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"Green" policies are destroying this country

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  • Registered Users Posts: 596 ✭✭✭deholleboom


    Make that subsidies and The Science, being that part of science that seems to agree with the Green way which is mostly based on models decoupled from actual measurements. Anyone claiming that 'The Science is clear' is either a grifter or ignorant about the complexities ( and coupled uncertainties) involved. Most green pushers really haven't a clue, either about the climate or about energy technology but that doesnt stop them from flaunting it into everybody's face. They feel secure enough in their pipe dream and are supported in this by the msm.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,550 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    Why is it untrue? Why would anyone who signs a 15 year contract expect to be paid for more than that? If you sign a contract to be paid to do work for 2 years, after 2 years the payment stops



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,787 ✭✭✭antoinolachtnai


    The 15 year contract is not a contract for the purchase of power. It is a contract for difference which provides long term certainty on the sale price. After 15 years the contract for difference expires. The operator continues to sell the electricity.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,109 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Why did you stop at the first sentence ?

    I know we are now signing daft contracts where we will pay for electricoty even if we do not need or use it, but we haven`t reached the level where we will continue to do so or guarantee we will keep paying after the 15 year contract has expired.

    What a private business may or may not do after the contract has expired is a matter for them and will have no bearing on how they price a tender for a 15 year contract. That price will be to cover all their capital costs + their opeating costs (maintenance costs included) + their profit margin over the 15 year term.

    No company is going to price a tender lower than those costs and profit margin based on a hope that they may make up the difference after the contract expires. It`s business basic 101 and if you ever consider doing otherwise you will not be long in business.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,787 ✭✭✭antoinolachtnai


    Heartening that you have accepted that your sentence is untrue. Shame you couldn’t be a bit more gracious about it.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,109 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Shame you only read the first sentence of that post.

    Reading the rest might have made you think before attempting more of your childish nit picking.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,787 ✭✭✭antoinolachtnai


    I read it. What’s the use in commenting? It is an uninformed opinion explicitly based on a wrong ‘fact’.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,591 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    Trying to corner the market with central economic planning does not work for businesses either. BlackRock boss points to ‘structural problems’ in ESG reporting amid rise in attention, Now on the defensive, billionaire Larry Fink (Blackrock) seems to have had a change of heart, BlackRock's Fink says he's stopped using 'weaponised' term ESG. Why would that be? this . . . Saudi Aramco CEO Naser Appointed to Board of BlackRock.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,109 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    If you read it then you failed to understand it.

    A private company tendering for a 15 year contract does so on the basis of recouping all their overheads plus their profit margin during the 15 year period of that contract.

    What profit or loss they may or not make after that contract expires has nothing to do with the price they tender.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,787 ✭✭✭antoinolachtnai


    I read it the first time, but thanks for repeating yourself.

    Are you waiting for everybody to acknowledge the astuteness of this opinion of yours? Waiting for a round of applause maybe?



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  • A sign of this was the by-election defeat of the Labour candidate in London over the ULEZ controversy thats backed by the Labour mayor of London Sadiq Khan. Shows that people may be aware of the climate debate, but if its gonna hit them in the pocket, they are resistant to change.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,109 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    The Tories are crediting the expanding of the ULEZ for them holding that seat, and Labour are blaming Khan`s expanding of it for them not gaining that seat. With the next U.K. general election not due until January 2025 it is going to be very interesting what green policies both come up with in the meantime.

    Sunak, even before these bye-elections, wasn`t in favour of changing, what has been a more or less a ban on onshore turbines, because he believed it would cost the Tories votes. The Tories holding that seat because of Khan`s ULEZ is not going to change his opinion,



  • Registered Users Posts: 102 ✭✭TokenJogger


    Yep, it's more religion than logic

    For all to ponder, if green power is so cheap and awesome how come it needs such huge subsidies, guaranteed price contracts and government intervention by way of policy change

    Why is if that the countries with high levels of green power on the grid also have the highea th power costs



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,898 ✭✭✭Jizique


    The ULEZ was a tory policy, conceived by the ex-Mayor of London, a bertain BJ, who used to hold the Uxbridge seat.

    As part of the funding for local transport in London post covid bailout, the (tory) govt forced the London Authority to extend the ULEZ to raise more money to offset the bailout.

    You couldn't make it up really



  • Registered Users Posts: 596 ✭✭✭deholleboom


    Thanks for that. I think Larry Fink wants to have his finger in every little pie available. I am not sure if he realises that these kind of top down structures are naturally riddled w corruption and money/power talks. But maybe he does and just wants to be able to control things. These kinds of people are super ego driven and can do a lot of damage.

    People used to think communism would lead to equality and the end of corruption, at least Marx did, but it is deep in the nature of animals to create hierachies and we are no longer that naive to think there is an ultimate solution to this. Mitigating damage is all we can do. Starting w tackling Co2 is exactly the wrong way to go about it. If there are serious issues caused by climate change let's tackle them properly.

    There is a lot of nonsense about the heatwaves in the media and they tie it to climate change. And the predictable pictures of old people sweating. Well, southern Europe is experiencing African weather due to a dynamic jet stream. We are to the north so colder than usual. That in fact levels things out in general temperatures.

    Anyway, people have always lived in hotter climates. We are a tropical species after all. But no, hell on Earth according to the media! Well, if you want to protect old people during a heat wave, how about air conditioning?



  • Registered Users Posts: 596 ✭✭✭deholleboom


    People will only support things if they make sense. They see the Green deal as direct measures against them, especially if they are put in place by people they dont trust. And those measures bare very little relation to mitigating existing problems as they occur. They feel forced and see the way politicians, institutions and the media behaves when they are challenged. They go berserk like some posters here. That in itself is an indication that they live in an alternate reality.

    There is a crisis alright but those thinking a top down, police state compliance enforced system is the solution are wrong, have always been wrong and will be wrong in the future. We need to resist.

    In the end we need a diversity of opinion. The Green Way is a dead end street. Their supporters continue to lose credibility as recent elections have shown. They are getting very nervous and do everything to halt the tide against them. They will fail..



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,591 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    This turns into clickbait: With no green way to fly, is it time to ration air travel? (Paywall) featuring, rent an alarmist media commentator John Gibbons and a SKY news reporter who once took a train ride in Europe. They push the growing plants for energy trope and the Greens obsession with rail.


    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Speaking of rail on the continent, Germany are finally investing serious money into theirs with the recent announcement of 47 billion.

    However as was recently highlighted, the fact that it can be more than 4 times cheaper to fly really stacks the deck in favour of flying.

    The sooner we get serious about applying the right level of carbon taxation to air travel the better. That should see a level of rebalancing in favour of more sustainable Modes of travel



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,898 ✭✭✭Jizique




  • Registered Users Posts: 18,244 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980




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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,898 ✭✭✭Jizique


    Reopening a rail line to Clones and creating a new on to Letterkenny will solve all our issues



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,993 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    They don't care, that's the honest answer. If it keeps the plebs grounded and stops them enjoying cheap holidays abroad, all the better. Back to the good old days of flights being for the rich and the rest of us make do with boats and trains.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,559 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    Yes, because e-bikes and scooters are renowned for their ability to cover long distances, especially over large bodies of water, in a timely manner.

    But go on, I'll bite. There's only a finite pot of money available and only so much that the public are willing to endure to line the pockets of the "green" industry. So which would you prefer to see? Ireland invest in a rail bridge to the UK/continent or Ireland continue to pour billions down the drain guaranteeing more wind/solar than we can use (assuming it's available in the first place - unlike most of the last week)?



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,109 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    If there is one thing both the Tory and Labour parties have learned from this Uxbridge result is that while national polls may appear to give lip service to a greening agenda, parliamentary seats are won or lost at a constuency level.

    The Tory party has a large majority which Labour needs a huge swing to overcome. The Tories will not be going into the next election looking to win extra seats. They will be looking to save as many seats as they can. They had, even before these bye-elections, identified that while people natonally may say they are in favour of more turbines, they are vote losers at local level. The Uxbridge result has highlighted for them that many of these green policies are problematic vote getters at local level, and with them really having nothing to lose at this stage compared to Labour, will target those constituencies making it as uncomfortable as possible for Labour.

    It will be very interesting to see what both parties policies will be going into their next general election. Or even like onshore wind, will the Tories row back on some of their green policies in the meantime.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,109 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Maybe I`m missing something in this idea of a rail link between Letterkenny and Derry, but I don`t see what benifits it would have.

    You can already travel by train from Dublin to Sligo in 3 hours. Dublin to Derry alone takes 5.5 hours and you have to change trains in Belfast. For freight from Belfast arriving in Letterkenny, it would still have to be distributed by road, which can be as easily distributed from Derry for North Donegal. Easier for Inishowen in fact.

    From Dublin shipping freight to Sligo by rail can be done in less than half the time it would take to ship it by rail to Letterkenny and the road milage haulage to anywhere in south Donegal would be no greater than that from Letterkenny, in many cases less.

    That would leave a rail freight depot in Letterkenny to service the town and its hinterland. It`s a large town, but no more than that so I don`t see where the bang for the buck of investment would be based on the environment, but then as I said perhaps I am missing something in this proposal.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,898 ✭✭✭Jizique




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Solar figures for Q2 are in. I'm looking forward to watching this gather momentum. Right now we're at 680MW of installed solar with Eirgrid projecting that to hit 1GW by years end




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    The Irish Solar Energy Association (ISEA) recently released a report on the status of solar installations around the country

    The breakdown is as follows

    Nearly 60,000 homes now have solar installed on rooftops. Thats impressive at this stage.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,384 ✭✭✭prunudo


    If we weren't getting good solar results in early June then I'd be asking questions of the whole strategy.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]




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