DCM 2023 Mentored Novices Thread

j2 · 20-07-2023 10:35am

I just realised I think I misunderstood what he said, 2x your half time plus 20, not add 20 to your half and double it. That's a relief!

py · 20-07-2023 10:36am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120873660#Comment_120873660

It's too early to be worrying about marathon finishing times. There are over 100 days until DCM so there's plenty of running to get done before then. Focus on the day in hand, whether that be a run or rest day and carry it out according to the plan.

There's plenty of time to get things wrong too. Two things to do now:

(1) stick to the plan

(2) listen to the mentors

MisterJinx · 20-07-2023 10:58am

Agree with py here, there is a long road ahead, we really don't need to be worrying about times right now and if truth be told, for a first Marathon, it's about getting to the start line and running a good strong race, it's not about finishing times.

skyblue46 · 20-07-2023 3:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120871175#Comment_120871175

Just one thing about doing runs by HR. You must have an accurate resting HR and max HR. If you are not using a chest strap for the max then it's probably quite a bit out.

Runner2023 · 21-07-2023 11:24am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120875960#Comment_120875960

I'm only using it as a general marker together with pace / perceived effort really

j2 · 22-07-2023 12:42am

Imagine if you nut during the marathon?

Lazare · 22-07-2023 10:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120881605#Comment_120881605

I've been perplexed by this question for almost 24 hours.

I don't know the answer.

Or the question.

skyblue46 · 22-07-2023 10:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120881605#Comment_120881605

Carry tissues or baby wipes for the clean up. To be honest I really wouldn't think it's the best place to do it. I'm fairly sure you'd be breaking some indecency law...

MisterJinx · 22-07-2023 11:03pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120881605#Comment_120881605

I've trawled through some of the historical posts on the site but I can't seem to find anyone else posing this question before, is this something that regularly happens on your runs, anything in particular set it off? Maybe a quick check up might be in order, or looser pants.....

Clarecarrick · 23-07-2023 1:11pm

Irish runner 10 mile race report:

Official time 1:23:41

Was conscious of not going out too fast and losing energy at the end, so I was aiming for about 5.5 min/km for the first 10k and then seeing how I felt in the later stages re speeding up. In reality I was overall a bit faster than this, I found I had to really keep an eye on the watch and had to slow myself a good few times but felt very comfortable throughout. Consciously sped up in the last 4k with as much of a sprint as I could muster at the end. Legs a bit heavy now but all in all a great race for me I think and 17 minutes faster than last years Frank Duffy 10 mile. Hope anyone else doing it got on well 😊

MiniMonstera · 23-07-2023 3:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120886094#Comment_120886094

Super stuff! Well done 👏🏽

MiniMonstera · 23-07-2023 3:30pm

Week 4 report:

Completed the full plan - yay! 50.2km

Felt tired this week, very tired. The lsr nearly killed me yesterday. I didn't enjoy one bit of it. My calves screamed for 4km and I actually wanted to stop at that point and do the lsr today instead, but I powered through it. I had old runners on aswell which didn't help. I've been told by my better half that it's cumulative fatigue and to try and embrace the discomfort. (W@nk€r. 😆). I may need to drop back my easy pace further, which is something I'm grappling with mentally. We'll see....

Enjoyed the hill sprints on Weds

Got new brogues - Asics Gel Nimbus 25s. Very comfortable.

Well done to all who raced today!!

Bungy Girl · 23-07-2023 3:46pm

A bit of a mixed bag this week, but still on track so all good. I got 5 runs done (plan was for 6) for a total of 24.4 miles (39Km). I had a tennis match on Friday (we won!) and 2 other tennis sessions during the week as well as one trip to the gym. The early part of the week went fine with 2 very easy solo runs. Thursday was the 5 miler + hills which I had company for so ended up being a bit too fast, oops. Hill sprints went well though 😃. I had planned an easy parkrun for Sat but was asked to be a VI guide so it ended up being a bit of a walk/jog combo - it all counts though, right ? Today was the Irish Runner 10 miler and I had no idea up until this morning how I was going to pace it. I decided to go with MP and happily came in more or less on target (9:04 min/mile average, planned MP is 9:07) to finish in 1:30:48. Massive difference in the splits though due to the hills, the range was 8:46 - 9:35 ! Average HR was 152 so I wasn't busting a gut, but my legs were definitely feeling it towards the end. It's a tough course, I think Frank Duffy might be a bit flatter overall, so looking forward to that and maybe posting a better time there in a few weeks.

Hope everyone had a good week, looking forward to reading the updates.

MiniMonstera · 23-07-2023 8:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120886802#Comment_120886802

Super result!!

Seifer · 23-07-2023 9:58pm

Bit of déjà vu on my side; one 5 km run.

Hip didn't feel right the day after so I didn't think there was any point in pushing it. I know if I go back too early then it'll flare up again and I'll end up missing more weeks and/or races. Obviously conscious that I can only miss so many weeks before I have to make a decision but don't think I'm at that point yet.

Hoping to try get out on Tuesday again but we'll see!

Never thought I'd be jealous of other people getting to go out and run in the rain for 2 hours but here we are.

witnessmenow · 24-07-2023 6:38am

5k|4k|R|10k|4k|18k|R|

I had a decent week, although kind of misguided as, I'll be honest, I didn't go into this week with a plan

Was kind of tore between the HH plan and the plan the run group are following.

The HH plan did seem kind of light on mileage for where I currently am at so I wasn't fully happy with it. It feels a bit of a waste to not try kick on. Maybe I'm wrong but I really don't feel I will have tried my hardest if I follow this plan

The run group plan does have the advantage of at least doing longer runs with people, but I wasn't actually sure what plan they are following. It seems to be loosely based on the DCM advanced plan. I wasn't happy that I don't know what's coming with this as DCM haven't released the whole thing.

After doing a bit of looking, I'm going to go with HH intermediate 1. I know I'm a beginner but it seems closer to where I'm at. I'm happy to run 5 days a week already. Similar to HH novice plans it's nearly all built on easy runs, so I'm just going to take it slow and see how it goes. I'll be shifting everything forward a day so long runs are on the Saturday.

Hope everyone had a great week!

MisterJinx · 24-07-2023 9:25am

Less than 100 days to go 😮 - the weeks are really flying by now.

The weekly reviews and race reports are great to see, and they are very useful for us mentors in identifying potential areas for improvement in your training.

- Did you get in all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?

- Did you run the runs at an appropriate pace?

- Are your friends/family fed up of listening to you talk about running and the marathon yet? 😉

There's no time to rest as we press on with week 5:

As you'll notice, there are sizable increases in mileage for both plans this week, with the Hal Higdon long run hitting double figures for the first time. This will be unchartered territory for those on this plan - keep the paces easy as advised and you'll have no problems. Any queries or otherwise - just ask! Once again the boards crew have strides this week - the majority of the run should be at easy pace with the strides ideally towards the end. Keep the strides controlled - they should not be a flat out sprint. Focus on form, relaxing the shoulders, and importantly allowing full recovery between strides.

Just to refresh you on strides:

Strides are a running drill which will get you used to picking up the pace on tired legs without leaving your legs wrecked! In this case the strides prescribed should be 100m or 20-30 seconds long. We recommend you do the strides towards the end of your run preferably on a flat stretch of even road. These are not intended to induce fatigue, so allow for full recovery after each before attempting the next one. Jogging back to the start after each stride should allow sufficient recovery, but take longer if required. You can include these in the prescribed mileage or you can add them on as a little bit extra - either option is ok.

Each stride consists of 3 equal parts:

- controlled acceleration

- sustained speed of up to 90% of your max speed

- controlled deceleration

The important thing is to focus on form throughout; stay relaxed & run tall, watch that the shoulders aren’t being hunched/tensed up! Remember these are not a sprint, you should feel in control!

Best of luck with the week ahead😀

MisterJinx · 24-07-2023 9:29am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120886094#Comment_120886094

That is a great result, really well done. A huge improvement over last year! Keep up the good work as it is obviously paying off and you are seeing the rewards of good consistent running and managing your pace. More of the same and you'll be in great shape come DCM and knocking equivalent time off your first effort.

MisterJinx · 24-07-2023 9:35am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120886725#Comment_120886725

Super, and he is right, it's the cumulative fatigue building up in the legs. I had an extremely similar conversation on Saturday with very similar grumblings and cursing!!! :-) and my response was the exact same! But very well done on getting it done, it does start to get hard, and it's not the individual runs that do it, it's the runs on top of runs on top of long runs...... You legs are going to start to feel tired, it's very natural and totally expected. This is where a little bit of TLC can help. Before you shoot me I know with busy lives and family and every it can be really difficult but a bit of foam rolling or a soak in an Epsom salt bath can make a world of difference - if you could get the chance and eek out a little time or either or both at some stage it will refresh you.

Great trainer selection, they have excellent reviews and a good pair of comfortable trainers is exactly what you need to get through the miles.

MisterJinx · 24-07-2023 9:37am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120888418#Comment_120888418

It's not great Seifer but it is the only sensible thing you can do right now. You are right, you are not out of it yet, if you are still able to keep up the bit of cycling great, if not then keep resting up and getting yourself well again.

MisterJinx · 24-07-2023 9:55am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120889060#Comment_120889060

Hi witnessmenow, it's a little hard to tell without knowing the details or the plan your group are going with or the one you are looking at (HH Intermediate 1) I do think a HH plan would suit you best considering the injuries you picked up with the speed work recently so it might be the best however is there any chance you can post it or share it just so we can take a look and make sure that it looks ok?

I would agree that an advanced plan might not be suitable, I'm not on an advanced plan myself for example and wouldn't expect to be on one for a little while yet as I build up experience and more leg strength to be able to cope with it.

It's fine that you didn't have a plan this week after your HM. As it was your first and you put in such a big effort it would be expected that you would have a bit of a recovery week.

Sunny Dayz · 24-07-2023 10:53am

Total for the week 41km. Really happy with my activity for the week. Made it to my track training sessions on Mon and Weds. I kinda feel my training plan should have a little Friday run, especially when I usually do my long run on Sun. So I went out for a short run (3km) Fri morn. Then a friend messaged Fri eve to see if I wanted a run and couldn't say no to a bit of company - however we ran the 5km way too fast in 29mins. Lesson learned. Long run Sunday - 21km - half marathon, haven't run that distance since March (Mullingar half). Really happy with that long run - 2hr 18 mins - average pace 6:30mins/km. Probably a tad fast but it felt fine, could have keep going no bother. Pleasantly surprised with my time - my half PB is around 2:08 and pre-covid 2:18 would have been a pb half marathon time! Took 2 gels this time and they were fine. Otherwise I got 3 workouts done and a little walking on my rest days. I am nursing a blister on my right instep but when I have it bandaged up it's fine to run on. Also over the weekend I can feel my right quad a bit sore - again it was fine when running but I can feel it when I'm going down stairs.

The only people I've been chatting to about the marathon are my husband and the Sunday morning marathon runners - so they aren't sick of that chat yet! My mother in law asks after my training when she's talking to my husband on the phone.

MisterJinx · 24-07-2023 11:00am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120889682#Comment_120889682

Great, I would agree, if you are up for it, that a Friday run would be an option for you, just take it easy as your lesson taught you!

I had some blisters last year and got these great yokes in the pharmacy - Compeed - they really work. You leave them on until they fall off and I found them amazing.

Long run sounds brilliant and the fact you felt you could keep going shows signs of really good strength - keep it up :-)

I'm not sure about the quad, although I'm rocking going down the stairs in the morning myself but that is more my achillies. Keep an eye on it.

witnessmenow · 24-07-2023 11:14am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120889456#Comment_120889456

Sure, you can find it here: https://www.halhigdon.com/training-programs/marathon-training/intermediate-1-marathon/

So for example the week this week looks like for me (i've shifted everything a day forward): |5k|10K|5k|Rest|10k|19K|Cross|, It steps back a bit next week

The boards HH plan is HH novice 1, so HH novice 2 is also an option. The difference between novice 2 and intermediate 1 is the extra run the day before the long run. It's slightly shuffled around but other than that they seem identical. I'm happy to commit to an extra day, so rather than making up what to do on the extra day, I feel like following a plan might be a better idea!

I feel like once I take it easy, I can 100% commit to this plan.

The groups plan is off the table for me, I'm not even considering it anymore. I'm not even fully sure what they are doing as the plan called for 16k at the weekend but the group did 18K. I'm sure there will be a decent amount of overlap of the long runs anyways so I'm sure I'll get some social running in even if I have turn off early or do extra some other days.

witnessmenow · 24-07-2023 11:24am

Regarding Friends and Family sick of listening to me talk about, it reminds me of that old joke of

"how do you know someone is running a marathon?"

"they'll tell you"

I kind of don't have a lot else to talk about! Other than work and sleep it occupies the most time out of anything else I do. I think my wife is just happy when the conversation doesn't involve me saying I need to buy something :D

Clareview · 24-07-2023 11:50am

Week 4:

- Did you get in all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not? Just 4 runs in this week (Tues/Wed/Thurs/Sat LSR) totalling out at 41km. Missed the easy Sunday recovery run!!

- Did you run the runs at an appropriate pace? Yeah happy with all the runs across the week pace wise, the LSR 21km on Sat morning was completed at 6.46/km avg pace so felt fine with that!

Will look to start using a gel or two on next weekends LSR and see how I get on with them again! For the early morning LSR's just trying to see what's working with me for fuel for the run so currently its Toast with Jam, a banana and a Rice Krispie Square bar. Find they are not upsetting the stomach anyway..

Runner2023 · 24-07-2023 12:29pm

- Did you get in all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not? Missed the Sunday recovery - cycled to the gym instead. 42km total

- Did you run the runs at an appropriate pace? Yeah, pacing was pretty consistent.

This week was a bit of a slog. I didn't eat enough on Wednesday and struggled energy wise with the easy run. I ended up stopping to pick up some Jelly Tots (sensational sweet btw) to sort me out. I enjoyed the hill sprints but my achilles was at me a bit afterwards.

Similarly the 21k long run ebbed and flowed. I really wasn't feeling it at the start but got into a bit of a rhythm once I got into Phoenix Park at about 9/10km. I'm struggling a bit with a new pair of runners at the minute so I think that probably contributed too.

Not the most enjoyable week but happy I still got almost everything done. Plenty of preparation for the mental side of things too 😅

TheRef · 24-07-2023 12:56pm

From one of last year’s novices, huge congrats on getting this far. Sounds like everyone is doing incredibly well. For some reason, I remember week 5 of the boards plan last year as a bit of a watershed, thinking I was going to go out and run 24km (15m). It sounded mental then and it still does today. Always remember to look back and think about how far you’ve come. My week 5 LSR was done on a drizzly Saturday morning and for the first part of the run it felt too easy. I questioned (wrongly) whether I was gaining anything from it and in truth at the start I felt a little bored. It was the first time I properly slowed down and ran at the pace I was supposed to. In the lead up to the run it was weird to think I was going to be running for more than 2.5hrs, but I’ve always thought of that day as when things got real. Of course the day got much more difficult as I was running 24kms and I remember at the end being so tired and stiff that at the end I felt like my legs could only hobble in a weird way as they forgot how to walk. I also felt quite nauseous at times but I read that it’s quite normal as your stomach is sloshing around for a couple of hours which it wouldn’t be used to. That soon passed though. Somehow I managed to complete the run, and you will too, and I know there are some very serious runners in this forum, but in my mind just thinking you are capable of running 24kms is an unbelievable accomplishment in itself, let alone doing it.

Don’t forget – plenty of water this week and bring what you can on the day, gels of whatever you use to refuel (and electrolytes/salt replacement of some kind), and anti-chaff everywhere. If you can do your run earlier in the day, I find if I keep on moving through the rest of the day, it really helps recovery. Your recovery run the next day – slow down. You’re just trying to get your body and muscles moving to help blood flow and recover for week 6. Good luck, have fun, and remember what you are doing is not normal 😊

Clarecarrick · 24-07-2023 7:24pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120889363#Comment_120889363

Thank you 😊

Did you get in all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?

Yes almost, 5 runs total - the weekday distances were done at easy pace, no marathon pace miles etc, in preparation for Sunday and I swapped the LSR for the race.

Did you run the runs at an appropriate pace?

Yes all runs done at around 7 mins/km I was extra conscious of this knowing I was racing Sunday.

- Are your friends/family fed up of listening to you talk about running and the marathon yet?

Not yet but I haven’t shut up about yesterdays race so it’s coming soon 😂

kevinfkennedy · 24-07-2023 7:29pm

Did you get in all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?

Negative this week. Only 15k !!! Got a slight injury & swelling around achilles so I got it treated on the Monday. Cross trained Mon/Tue & tested it with a 5k on the Wednesday. Seemed ok & then I rested until my local beach 10k. Went all out for that & was happy with the run. Only 15k of running this week with the injury but back to business today after a second treatment. Onwards & upwards. Hopefully that’s the last of it !!!

- Did you run the runs at an appropriate pace?

Negative as I want all out for my local beach 10k race.

- Are your friends/family fed up of listening to you talk about running and the marathon yet? 😉

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DCM 2023 Mentored Novices Thread

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