was born to heroin addicted parents.

    That's not in anyway sympathy. Badness is badness but you would have to wonder with these violent roaming kids, how many of them were born similar and are wired completely wrong. They have no respect, values are are violent and bitter.

    And again that's another symptom of the generational addiction problems that are rampant in the North Inner City.



  • Registered Users Posts: 216 ✭✭babyducklings1


    Thats the problem you absolutely nailed it. No respect anymore. My parents in their seventies now always saying this and I see it myself. Years ago people were poor yet there was respect and low to no crime. Now there is so much aggression and crime is everywhere not just Dublin inner city. There are so many work/ education/ recreation opportunities in this country and yet look at the crime. Hope this poor man makes a good recovery.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,547 ✭✭✭Foxhound38


    That video warmed my heart. McEntee talked about "a response" to the thuggishness gripping Dublin City Centre - that video is the sort of response I want to see. Watch how quickly that disturbance was sorted once the police are enabled to put the fear of God into scumbags that won't live in peace and follow the rules.



  • Registered Users Posts: 483 ✭✭hymenelectra


    Having no viable means of a better future isn't "having it good".

    People inherently want to better themselves. Irish society has essentially destroyed that possibility.

    Put yourselves in the shoes of an 18 year old. For the majority of their cognisant life they been blasted with "housing crisis". They're bombarded with stories of working poor, nowhere to live, can't afford x y and z because of rent, and oftentimes it will be from people who are already several big leaps above them in terms of opportunity.

    The message that has been blown like a foghorn into their minds is that if they work really hard, get through education, then they'll be landed right into the squeezed middle. If they get lucky.

    It's hardly aspirational.

    The place you're born in is all you'll ever know because you can't go anywhere else. Bleak.

    What would you be thinking or planning as an 18 year old in this country? Especially if you're already at the bottom?

    "Fook this for a game". That's what. And all respect and civility goes with it.



  • Moderators, Education Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,541 Mod ✭✭✭✭artanevilla


    Maybe give them a special uniform, maybe something tan or black.



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  • Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,667 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    Thats not what I said - What I said was "Give them legal immunity from being prosecuted for carrying out their job up to a point"

    Not blanket immunity. And either way desperate times require desperate measures. Do you agree with the Garda being prosecuted for the N7 crash?

    How about the Garda that shot George Nkencho possibly being charged?

    This is the sh1t Im on about with regards to immunity. These 2 garda were doing their job yet face prosecution for it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭Augme



    They already have immunity up to a point though. You just want to extent that point beyond to basically allowing them to do whatever they want.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,287 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    Once seen Romanian police in action in a similar situation and these Spanish lads are gentle in comparison but if those had been Gardai , they would all have been immediately suspended arrested and prosecuted .


    in reality many of our more recent immigrants have no respect for our police unless given reason to fear them , which is rare while our home grown or 2 and 3 generation scum have no regard as they know the consequences are minimal. The use of physical force against them results in far more consequences for the person using it than the violence they use daily.


    Irish people are always demanding firm policing unless its on them or some one they know or relate to

    The police in Ireland operate under a microscope in a environment where the government and media seem to hate us and our own management are so out of touch with reality as to be just another obstacle.

    there is occasional public support from people who could be called as ordinary decent people but that is eroding due to ineffectiveness of the force to protect them and provide a service worth having


    but that would take leadership and decisions that would be unpopular with many



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,547 ✭✭✭Foxhound38


    "enabling the police to put the fear of God into/beat the snot out of scrotes engaging in anti-social activity and making life miserable for law abiding people is literally the black and tans"

    Really?



  • Moderators, Education Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,541 Mod ✭✭✭✭artanevilla


    I didn't say that but actually yes that's exactly what the black and tans did. It is not the Guards job to punish.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,073 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    a garda is not prosecuted for doing their job, they are prosecuted because they broke the rules, broke procedure, broke the law, or all 3 or 2 out of 3.

    gardai should never have immunity from the consequences of breaking the law/rules/whatever.

    if they do their job correctly they have nothing to worry about and that is how it should be, the vast majority manage to do exactly that every day of the week.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



  • Registered Users Posts: 568 ✭✭✭72sheep


    A 14 yo attacking a 57 yo US tourist is what it takes to distract FFG from their sacred mission of protecting "the vulnerable groups within our society" and ignoring the reality on our streets. Of course this will be only a temprorary reprieve, normal service will soon be resumed and Helen out waving flags at a parade. Still it's great to see their summer being marginally disrupted and entertaining to watch strong Leo and brave Helen talk tough, LOL!

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/us-tourist-attack-14-year-old-boy-identified-as-one-of-chief-suspects-in-brutal-city-centre-assault/a1262614764.htm



  • Registered Users Posts: 901 ✭✭✭Get Real


    So the chief suspect is 14 I see.

    How the govt can condemn on one hand, yet create a situation that allows this to happen is beyond me.

    https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/suspended-sentence-for-teen-guilty-of-giving-garda-awful-hiding-1091652.html 16year old assaults Garda, suspended sentence

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/youth-17-who-viciously-mugged-14816890.amp 17 year old mugs someone in templebar, suspended sentence

    https://www.irishtimes.com/crime-law/courts/2022/07/26/boy-who-pushed-bike-at-girl-causing-her-to-fall-off-dart-platform-to-avoid-detention/ youth involved in that viral/infamous Dart attack, no jail time.

    https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/teenager-avoids-jail-for-role-in-tying-up-and-scalding-woman-with-boiling-water-1429901.html youth involved in throwing boiling water over a woman, no jail time.

    Plus the hundreds of less "juicy" cases that are in the children's court every week. Not reported on.

    What's the govts answer? The same who are condemning now. And condemned the last big thing. And will condemn the next one.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,735 ✭✭✭✭The Nal


    These are the same 14 year olds making TikToks videos of themselves with huge knives in broad daylight.



  • Registered Users Posts: 483 ✭✭hymenelectra


    There's no need to repeat myself.

    I'm not making excuses by the way, I'm pointing out reasons. Gigantic difference.

    What I will say again is that being on the bottom rung of society is a bad position that leads to crime, less respect for authority and a free for all attitude. Demonstrated time and again.

    What's new, however, is the utterly depressing gulf that has been created in Ireland. Its never been this bad in terms of social mobility.

    Again, as a teenager presented with the options of life in this country, you've got very little ahead of you.

    An aspiration to become a working schmuck paying extortionately for someone else's home while you save a pittance in the glorious hope of having a home of your own in decades time, only to then struggle with the payments of that is soul destroying. And that's IF it goes to plan.

    I'm struggling with the reality of this place as it is, without financial problems. A tiny example was an option to go somewhere else in the country for a two night stay. Just somewhere to sleep while I did what I wanted. Cheapest option was over 500 euro and I just couldn't do it in principle. Total ripoff.

    So for a teenager to hear even the likes of that micro story, what does that inspire in them? Respect and civility and to work hard and to put the effort in for a society that's robbing you blind? I doubt it.

    There's no incentive to better yourself in Ireland because the "better" is still crap.

    It's very easy to understand how the uptick in violence and crime goes with the increasing social immobility of the country.

    I don't excuse what they do. I'd put them in a grave and sleep like a baby. But that doesn't mean I don't understand where this is coming from.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,287 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    in the circumstances you outlined ive come across tow kinds of people produced in these environments ,

    one kind works hard and improves their position and prospects , if that cant be done here they leave and go some where better which is improved by their presence and accordingly their lives are improved also . a hard life but rewarding and progressive


    the other kind wallow in self pity and the filth that surrounds them weather thier making or not. regardless they improve it in no way nor try to

    they permanently have their hands out for more, they claim to be the victim of society while at the same time victimize anyone that they can. they add nothing and take everything.

    one might argue its human nature but we don't have to pander to them just to make some people feel better about themselves



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,395 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    Still this doesn't justify violence. However, sadly the points you mentioned are very true as to the root causes.

    I suppose, they understood that even if they were honest and working hard, they would never achieve anything, - that's the very sad part of Ireland these days.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,659 ✭✭✭John_Rambo


    I don't know all the facts in both cases so I can't make a snap judgement like you can.



  • Registered Users Posts: 34,837 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    Not everyone who is working is a 'schmuck' - there are plenty of people who have careers in well paid jobs who enjoy life, have a great income and a lovely home.

    Plenty of these people have come from working class backgrounds. I went to a community school out in Bray and know a few guys who grew up in dodgy council estates who are doctors, engineers and programmers on great salaries doing well for themselves.

    Not saying the likes of these scrotes should be aiming to become doctors, but this nihilistic 'Ireland is **** so I can see where they're coming from' argument is bull.



  • Registered Users Posts: 62 ✭✭BlueEyeGleams


    You referring to those lads patrolling even rural backwater estates with the balaclavas showing off automatic weapons they produced in other videos? It’s a bad trend alright, I think the Irishmen are dispirited and leaving the gardaí in droves it’s all gotten a bit too surreal they don’t expect to be policing LA especially with their hands tied. Progress is by definition a funny thing we’ve made huge leaps in no time



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,735 ✭✭✭✭The Nal


    No. Im referring to white Dublin inner city kids.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,753 ✭✭✭oceanman


    they sound a bit like Hitlers stormtroopers.....



  • Registered Users Posts: 62 ✭✭BlueEyeGleams


    You should have seen these boys militarised up to the nines frogmarching some lad through an otherwise sleepy rural estate. Fun and games I suppose but those weapons aren’t plastic



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,488 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    Presumably the gaurdia civil would also be prosecuted for attacking the vulnerable person. We prosecute our own gardaí for chasing criminals. Why would it be any different



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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,488 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    Agreed, if you view yourself as enough of a grown man to attempt murder then you de facto self identify as a grown man and ought to be treated as such. But he'll just be sent to a youth centre for a holiday at most and 'more supports' for his family, encouraging further violent assaults



This discussion has been closed.
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