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Media silence over Niall Collins story

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Comments

  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    If enquiring about a property imparted pecuniary/ beneficial interest, EAs/vendors would be inundated with enquirers invoking their rights.

    That alone should tell you how absurd this whole situation is, and gullible you fell for the Ditch’s lazy, poorly researched article.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 87,625 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,966 ✭✭✭MegamanBoo


    Where's the faux outrage, finger wagging and calls for accountability from FFG when it's one of their own and not RTE seemingly helping themselves from the public purse?



  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,185 ✭✭✭hometruths


    If the Ditch had broken the RTE story, there would be no faux outrage, finger wagging and calls for accountability because, you know, Paddy Cosgrave.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,455 ✭✭✭BrianD3


    There's now a similar story on The Ditch about Sean Fleming's travel expenses. As with Collins, a considerable amount of ministerial travel when the Dail was in recess and with the travel claim not correlating (not even close) with the travel recorded in the ministerial diary.

    What's going on and how does the system work? Don't tell me that ministers submit a "figure" with nothing to back it up except entries in a separate ministerial diary.

    When I worked in the PS, travel was claimed using an application where you entered where you went and on what date etc. There were were still problems with people entering where they went but not the reason for the journey. Also, nobody was ever asked for proof (e.g. copy of sign in sheet) that they actually attended conferences and seminars that they were claiming travel for attending.



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  • Posts: 2,725 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Cosgrave is raging because he believes the only journalists in the country covering this are the two he bankrolls. That every other journalist (hundreds of them) are deliberately failing to report on the story.

    It’s real tinfoil hate stuff from Tech Gemma. I wonder is he actually ok these days?



  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,185 ✭✭✭hometruths


    Do you think that these ministerial expenses stories are Gemmaesque conspiracy theories?

    Or the story is simply not interesting enough for other journalists to cover?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,608 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Cosgrave is problematic for many reasons but you'd still like to think that all public servants return correct expenses claims.



  • Posts: 2,725 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I don’t know. It’s more than likely that the reason the expenses don’t align with the ministerial diary is that ministerial duty is only part of the role of being a TD.

    If there’s more to the story then more mainstream media will pick it up. There probably isn’t though and this is just the increasingly irrelevant Ditch throwing mud on behalf of its paymaster.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,339 ✭✭✭alias no.9


    I've come to learn that Niall Collins lives in Patrickswell from the last swing and miss by Paddy Cosgrove. A return trip from there to Leinster House is about 410km.

    Even when the Dail is not sitting I doubt it would be far fetched for any TD to make a daytrip to Leinster House once a week, it's more than just the Dail chamber. Add in a few meetings around the constituency clocking up perhaps 100km a day on 3 other days, it's up to 710km a week times 4 weeks and it's 2,840km or almost 3000km.

    Did Niall Collins really clock up almost 3,000km on Dail and constituency business that month? Fucked if I know but it's not in any way implausible.



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  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,185 ✭✭✭hometruths


    The 3000 km he did in August 2021.

    In August 2022 he clocked up 6000 km.

    He probably made two return trips to the Dail a week and clocked up over 200km on constituency business the other three days a week. For four weeks. During August.

    Some man for one man, but could that be fairly typical of his ilk?

    Totally plausible I guess.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,339 ✭✭✭alias no.9


    The figure above is 3k, if that's the story, it doesn't amount to much. 6k seems high, but it doesn't automatically make it wrong.



  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,185 ✭✭✭hometruths


    The 3k was the second story relating to August 21. The first story related to 6k in August 22.

    While his ministerial diary for August accounts for just over 900 kilometres of driving – he claimed for more than 6,000 kilometres’ worth. The diaries of at least two of Collins’s ministerial colleagues match what they received in expenses.

    Though Collins claimed more than €1,500 for ministerial driving expenses for August 2022 alone, all but four days in his diary for the month were block booked for “constituency work”. Ministers are only to be “reimbursed expenditure necessarily incurred in the course of official duty away from home or headquarters” rather than constituency work, according to state policy.




  • Registered Users Posts: 572 ✭✭✭dasa29


    Ok a Few points TD's expenses were in the papers back in may


    The Parliamentary Standard Allowance (PSA) is an annual allowance that comprises the travel and accommodation allowance (TAA) and the public representation allowance (PRA). Members receive their PSA monthly in arrears.

    • TAA covers the costs associated with travel to and from Leinster House, overnights and, for TDs only, other travel expenses including constituency travel. Senators receive no payments for constituency travel.
    • PRA covers the costs associated with Members’ work as public representatives, such as office rental, leaflet printing and web hosting. The categories of expenses allowable under the PRA vary according to the Member’s role. PRA expenses must be vouched and are subject to an annual limit.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,455 ✭✭✭BrianD3


    This is quite confusing - do TDs claim 1/12th of the TAA for the month of August and claim per km for any other official travel? If Collins' claim includes the TAA then maybe it is correct.



  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,185 ✭✭✭hometruths


    Collins' claim cannot include the TAA because he is not entitled to it:

    Ministers, Ministers of State and the Ceann Comhairle are not entitled to claim the TAA.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,455 ✭✭✭BrianD3


    That could just mean that Ministers etc. can't claim a 2nd TAA on top of the TAA for being a TD?

    We need more clarity on exactly how Minister and TDs claim travel and allowances, Is there a separate system for ministerial travel. What evidence is there to show that a journey took place. Do members keep a TD travel diary as well as a separate ministerial one.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,580 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    No and No.

    But reputable media outlets do things like fact-checking because they have reputations and assets to protect. Unlike the Ditch which is the disposable plaything of a paranoid millionaire.

    The media have been all over expenses stories like this in the past and will be on this one and others, just as soon as they're sure what they're publishing is actually factually correct

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,307 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    If hes proven to have broken the law and filed false travel claims then he should be held to account however that's not what the ditch have done, imo their reporting on this is exactly the same thing the sun did to huw edwards although not as bad obviously. By that I mean they've given only half the story while implying illegality without any proof whatsoever. Like others have pointed out theyve basically just done half the research and said "alright thats enough lets throw some dirt".



  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,185 ✭✭✭hometruths


    The story that they have is that he claimed expenses for 6000km in August 2021. That's a fact.

    They have pointed out that this seems high given his Ministerial diary entries and that the Dail was in recess during August. That's an opinion.

    They have asked Collins for comment to explain/clarify why his mileage was so high in August. i.e they have asked him for his version of the story.

    Niall Collins has thus far refused to comment. That's why the Ditch currently only have half the story.

    This is perfectly normal journalism.

    Just like as happened in the Catherine Martin example.

    The only difference being she gave her half of the story when questioned why her mileage of 4500 km in August seemed very high given her ministerial diary and the fact the Dail was in recess.

    A spokesperson for Martin said the incorrect claim was made in error.

    “The minister submitted the correct claims for the period in question but owing to an administrative error by the department the wrong mileage was entered on the travel and subsistence system when processing the claim. The matter has been rectified.”


    Post edited by hometruths on


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,632 ✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    When Dara Murphy (FG) got away with significant expense fraud, all the other TDs knew they were untouchable. Leo asked him to pay it back but he laughed at us. RTE Investigates did 2 programs on expense fraud and asked why the 2015 reform bill was stalled. They got waffle answers and it's still in 'discussion'.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • Registered Users Posts: 841 ✭✭✭mazdamiatamx5


    Overly simplistic, unless you would say the same about all guards judges teachers etc



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 87,625 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,632 ✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    The man is just another FF crook. Plain and simple.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,960 ✭✭✭skimpydoo


    Hope he is voted out at the next election but knowing how the system works he will come back as a senator.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    Cosgrove has lost all respectability when he lied about nurses dying, then instead of admitting his lies he hid for months. Then made a poor attempt at an apology to all the HSE staff in Ireland

    His gang of roving reporters are not a whole lot better. Poor old Tech Gemma had to kick out his Russian Comrade because it was blowing a bit too much heat on him

    Cosgrove also didn't get the goods from FG after sucking up to them for years so has jumped into bed with SF now. So I keep saying it and would be interesting to see what exactly they have promised him in return? will he get his all access to Dublin and Hotels like he wanted from FG?

    Maybe what the Ditch is releasing is correct and issues with expenses is a huge in Ireland. But people complain about RTE & press been biased and then point to the Ditch :-) Cosgrove and the motley crew are totally tainted. Has that lad ever paid his rent?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Don’t forget to mention the scrot, R Shortall, this pillar of truth ran up €50k in unpaid rent and the LL had to get his court ordered removal.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    Ahh he is more of a Gemma than bloody Cosgrove. Spent the last few years on twitter arguing with himself and now claims to be a investigative journalist 😂

    Before this he was a legal exec, yet no references from any companies after working at it for 10 years

    All of it seems legit doesn’t it?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,415 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Maybe Collins just has more time in August to fill out his travel claims for the last few months and they relate to more than August.

    At various busy times over the last few decades, I have sent in expense claims for the whole year in mid-December.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,455 ✭✭✭BrianD3


    Even if he did that, his travel claims would (or should) have details on journeys - including dates of those journeys. Assuming of course that the claims relate to actual journeys rather than some monthly travel allowance (TAA)

    I worked in the public service and it would be a trivial matter to pick any month, even from years ago, that I was employed, and determine what I claimed for that month, regardless of when I submitted the claim.

    As I said already we need more clarity on how exactly the system for politicians works and more details on the claims. If it is as you say and The Ditch are using the date of submission rather than the dates of the claim, The Ditch is wrong. Another possibility is that the system is a joke with no details on journeys required. Another possibility is that Collins has made "errors" or "forgot" that he didn't travel somewhere - like how politicians often forget what assets they own when making declarations or forget where they live when applying for planning permission.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,415 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    The only information we have is the amount, and the Ditch are making a thing about it, and you have admitted that there are loads of potential explanations, some innocent, some practical and some unacceptable. The only thing we can conclude to date is that the Ditch are biased.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,455 ✭✭✭BrianD3


    If there is a innocent explanation as to why Collins and others have seemingly high expenses for the month of August, all they have to do is come out with a clear, concise explanation/breakdown to show that everything is correct. That then makes The Ditch look like biased idiots and damages its credibility.

    As this hasn't been done, I'm going to assume that there is something more to this.

    Politicians' and public servants' pay and travel expsnses are everybody's business

    it may be that there no actual proof of any wrong doing but perhaps the travel expenses system for politicians is such a mess that it's not possible to determine either way. That in itself would be damaging.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 85,210 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    That's my take on it as well, someone at The Ditch has a personal bent against the guy, made he shot his dog, maybe he stole his parking spot, but one thing's for sure, they're gonna take down Niall Collins like Lewis Strauss took down Robert Oppenheimer for that sandwich joke.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,415 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Why would Collins respond? Are politicians required to respond to every rumour?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    Honestly with the Ditch you are better not to respond to them at all. If you try they are going to spin it so just ignore would be the advice given to politicians.

    The people that are on the Ditch twitter etc don't care what the explanation is. Just the TD is from a certain party and that automatically means they are guilty.

    As we seen before with Cosgrove the truth is not something he has any interest in



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,960 ✭✭✭skimpydoo


    That month of August we were also in lockdown so I would love to see the breakdown you mentioned.



  • Registered Users Posts: 572 ✭✭✭dasa29


    The Dutch are saying the mileage is too high when the Dáil is in recess but would the Minister have been more likely to have been going to the Dept of Further Education, or are they trying to implying that Collins only goes from Limerick to the Dáil and back again unless on ministerial business.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,632 ✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    OMG, that's the best excuse you can come up with? Dear oh dear oh dear, I am pretty sure you will regret posting that feeble attempt. I don't believe your finance dept would allow you submit a year of expenses in mid December by the way.

    Hey....maybe it's expense fraud. Dara Murphy (FG TD) showed them how easy it is. There were 2 RTE Investigates programs showing how rampant it is and FG have blocked the 2015 reform bill on it.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    On expenses, a lot of companies do allow a yearly expenses claim and this was historically how it was done.

    For years I did the same, come 1st Dec pack it all up and fire it in. Nice bonus for the Christmas. Yes expenses didn't like it but everyone done the same

    So in terms of when the expenses are submitted you could see no issues whatsoever with that. I don't know what the government system is but this is still common in the private sector. Unfortunately for me now I have joined a company with a 90 day policy or I need to get an exception. I still haven't submitted anything this year so it will be exception hell for my manager when I do :-)


    Expenses is a problem in the government, I don't think anyone is denying that. Didn't I read about the two boyos from Kerry managing to have the exact same mileage one year. Couldn't even bother to make up two different claims and seemingly drive up from Kerry on their own in separate cars. We had a SF Dublin TD in Covid talking about not taking a pay rise and then having a huge expenses claim. Which like Tubs looked like a way to top up the old wages in the background while telling the public he was in this together with everyone. That's before we even start with the printer

    As I said above, no TD apart from one party will talk to The Ditch because it is a rabble. In reality the government expenses system is broken and needs to be taken apart. Maybe outsource it and give the company the job to check the expenses are correct.

    We also have TD's spending huge amounts of money on printing etc and then not using it. They should be charged for anything they don't use and they might respect it a bit more.



  • Registered Users Posts: 62 ✭✭golfhead


    Ministerial travel claims are submitted on a monthly basis in arrears. Minister (or usually his driver) forwards image of speedometer taken on the first day of the month and this is then used to calculate mileage for the previous month. An agreed % is deducted to cover personal mileage.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    Not all Minister have a government car. I expect this is a personal car which Collins has bought but uses for government business as well? maybe I am wrong on that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,415 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    I have submitted a year or expenses in mid December many times, in fact I once submitted expenses from the previous year in a September. Anyone who worked in any public service situation would be aware of many who have done the same.

    Yes, maybe it's expense fraud, who knows, but the point I am making is that the quality of Ditch journalism is so poor, like unbelievably bad, that they print such rubbish.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,341 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I have also done this (though in the private sector). They're definitely not happy about it but they don't have much choice but to accept it.

    If the expenses are for that month then it certainly seems dodgy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,415 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    I don't disagree with you, just don't like the type of shoddy gutter journalism that the Ditch engage in, makes The Sun and Hillsborough look like cutting edge investigative journalism.



  • Registered Users Posts: 265 ✭✭SnazzyPig


    'makes The Sun and Hillsborough look like cutting edge investigative journalism.'


    Really?

    This has to be the weiredest take in the entire thread.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,307 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Not really, as has been pointed out by many they usually only investigate half a story until they are happy they can produce a splashy headline that their boss can point and cry about, much like tabloid rags regularly do.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    Exactly. Plus before they even start a story they want it to be "FF/FG/Green = bad"

    As journalists they are supposed to be ethical. This is the code of ethics which a journalist should use. I don't think anyone involved with Ditch can claim they adhere to any, maybe they will have a case with Humanity but apart from that it's a clear fail across the boards.


    What are the 5 ethics of journalism?

    • Truth and Accuracy. “Journalists cannot always guarantee 'truth' but getting the facts right is the cardinal principle of journalism. ...
    • Independence. ...
    • Fairness and Impartiality. ...
    • Humanity. ...
    • Accountability.




  • Registered Users Posts: 265 ✭✭SnazzyPig


    Read up on The Sun's coverage of the Hillsborough disaster.

    I'll amend my comment, though.

    Blanch's comment wasn't just the weirdest on the thread; it was also the stupidest.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,415 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    The Sun: Something happens - Liverpool fans are guilty without any thought or investigation

    The Ditch: Something happens - FG or FF TD is guilty without any thought or investigation.

    The only difference is that The Sun acknowledges it is a tabloid, while the Ditch pretends to be investigative journalism, that makes the Ditch worse. It is as simple as that, and that is why the mainstream media ignore The Sun. Actually, it would be hard to make a case for The Ditch being of a higher standard than the National Enquirer. If they ran a story saying that Micheal Martin is an alien that robbed some hick's cattle, I wouldn't be surprised and I bet that half the posters on here would believe it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    I think Blanch's description is about right.

    EVen the rent dodger claims he is an "Investigative Journalist"



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