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Nigel Farage cries persecution, nobody wants to be his banker after ties to Russia

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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,826 ✭✭✭✭Danzy




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,579 ✭✭✭brickster69


    “The earth is littered with the ruins of empires that believed they were eternal.”

    - Camille Paglia



  • Registered Users Posts: 82,513 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Honest Q: What portion(s) wasn't entirely accurate? I missed if this has been pointed out with any specificity on thread.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,642 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    I also don't see any banks going broke any time soon, despite the hysterical predictions.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users Posts: 82,513 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    I would probably want to close my business with NatWest soon if they don't sanction or replace the CEO if it were me, NGL. I still remember cutting up my BofA cards, largely because of them being massive twats to people throwing them out of their homes during the housing crash ('go woke go broke' my arse, the banks in 2009 went through the polar reversal), I would just as easily do the same if my current bank CEO was cavalier with account holder info like has been admitted to here, on principle I think it undermines the core of their business model.



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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,642 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Sure but I'd want a better source than Andrew Neil. He's probably not stupid enough to libel himself but still...

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users Posts: 82,513 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    This is the statement from the CEO apparently (with update from Chairman of Board):

    Howard Davies, Chairman, NatWest Group:

    The Board has noted Alison Rose’s statement on the circumstances of her conversation with Simon Jack and her further apology to Mr Farage.

     

    As she recognises, she should not have spoken in the way she did. This was a regrettable error of judgement on her part. The events will be taken into account in decisions on remuneration at the appropriate time.

    However, after careful reflection the Board has concluded that it retains full confidence in Ms Rose as CEO of the bank.

    She has proved, over the last 4 years to be an outstanding leader of the institution, as demonstrated by our results. The Board therefore believes it is clearly in the interest of all the bank’s shareholders and customers that she continues in post.

    The Board is clear that the overall handling of the circumstances surrounding Mr Farage accounts has been unsatisfactory, with serious consequences for the bank. The Board will commission an independent review into the account closure arrangement at Coutts, and the lessons to be learnt from this.

    The findings of that review will be made public on completion. The Terms of Reference and lead firm will be announced shortly.

     

    Alison Rose, CEO, NatWest Group:

    I recognise that in my conversations with Simon Jack of the BBC, I made a serious error of judgment in discussing Mr Farage’s relationship with the bank. Given the consequences of this, I want to address the questions that have been raised and set out the substance of the conversations that took place.

    Believing it was public knowledge, I confirmed that Mr Farage was a Coutts customer and that he had been offered a NatWest bank account. Alongside this, I repeated what Mr Farage had already stated, that the bank saw this as a commercial decision. I would like to emphasise that in responding to Mr Jack’s questions I did not reveal any personal financial information about Mr Farage. In response to a general question about eligibility criteria required to bank with Coutts and NatWest I said that guidance on both was publicly available on their websites. In doing so, I recognise that I left Mr Jack with the impression that the decision to close Mr Farage’s accounts was solely a commercial one.

    I was not part of the decision-making process to exit Mr Farage. This decision was made by Coutts, and I was informed in April that this was for commercial reasons. At the time of my conversations with Mr Jack, I was not in receipt of the contents of the Coutts Wealth Reputational Risk Committee materials subsequently released by Mr Farage. I have apologised to Mr Farage for the deeply inappropriate language contained in those papers and the Board has commissioned a full independent review into the decision and process to ensure that this cannot happen again.

    Put simply, I was wrong to respond to any question raised by the BBC about this case. I want to extend my sincere apologies to Mr Farage for the personal hurt this has caused him and I have written to him today.

    I would like to say sorry to the Board and my colleagues. I started my career working for National Westminster Bank. It is an institution I care about enormously and have always been proud to be a part of. It has been the privilege of my career to lead the bank and I am grateful to the Board for entrusting me with this role. It is therefore all the more regrettable that my actions have compounded an already difficult issue for the Group.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,826 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Yes, it's that basic, the main person Involved is irrelevant, that's just a person, bigger picture.


    The bank with a centuries long reputation for data protection, discretion led by gossip column team.



  • Registered Users Posts: 82,513 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Well, all over an otherwise self-important character with a specious reputation is how it started, a much bigger picture is how it is now going I agree.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,579 ✭✭✭brickster69


    “The earth is littered with the ruins of empires that believed they were eternal.”

    - Camille Paglia



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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,623 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    So the outrage is about the (inevitable) leak rather than the farage not having enough money for a Coutts account.

    Next time it will just be an "anonymous source".



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,826 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Not many bought the not enough money line, besides he was an existing customer, so the terms for new business were irrelevant.


    The approach to him was different and the reason was politics, that's fairly settled at this stage.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,549 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    All of this was precipitated by Farage going public and the story being amplified by his numerous far right press pals.

    It's a total non story that should have been relegated to Page 12 of the Daily Telegraph.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,362 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    You can see he's abosutely revelling in all this and if it precipitates the resignation of Davies and/or Rose I'd say it'd give him a bigger kick than Brexit...



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,604 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    Is it? As far as I can tell he no longer met the business criteria of the bank. Coupled with his political standing the Bank took the decision to no longer deal with him.

    With is different to the story he originally told. So Farage himself seems to have been involved in some inaccurate reporting.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,549 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    I see he gave a long interview to Sky News this evening. He's milking this for all it's worth and amazingly has a large part of the British media on board with him. It's a total non story, but somehow has been blown up to be front page news daily in that nuthouse of a nation for the last ten days or so.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,862 ✭✭✭10000maniacs


    And Alison Rose quits. She definitely gives a toss now.

    If the Farage shutdown of his account was just a cost/benefit exercise on Nat West's part, why would she feel compelled to resign?



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,862 ✭✭✭10000maniacs


    It's the principle of what Coutts has done is what is scaring the media and people in general into action in the UK.

    If Nat West can get away with it today, Lloyds can do it tomorrow to somebody else for some other reason. Maybe this is far fetched but people are worried all the same.

    "I see you were holding up the traffic for climate change last Friday and made me late for work. Goodbye, f* off and here is your bag of cash" .

    Good to see that the Treasury are changing the rules over there. Lets hope they do it over here too.

    Post edited by 10000maniacs on


  • Registered Users Posts: 26,492 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    Because she (a) leaked about it to the press and (b) seems to have done so dishonestly.

    The closure of the account is not the issue. She will never apologise, still less resign, for closing his account; the right of a bank to decide who it will do business with is a hill any banker will die on. But bankers trade on their reputation for discretion and honesty, and in the leak she squandered both.

    The new rules in the UK will not prevent banks from doing what you outline here. They only require (a) that the bank give you 90 days notice of closure (up from 30 days under current rules) and (b) state the reasons for terminating your account. They don't change the reasons that banks are permitted to use (which are, basically, any reason that doesn't infringe the equal treatment legislation). So - subject to the paragraph below - a bank closing your account because it doesn't like your politics will continue to be perfectly lawful in the UK. Political opinion is not one of the protected characteristics in the equal treatment legislation in GB.

    The right of people in the UK to access banking services is already protected by law — ironically, by an EU directive which is still in operation in the UK. All banks above a certain size are required by law to offer a "basic account" which is fee-free and which cannot be refused to any UK resident, except on grounds relating to money-laundering or the financing of terrorism. Coutts is not large enough to be within the scope of the basic account obligation, but NatWest is. Farage can have a basic account with NatWest if he wants, and indeed has already been offered one. If he doesn't want to bank with NatWest, which would be understandable, there are at least eight other banks in the UK that are obliged to offer basic accounts to any UK resident; he can bank with any of them.

    Post edited by Peregrinus on


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭crusd


    Given they reported information they were told by the CEO the BBC have no case to answer here.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 26,492 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    There is a question of judgment or standards. Journalists who rely on anonymous and unattributable sources do have to make judgment calls about whether they will report what the sources say, given that the sources could be lying to them. Most media organisations have rules or protocols about this, which will look at questions like — How credible is the source? Does the source have any bias or interest that might lead them to be selective or dishonest in what they say to us? Can we get any corroboration from another source of what is being said to us? Etc, etc.

    Here, the BBC published a story based on single (then) anonymous source. There was no corroboration from any other source, and the source they were relying on did have an interest in the matter. On the other hand, the source was someone with a professional reputation that depended on honesty, and so had much to lose by lying. And the sources was someone in a position to know the truth of the matter. So, weighing all those factors up, the BBC decided to run with the story. And now its embarrassed because the story was in fact false. This suggests either that the BBC's rules or protocols weren't followed, or that they could maybe stand to be a bit more robust, because an organisation like the BBC doesn't want to run stories that turn out to be false.

    (It would be different if the CEO had been speaking on the record. Then the BBC would have no case to answer for reporting what she said, and attributing it to her.)



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,205 ✭✭✭✭silverharp



    lol , Ferage Derangement Syndrome is a hellava drug, she broke the cardinal rule in banking and probably GDPR too , go woke go broke....


    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,444 ✭✭✭robbiezero


    Her resigning will be dismissed as a PR exercise here, I presume.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,205 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    the bbc undoubtedly employs a lot twitter addled staff who think they are activists, the "story" was just too good. This is going to open a can of worms now about others being debanked for their beliefs?

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,492 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    That's not going to happen since, as already pointed out, you can't be debanked for your beliefs; no matter what your political beliefs you will always retain the right to have and operate a basic account. So, if anybody in the UK is saying that they were debanked for their beliefs, they are telling a naughty fib.

    A basic account doesn't come with an overdraft facility or a chequebook, so it is lawful to deny these on the basis on the basis of the customer's beliefs. I remain to be convinced that this has happened on a large scale but, even if it turns out that it has, that's not a "can of worms", precisely it's completely lawful. And there is no proposal to change this; it will remain completely lawful.

    Besides, the closure of bank accounts is not something to which Faragistes should want spend too much time denouncing as a monstrous injustice. Tens of thousands of Britons had basic bank accounts closed as a direct result of Brexit — no longer being residents of the EU, their banking rights were not protected by Directive 2014/92/EU. No longer being entitled to even a basic account in the EU, they were debanked. If Faragistes weren't fussed about that, it's very hard to take them seriously when they start hyperventilating about Farage no longer having his posh account with Coutts.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,862 ✭✭✭10000maniacs


    She did resign. And let's see how far the UK treasury take it. They aren't finished yet.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,492 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus




  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,642 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Nobody here cares. It's being whipped up by the media but it's not having an impact because nobody cares and this is the case because Farage overplayed his hand. Your peddling disinformation as above changes this not one bit.

    Any change of the rules will be purely symbolic. Nothing will change since nobody has been denied an account because of their political beliefs.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,826 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    It was inevitable she was going to go.

    The CEO of Coutts and the chair are hanging on by fingertips, both will end up going as well.


    Power to the people.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,444 ✭✭✭robbiezero




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