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"Green" policies are destroying this country

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    #24182
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924587#Comment_120924587

    Point of order. The estimated remaining oil in the North Sea is equivalent to about 5.5 months of global demand at current rates. May as well use the existing ancilliary infrastructure and let the UK/Norway provide that than send the dollars to authoritarian states. That much oil isn't exactly going to destroy the environment.



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    #24183
    charlie14
    Registered Users Posts: 15,110 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120923987#Comment_120923987

    I didn`t say anything was buried in the report.

    I said that the authors of the report made it very clear that even after a spend of €36 Bn 90% of freight and 94% of passengers would still be travelling by road. Effectively that spending that amount of money for such an outcome was a nonsense and as a plan it was dead in the water.

    Varadkar then put a stake through its heart, and from Eamon Ryan`s demeanour after the cabinet meeting where he introduced it, it was recieved no better there

    You really need to accept that and get over it.



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    #24184
    charlie14
    Registered Users Posts: 15,110 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120923985#Comment_120923985

    True, I`m long enough on this earth at this stage to know that when dealing with petulant children the best policy is to let them dance around the head of the pin of their own frustration at something not going their way until they get a bit of sense.



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    #24185
    charlie14
    Registered Users Posts: 15,110 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924587#Comment_120924587

    I`d be very much with @marno21 post #25042 on that.

    Politicians will do what the feel the need to do to get elected.

    Sunak after the results of the bye elections believes he has spotted a way to do that, where while many may pay lip service to green policy they will vote on how it will affect them financially.

    Whether he is right or wrong time will tell.



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    #24186
    machiavellianme
    Registered Users Posts: 12,559 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924644#Comment_120924644

    Learn the difference between a statement and a question. I asked a question.


    Your quote that I allegedly posted was made by someone else. You are so confused that you can't even quote properly.

    Post edited by machiavellianme on


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    #24187
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924728#Comment_120924728

    So you're saying that the spend should be far higher to achieve higher percentages?



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    #24188
    Akrasia
    Registered Users Posts: 22,419 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924784#Comment_120924784

    That didn't answer the question at all. Do you agree with his plan.

    Whatever about the political calculus for him personally. Do you think it's the right thing to do?



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    #24189
    ZookeeperDub
    Registered Users Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924728#Comment_120924728

    I didn`t say anything was buried in the report.

    To quote from your own post.

    Would you ever cop yourself on with your attempts at ignoring information you yourself asked for beause it doesn`t suit. It`s just childish, nd you can forget about your pipe-dream of €36 Bn being spent on your rail pipedream. The authors of the report buried it before anyone even got to read it with their conclusions. Grow up and get over it.

    I already provided the multiple posts when you claimed the Letterkenny to Derry link would cost 3.5 Bn which you also claimed was in the report. Needless to say it wasn't

    As I said we have a pattern here. Maybe less of the comment about other posters and concentrate on the content and if its correct or not



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    #24190
    ZookeeperDub
    Registered Users Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub



    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924812#Comment_120924812

    True you did put a question mark on it when reading it. My apologies.

    Am I correct in the assumption that it doesn't matter if electricity is generated from renewable or not in terms of how easy it is to export?



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    #24191
    machiavellianme
    Registered Users Posts: 12,559 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924902#Comment_120924902

    Someone else made that suggestion, but to answer your question, it is largely similar in terms of exporting RES sourced electricity. However there are two additional concerns. The SNSP limit applies for wind/solar exports which means only 3/4 of every 1 MW generated can be from an inverter based source after we've hit the current 75% SNSP limit. This implies that the other 250kW must come from conventional generation. The second issue is in relation to market coupling. Currently, we're only coupled with GB through two intraday auctions which aren't in (or particularly close to) real time. Any forecast errors in wind or solar makes it difficult to plan sufficiently far in advance to export any over supply.

    Thermal or hydro generation doesn't have either of these two issues so are "easier" to export. Other factors such as transmission network congestion may equally apply to any generation source, so I've ignored those - though typically wind and solar are in trickier locations to get the power out of and onto the interconnectors.



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    #24192
    charlie14
    Registered Users Posts: 15,110 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924886#Comment_120924886

    You really need to make an effort when it comes to comprehension.

    I have already complimented the authors of the report for their honesty, and to take you by the hand and explain what you have failed to comprehend, I said the the authors of the report by their conclusion that a spend of €36 Bn would result in such a negligible move away from road usage it was a proposed waste of money.

    Now if you will excuse me, I have no desire to waste my time on providing oxygen to fuel the frustrations of someone that refuses to see what the authors conclusions were, what Varadkar pointed out, or from Ryan`s demeanour after the cabinet meeting showed.

    Especial not from someone who runs around attempted to get others to do research they themselves are to lazy to do on data that they asked for and were given in good faith attempting to discredit.



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    #24193
    charlie14
    Registered Users Posts: 15,110 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924884#Comment_120924884

    What I feel or do not feel is irrelevant in the context of it being a political decision based on a belief that while people may pay lip service to green policy when it comes to political support, monetary concerns will be how the vote

    What will be relevent is if Sunak is correct or not and on that time will tell.



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    #24194
    charlie14
    Registered Users Posts: 15,110 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924878#Comment_120924878

    You and economics really are worlds removed from each other.



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    #24195
    ZookeeperDub
    Registered Users Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925067#Comment_120925067

    I have no problems with comprehension and maybe you can stop with the sly digs on each post.

    To quote you

    Navan being one as has been mentioned here, but when you see the likes of a Letterkenny to Derry rail link costing €3.5 Bn

    then

    I didn`t come up with the €3.5 Bn for a Letterkenny to Dery rail link. That was the cost the authors of this Dept of Transport report placed on it

    You posted multiple times the same thing. Then claimed the 36 Bn was hidden in the report when it wasn't at all. All the numbers laid out for everyone to read as I provided on this thread. See below from section in document. Also every article reports the number. From the link you can see the correct number for the Donegal line from the report. Strangely not 3.5 Bn as you claimed

    I do my own research by the way, which seems to be the issue here as I get the correct information. Anyway thats the end of it. Next time when you post incorrect information don't attack the poster when they try to provide the correct information.


    https://www.donegallive.ie/news/letterkenny-milford/1257819/draft-report-of-the-all-island-strategic-rail-review-puts-donegal-back-on-the-map.html


    Approximate split by jurisdiction In broad terms, the split of capital costs between Ireland and Northern Ireland is estimated to be around 75% for Ireland and 25% for Northern Ireland. There is some uncertainty to the precise split as this will depend on the ultimate routes agreed for new/reinstated cross-border railways that serve both jurisdictions. For the highest estimate identified in this analysis (€36.8bn/£30.7bn), the capital cost estimate for the interventions included in the Review that broadly apply to Ireland would total €27.6bn/£23.0bn. f this investment were split evenly across 25 years in 2023 prices, then it would amount to €1.00bn/£0.92bn per annum (rounded to the nearest 10m). Similarly, for Northern Ireland the capital cost estimate would be €9.2bn/£7.7bn, which approximates to €0.37bn/£0.31bn per annum in 2023 prices (rounded to the nearest 10m) over a 25 year period. ch has confirmed what you are posting is incorrect. Instead of trying to defend what you posted you try to insult me.



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    #24196
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925110#Comment_120925110

    So your answer is not to spend anything on rail then?



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    #24197
    charlie14
    Registered Users Posts: 15,110 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925184#Comment_120925184

    You need to keep working on your comprehension skills as you appear to have missed totally what I said in my last post.

    I have neither the time or inclination to add oxygen to the fuel of your frustration that a €36 Bn spend on rail is dead in the water.



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    #24198
    charlie14
    Registered Users Posts: 15,110 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925315#Comment_120925315

    Nope, and if you read back you will see it is not.



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    #24199
    ZookeeperDub
    Registered Users Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925315#Comment_120925315

    Rail is a requirement for Ireland to invest in. The number is not 36 Bn either. As I posted it is a cross border project so for the Rep at the moment the plan would be €27.6 Bn.

    Based on some reports but open to correction we seem to spend 550m per annum on current. With Capital at circa 1.7bn average from 2000-21. So average of 1Bn per year based on the report could be covered as we are already investing that money.

    Now I have no idea what the breakdown of that money is etc, its a huge report I found it in and I haven't time to read it but just using as a guideline of what is possible.

    If we divert the majority of this average capital spend into rail then we will be able to deliver these project. As mentioned the Donegal line at 2-300m can be more than cater for in the 1.7 Bn average and also help build better relationships with Northern Ireland.

    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925350#Comment_120925350

    🙄 It's not 36 Bn. I even copied and pasted the report section. Its €27.6 Bn. 🙄



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    #24200
    charlie14
    Registered Users Posts: 15,110 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925514#Comment_120925514

    As a proposal it is dead in the water and pretty much universally accepted by everyone as such.

    Whether you wish to accept that or not is up to you, but itdoesn`t bother me either way.



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    #24201
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925363#Comment_120925363

    I must have missed your shopping list for intercity rail that would bring higher %'s, can you link to it, I couldn't see anything.



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    #24202
    Larbre34
    Registered Users Posts: 24,055 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    There will be no rail route into Donegal. Not in my lifetime and that's a good 40 years hopefully.



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    #24203
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925947#Comment_120925947

    As it depends on the cooperation of Stormont and all that entails, I fear you may be right but who knows, with SF constantly growing in the north that may change



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    #24204
    Larbre34
    Registered Users Posts: 24,055 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Its got basically nothing to do with Stormont. This is about economics.



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    #24205
    charlie14
    Registered Users Posts: 15,110 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925947#Comment_120925947

    It`s a complete nonsense.

    Travel time by rail Dublin to Letterkenny would take 6 Hrs and require a change of train in Belfast. Bus from Dublin to Letterkerry 3.5 Hrs from the city and 3 Hrs from Dublin Airport.

    One bus company alone runs 18 round trips a week to both.



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    #24206
    ZookeeperDub
    Registered Users Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925947#Comment_120925947

    A big push on cross border project. To be honest I could see that happening before anything else.



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    #24207
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Letterkenny-Derry is likely unviable without the new 100mph railway from Portadown to Derry as proposed in the AIRR. That will cost a lot more than the Letterkenny-Derry line, and the Letterkenny line is dependent on it really as the business case likely only stacks up if it's useful for Dublin-Letterkenny journeys

    But at the end of the day, this is Letterkenny we're talking about. I have no issues with the place but it's a town and that has to be taken into account. I doubt there are many countries building railways to towns of that size and there's a good reason why. Does Derry have enough of a last mile public transport network to support commuter rail to Letterkenny? How much actual demand is there from Letterkenny to Dublin (or Belfast).

    Interesting to note that NI Roads are dualling the A2 road between Derry and the border. The South could follow in their footsteps but why would they when roads are vessels for cars to be driven by evil motorists intent on destroying the environment.



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    #24208
    Coolcormack1979
    Registered Users Posts: 435 ✭✭Coolcormack1979


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120925514#Comment_120925514

    And the children hospital was only to cost a packet of sweets



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    #24209
    prunudo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,391 ✭✭✭prunudo


    If there really wanted to improve rail usage, they would seriously look at upgrading the south eastern line from the city to minimum Wicklow if not Arklow. Far more trip generators than any Letterkenny to Derry line. Its the pt version of a motorway to every county.



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    #24210
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120926283#Comment_120926283

    Yeah and it would also remove traffic from the N11, which is a) hard to upgrade in the first place and b) said upgrade has been shelved because the Minister for Transport is a tree hugging bike salesman who has a particular emotional attachment to part of this route.



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    #24211
    ZookeeperDub
    Registered Users Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120926238#Comment_120926238

    The childrens hospital was always going to be a disaster once it was put into Vincents. Ask anyone in Dublin and they could tell you that. Getting construction vehicles alone in and out was a logistical nightmare before they even got started.

    Talk to any large construction company at the time and they worked night to pour concrete etc and not during the day because of the traffic.

    You don't have the same issues and we can't tar every project in Ireland with the Childrens Hospital brush.

    The Luas from recollection was delivered on time and on budget in Dublin. That would be a better reference than a hospital.



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