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Nuclear - future for Ireland?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,826 ✭✭✭SeanW


    Laws can be changed - especially if the environmental lobby stops lying.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Yet there is nobody lining up to change said law

    And no TD or councillor looking for it to be placed in their constituencies

    And no community in the country who would welcome it



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,036 ✭✭✭Shoog


    Two pieces of bullshit going on here - when was the last commercial Polish Nuclear plant put into service - never so any talk of cost of Polish nuclear is pure fantasy land. We all know that cost of nuclear almost never come in at initial estimates so you can put that 2.9Billion per GW figure back up your ass where it belongs.

    Second bit of bullshit - we will be building out our renewables capacity over the next twenty years so any talk of not having the interconnects capacity is still more fantasy land since we will be building out the interconnects in parallel. This will all be achieved before a single watt of Irish nuclear could be put on the grid and way past the time it would make a difference to our climate commitments.

    Whilst the nuclear bugs dream - the future is been built out under their noses.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,722 ✭✭✭Birdnuts


    Fukisha has zero relevance to the European industry for a long list of reasons🙄



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,036 ✭✭✭Shoog


    Nuclear is high risk because when that accident happens it cost billions. Accidents are by their very nature unpredictable, it could be a terrorist attack, it could be an earthquake - it could be anything. Fukishima has everything to do with the problems of European Nuclear.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,722 ✭✭✭Birdnuts




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,036 ✭✭✭Shoog


    In your humble opinion !

    In my opinion nuclear rotten stink will never leave the public nostrils.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    An interesting stat for Germany, they are now getting more from solar and wind than nuclear ever generated




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Well, except maybe Italy, Greece and Romania which are all seismic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,053 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    An epic testament to the stupidity of the German anti-nuclear green movement and the politicians who have enabled them.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,722 ✭✭✭Birdnuts


    Modern plants are designed with any local seismic issues in mind.

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 91,568 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Ah the old mantra of "this time it'll be different"

    Meanwhile 80% of Japanese nuclear power plants are still offline.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,886 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Japan suffered far more from the combined earthquake and tsunami then they did from the damage that caused to the nuclear plant.



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 91,568 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Most of those plants were nowhere near the affected area. And they've had 12 years and all the latest technology to get them back up to code.

    France lost half it's nuclear power last year.

    50% of the new nuclear builds in the USA since the millennium were abandoned.

    Hubris is an underlying flaw right across the nuclear industry.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,886 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    My point is more that people act like it was a purely nuclear incident that caused a lot of damage. Yes, countries with nuclear plants will face issues when they are struck by a 9 earthquake and a tsunami, but those events are going to be a lot bigger of a problem than the nuclear plant itself.

    I couldn't tell you why its taken Japan so long to bring plants back online but France's issues were temporary and during the summer when the demand isn't as high anyway. I'm not a nuclear zealot, but "they have some down time" is a terrible argument if the alternative is wind or solar. It's just a stupid argument, and the only way to move off fossil completely is to build them all.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,053 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    The hubris of more CO2 free energy being produced than from any other source, excepting hydro. Nuclear was green for decades before the first commercial wind turbine or solar array was even numbers in some engineers spread sheet.

    The French reactors were taken offline for some maintainance after 30 years of producing power reliably. 28 years is the complete life expectancy of a wind farm, and those stupid things require a prodigious amount of maintainance that costs 1.2 - 1.4c per KWh generated.

    Your constatnt squawking about a 30 year maintainance issue in France is like you calling my Honda Civic unreliable and expensive to maintain and operate because for 3 hours out of 16 years it was in a garage having €700 worth of repairs done.

    Japan: You really don't give a toss about CO2. The reason Japan didn't restart it's nuclear power plants was that it replaced their output using gas, because it was just so cheap - until it wasn't.

    Japan signals a shift back to nuclear energy

    Julian Ryall Tokyo

    08/30/2022August 30, 2022


    With the nation's energy security under threat and prices rising, Tokyo is making plans to extend aging reactors' lifespans and develop new nuclear power plants.

    Japan shut it's nuclear plants for political, not technical reasons. Turning them back on is more of a political than technical issue.

    No doubt with your technical logic, my Honda breaks down irretrievably, ever time I switch off the ignition.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,156 ✭✭✭gjim


    “The French reactors were taken offline for some maintainance after 30 years of producing power reliably.” - lol. You wanna check the news from today? French nuclear is in the news again because - like last year but for different reasons - about half the capacity is to be taken offline. Anyone with an interest in this subject knows that this is an almost annual occurrence at this stage - when temperatures spike, French nuclear goes AWOL. Back when I was a nuclear proponent, I was shocked the first time I learned of this happening…. back in 2003.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    A near-miss nuclear incident which resulted in emergency works being carried out across nuke plants throughout France is being treated as normal maintenance now, cool



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 91,568 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Hubris. Thinking they could cut corners and get away with it is a common theme in the nuclear industry. Right back to 1942 when General Groves asked them to run the very first reactor for a bit longer. They didn't and missed out on things like xenon poisoning that ended up delaying the Manhattan project.


    At Fukushima Daiichi they literally removed 25 meters of ground under the plant. That's the #1 completely preventable reason that plant failed.

    Fukushima Daini was also inundated and lost all local backup power as well as all but one external link and even then they still had to run 9Km of cable to it. Again seawalls were not up to spec.

    Onagawa was 60Km closer to the epicentre but it survived because they had a higher sea wall. But only because their chief engineer fought tooth and nail against the corner cutting accountants.

    Upgrades to the seawall at the Tōkai Nuclear Power Plant were completed just two days before the tsunami. It was still overrun but only one of the three cooling pumps failed.



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 91,568 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    The French reactors weren't taken off line long enough for proper routine maintenance because cost cutting and hubris.

    It would be like finding brake line corrosion on your Honda Civic Taxi after several years of skipping the NCT. And realising that it means that ALL of the Honda Civics need to get checked ASAP, and then finding that most of them are suffering from corrosion. And it's costing you a fortune because you are contracted to provide a service and s have to pay someone else to carry your passengers.

    The USA had a spate of similar corrosion of similar reactors across multiple units a while back so it's not like the first time it's happened either.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,463 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    Part of the issue with french nuclear is the average age of the plants , its getting up there , and as most are the same design a weakness or fault found in one is likely to affect most. .

    ⁴I assume there are problems justifing multi-billion euro refits on end of design life plant . . The usual life expectancy for nuclear internationally is 30 to 40 years ,

    The oldest operational plant in france is currently 45 years ,

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,463 ✭✭✭Bigmac1euro


    Absolute nonsense graph. Here’s a tv from 1990 and here’s my TV today. Look how much better this newer piece of technology is performing today. I wonder is it to do with the technological advancements over a 33 year period. Hmmmmm



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,463 ✭✭✭Bigmac1euro


    Here’s a graph for good measure.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,479 ✭✭✭LambshankRedemption


    How would a death occur from air pollution or accidents with regard to Solar?

    Short of being hit by the truck delivering the panels.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,053 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    The polution from the coal fired power plants in China that make the energy used to power the high temperature furnaces that melt the silicon and from which those efficient 'mono' crystaline cells are made.

    The melting point of silicon is 1414°C.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,036 ✭✭✭Shoog


    How much is France on the hook for to decommission all those EOL nuclear plants ?

    Why can't nuclear providers secure commercial insurance ?



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,463 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    Shheesh , are we including the mining fatalities in west africa for nuclear fuel , or the blasting dust

    Or the emissions from the fibreglass on the wind turbine blade ?

    What about someone drowning in a reservoir on a european H.E.P. scheme, ?

    Every thing has some effect .. it doesnt mean that two poor effects are equally bad .

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,053 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    What this supposedly CO2 concerned individual is celebrating is the Germans retiring 20% of their energy infrastructure, that's been zero CO2 since before that was a term, and replacing it with CO2 producing gas and coal usage. So instead of using zero CO2 renewables to retire CO2 producing energy sources, those brilliant German Greens have forced them to replace one zero CO2 power source with another, instead of using it to hugely reduce their CO2 output. It's just a coincidence that former german chancellor, Gerhard Schroder, the facilitator of the anti-nuclear movement, has been rewarded with a Gazprom directorship and the massive salary that goes with that.

    This is something to celebrate and cheer by Irish nuclear chicken littles.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,936 ✭✭✭✭josip


    Calcination of limestone to make cement, a lot of which is used in nuclear power plants, goes to 1450C 🙂

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cement



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,036 ✭✭✭Shoog


    There afraid of one of those ancient plants going bang. All of the installed nuclear in Germany is bang up against major population centres.

    But the strategy is leading to overall emissions reductions which will continue to increase over the coming decades.

    They will not reverse course and start building new nuclear because they understand it could not help them meet their strategic objectives.



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