DCM 2023 Mentored Novices Thread

MiniMonstera · 04-08-2023 2:22pm

I've never considered nipple chafe. It's never happened to me before as I wear well fitted thin sports bras, but I've also never run a marathon distance. Having breastfed my kids I can attest to nipple chafe. Add running into the mix and I imagine it's hideous! Maybe I'll apply bodyglide as a precaution. Is nipple chafe mainly a male thing?

witnessmenow · 04-08-2023 2:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120939144#Comment_120939144

Yeah I think it is mainly a guy thing ok, as you mentioned the sports bra I think solves the issue for the ladies. Funnily enough my wife had no sympathy for me!

MiniMonstera · 04-08-2023 4:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120939350#Comment_120939350

😆😆 oh dear!

Sunny Dayz · 04-08-2023 5:27pm

For those who’ve missed out on registering for Dublin half marathon - there’s a half marathon on the following day 24th Sept in Athlone.

Sunny Dayz · 04-08-2023 5:39pm

What ever ye are planning to wear for the marathon - the next month or 2 is when you test out the gear. Also a great excuse to go running clothes shopping!!

I more or less know what I’m wearing for the marathon!! I’m wearing my club singlet and I’m between two pairs of shorts, leaning more towards one of the pairs as it has better pockets. I even have a fair idea what sports bra I’ll wear - the one that’s easiest to take off after!

MisterJinx · 04-08-2023 6:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120940007#Comment_120940007

Totally agree, now, especially on the long runs, is time to try out all the gear you are intending to use. The long runs are especially good testing ground as what can be comfortable on a 10k can rub or chafe or come undone when you are out for longer.

Lazare · 04-08-2023 9:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120937901#Comment_120937901

That's an insane session, and way way beyond what a novice should be doing. 7x 1500?

What plan or advice has you doing that?

j2 · 04-08-2023 9:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120940872#Comment_120940872

Not following a plan, my dad just comes up with it.

MisterJinx · 04-08-2023 9:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120940917#Comment_120940917

OK, if you are doing the marathon then you need to follow a plan. It's not something you can just do on a wing and a prayer, well actually you can but you'll have an awful experience and probably never do it again and be in terrible pain for weeks after it. Up to you really as to what you want.

Pawwed Rig · 04-08-2023 9:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120940132#Comment_120940132

I'll never forget a 10 mile race and a new white tshirt before I got this memo. Nipples were a mess 🤣

Lazare · 04-08-2023 10:05pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120940917#Comment_120940917

Fair play to your Dad, awesome for you both to have that relationship 👏

Tell him Lazare on boards said his training would have Kipchoge in a crumpled heap 😃

j2 · 04-08-2023 10:28pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120940958#Comment_120940958

It's not completely unplanned, he has me doing 60/70k a week but he said if it's all slow running you'll get used to that and feel like you have to speed up too much on race day so he adds a few speed sessions here and there.

MiniMonstera · 04-08-2023 10:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120940007#Comment_120940007

Yeh you can get really bad sports bras. I had one last year that was very restrictive and bulky - when I did the Tallaght 5 mile I nearly passed out when I crossed the finish line as I really went for it in the last mile and was heavy breathing. As soon as I crossed the line I dropped to the ground and unclasped it immediately. I swore I would never wear it again. I since got some Sweaty Betty bras in the sale (normally 75€ each but I paid 25€) . I sized up on the underband and they are perfect. Sometimes on a very long run I develop an ache over my shoulders due to the cross back straps so have to make sure the strap adjusters are set perfectly. Will really need to nail this for marathon distance.

Kellygirl · 04-08-2023 10:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120941075#Comment_120941075

I find them great too …. Once you wear the same one for long runs as marathon day you should be fine. I’ve been away the last week and only on my phone. Meant to get back to you on the toilet issues MM as I used struggle with that a few years ago too and it’s still a fear all the time so I have to plan. It was a bit of trial and error but for me it works to eat my breakfast n hour or so before my long runs and a strong coffee and glass of water. Usually gets things moving before my run and I’m fine after that. I would plan my route though knowing where there are accessible toilets. I’m wondering if we should look at your diet a bit though? I’m no expert there but I wonder if you track what you are eating for a bit to see if there are certain triggers?

MisterJinx · 04-08-2023 11:02pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120941055#Comment_120941055

Can you remind me of your running background and experience to date? I'm on my phone so it's not easy to look back over the whole thread.

If your a novice marathoner then I wouldn't recommend 10k paced intervals in a marathon block, the marathon efforts will be enough.

If you have a good history over multiple distances and a high overall weekly mileage over a sustained period of time they might be appropriate but not for a first timer as most, if not all, novices lack the endurance required for marathon running which is built up over years of consistent training.

It is great that you have a plan and working on it with your dad but without the details on your history and a view of the plan you are following it's impossible to tell

nullObjects · 05-08-2023 6:07pm

Sorry if this isn't supposed to go in this thread but thought it might be useful

https://open.spotify.com/episode/2AIURupD65cZiM0DwoaS3u?si=BaJUC2BxR_WpQhVkHKmr4A

He talks about Roebuck hill in the pod but he also mentioned they'd be running it as a group in a few weeks if any of you are Dublin based and wanted to join in

skyblue46 · 05-08-2023 9:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120943505#Comment_120943505

My advice would be not to worry about that hill. It's the perfect sucker punch for people who have not trained properly or who have gone out too fast. There are more difficult climbs on the route. Its difficulty comes from where it is on the route. If you run a smart race it shouldn't be a problem.

Kellygirl · 06-08-2023 2:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120943505#Comment_120943505

Just listened myself this morning. Definitely worth joining in if you are close by and it suits. If nothing else you’ll see it’s more of a drag than anything else. As Skyblue says the biggest issue with this hill is where it comes on the route. The first 7 miles of the route are a climb to the highest point of the route. If you go out too fast on your fresh legs then later on will be torture. We’ll be going through all this in detail closer to the day but if you stay nice and slow for those miles and stay smart Roebuck will be fine. You can use it as a nice little break and go slow before picking up the pace going down Fosters Avenue.

Trampas · 06-08-2023 5:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120946234#Comment_120946234

Very wise when it comes to the first 7 miles. Nobody here should be hitting their MP for first 7 miles. I wouldn’t be worried if a few minutes behind your MP. I’d even go to say your bang on pace. You’ve gone at lowest when crossing Liffey to highest point in 5 miles

MisterJinx · 06-08-2023 10:26pm

WEEK 7, time is ticking along isn't it!!

I've seen a notable move towards a truly easy pace for a few more of you this week - great to see, but still please be mindful of it, it's for YOUR benefit not ours. We'll be banging that drum for another few weeks yet (SORRY!)

Love to see the reports coming in on your weeks progress, so keep them coming and let us know whether you are satisfied with how your training is coming along.

Week 7 looks like this:

So a (welcome?) bit of a step-back week on the boards plan this week, while the HH crew will see an increase in overall weekly mileage and LSR distance over the next couple of weeks.

There have been a few questions on taking gels in your LSR here's some information I found!

A marathon runner's staple, energy gels replenish your depleted carbohydrate stores when running. When you run your body uses two sources of fuel to feed your muscles, fat and carbohydrates. While fat is widely available it’s slower to break down into usable energy making it ineffective when running a marathon.

Instead, your body relies on carbohydrates as its primary fuel source. As a general rule the faster you run, the more your fuel will come from carbohydrates. But your body can only store a limited amount of carbohydrates in our muscles, known as glycogen; at half marathon pace this is about 90 minutes of running and at marathon pace about 120 minutes of running. This means the average runner will be running low on glycogen stores about halfway through their marathon. Energy gels contain about 25g of carbohydrates per gel, in the form of simple sugars, an accessible energy source for your body to process. One gel provides about 45 minutes of running.

The perfect time to take an energy gels depends on you and your body. Every runner absorbs and processes carbohydrates at a different rate; some can feel the effect within 3 minutes while for others it might take up to 15 minutes. As your body diverts blood away from your stomach towards your active muscles, your absorption rate slows, or sometimes your stomach shuts down completely; this is most common cause for unwanted toilets stops during a run.

The most important rule is to have the gel before you need it, not as you feel yourself crashing or hitting the wall. Practise with energy gels throughout your training to ensure you know when and which energy gels to take. As your digestion process slows during your run, it’s important not to overload your stomach. Wait around 45-60 minutes between gels, or around 6-7 miles to ensure you don’t intake too much simple sugar at once. Consider alternating between caffeine and non-caffeine energy gels too to ensure you don’t take on too much caffeine. While energy gels are hugely beneficial for marathon runners, there’s no doubt about it, they’re not to everyone’s taste. Although usually water-based they vary in consistency from viscous and thick to thinner but with a stronger taste. With so many on the market flavours vary from vanilla, chocolate, and coffee, to lighter fruity flavours like orange and berry. Test a few different brands and styles to find the right consistency and flavour for you.

Also remember to carry water with you especially when getting used to taking the gels, it will be easier on your stomach.

I've found that a gel every 40 mins worked for me, starting at 40 minutes (but I don't eat breakfast before I run) and I take them really slowly, almost sipping on them so that I'm not hitting the stomach all at once. I also take a few chews (cliff blocs) which mix up the texture, can have a different type of sugar to the gel and stave off a thurst for me anyway. Also it can be nice to just have something different to the gels can no matter what can get a bit sickly imo.

Best of luck this week and keep trying out the gels, the gear and anything else you can think of now that you have the opportunity on your lsr, remember a golden rule, nothing new on race day, so practice everything now so your well used to it on race day itself.

Good luck this week 👍

witnessmenow · 07-08-2023 6:40am

HH intermediate 1 - Week 6

Planned: 5k|8k|5k|Rest|10k at MP|14.5k|Cross|

Actual: 5k|8k|5k|Rest|10k at MP|15k|65 mins walk|

43k for the week.

First time running "not easy" in a month, felt pretty good after it though. A few seconds faster per km than planned so need to work on that.

Easy pace wise was pretty decent, Saturday maybe a little fast but still around the ~7/km mark

So far, so good with the plan. I think the recovery is nearly harder than the running! I've been going to bed shortly after the kids some days!

Start of last week marked 6 months of me taking running more seriously, pretty sure I wouldn't have believed you told me then I'd be training for a marathon!

Next week is a fairly big step up, hitting close to 60km, it will be the most I've ever done in a week, with a 22.5k LSR being the longest distance I'll have done too.

Hope it's going well for everyone!

nullObjects · 07-08-2023 12:19pm

I was ill during the week so I was worried I wouldnt recover enough with the disruption to my sleep. Legs are a bit sore still after the long run on Saturday but otherwise I feel ok after the week.

Boards Plan: Rest | 8 | 11 | 5 | Rest | 25 | 5 (Recovery) |

Actual (KMs): Rest | 8 | 11 | 5 | Rest | 21 | 5 (Recovery) |

Forgot to mention, I started a week late so I'm deviating from the plan a little bit until I get up to the same distance. This week I increased my long run from 17k to 21k (rather than 25k) and I'm planning on doing 24k as the long run this coming week

Then next week I won't race the 10 mile and use that as the week to give the legs a break. Intention is to continue with the same mileage with the plan from there.

Just mentioning in case that's a dumb idea, I definitely don't deviate from the plan lightly!

Bungy Girl · 07-08-2023 7:44pm

Week 6

I had an 8 day week as a once-off due to holidays and general busyness. Should be back on track now unless there's another curve-ball. Did 5 runs altogether for a total of 34 miles / 55Km.

Runs were on target, pace wise. I did find the PMP miles tougher than expected, but it might have been the heat.

LSR today was a slog, but I'm not expecting to be floating along like a gazelle at that pace, just happy to have the 16 miles in the bag. I tried out my new Decathlon belt (thanks for the recommendation) with about 500ml water, 2 gels (bleurgh) and a large pack of jelly snakes (nom). I had a jelly snake every mile from 5 onwards and a gel at 8 and 12 miles. Didn't feel much difference from the gels (I thought I might get some sort of turbo charge out of them) but I used the jellies as an incentive to get to the next mile and the next and so on.

All told, a decent week's training. Haven't even looked properly yet at what's in store for Week 7 !

Well done everyone on getting the runs in

MiniMonstera · 07-08-2023 9:46pm

47th attempt at doing my weekly update. Honestly, 3 young kids at home during the summer, with this absolutely crappy weather wherein you can't plan a thing with them without getting drowned, it's really becoming tiring for everyone in the house. We're all at each other constantly (kids versus Us), and me and the OH literally can't wait each day to get out on our runs to save our sanity. I mean, they are little darling angels whom we love dearly, but also absolute illogical morons.

With that said 😆😆😆 I had another great week of running. Did 5 days out of 7 for a total of 53.4 kms. Had an unexpected rest day as OH worked very late one evening, and I was glad of it. Not going to chase the lost miles.

The session was really nice on Weds. I'm still set on 6.20p/km for marathon pace, even though I've let my Easy and Recovery/LSR paces slide a bit. Easy now at circa 7.30pkm and Recov / LSR at 7.45 ish. I know this is quite slow by comparison to others but I've left my ego at the door weeks ago as I adjusted to the mileage I'm doing. The calculator, using my recent 5km pb, had me at around 7min pkm for Easy, but it just didn't pan out like that, and I'm ok with it. I'm quite risk adverse and happy to slow down in order to avoid injury or strain. The recent calf ache really annoyed me but it's under control now. I'm aware that the high temps and humidity will be causing me to slow down too, so perhaps in September I'll review my training paces again.

The lsr was grand. Got caught in the rain twice, only wearing a singlet, and just embraced it. The first rain left me feeling quite cool but I dried off in no time when the sun started to blast out. Honestly, this weather we're having is almost tropical. I got on grand with the gels but could have done with more water as I only circled back to the car once.

I went to Decathlon this morning (by myself, what a treat) and got the belt. I tried them all on and a size 4 was best for me (I'm a women's size 12, 30 waist). The 3 was too tight and would have been uncomfortable. Also picked up a fabulous pair of shorts with 7 pockets. I'm not sure they're compression but still skin tight, and I would say 2/3rds down the thigh in length, so hopefully no chafe. I always size up in Decathlon so got a large. They really tick every box and have a drawstring too for fluctuating belly size. I got a soft water bottle and some gels to try out too. So on the next lsr I won't have the water shortage issue, and may not circle back to the car at all.

One thing I'm noticing lately is I'm eating more crap, especially post run. If anyone has any good tips to avoid the sugar bingeing, maybe some nutrient dense and satiating post run meals, send them my way. I have quite a healthy diet, but since training commenced I'm reaching for the treats more and more, and want to get the balance right.

Kids are in camp from tomorrow so hopefully get my running in earlier in the day than is usual for me!

Hope everyone is doing well ! 👏🏽

MiniMonstera · 07-08-2023 10:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120941103#Comment_120941103

Ah thanks so much for this. Unfortunately, I think the problem goes beyond diet for me. They're calling it "urgency incontinence", that is the gastro guy and his team who did the colonscopy. I'm back with him in early Sept, 8 weeks post op. My issue is not being able to hold it in and only having seconds to basically not sh1t myself. It's also not limited to running. For example it happened today in Decathlon changing room (as in, almost) and I nearly started to cry. Abandoned my basket of clothes and just made it to loo, thankfully. I was soaking wet with sweat from the anxiety of the whole ordeal.

I have one milky (but strong) coffee a day, which I'd be very reluctant to give up as I don't drink alcohol (well, very rarely) and am a good eater. I have no gastro issues e.g. ibs etc. So I'm just not convinced that dietary changes would solve the issue, but I'm open to all and any proposals, as I'm becoming quite despaired by it. I told my OH its the thing that will end the marathon for me. I'll be DNFing it for sure if I sh1t myself - I am NOT that hero who'll run multiple kms with sh1t in their jocks. I'm just not.

🤣 but also 😭

And sorry to everyone for all this frank bowel talk but it's the biggest hurdle in my head atm for completing this thing. Feel free to scroll on by 😃🥰 no hard feelings

Lumen · 07-08-2023 10:42pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120950577#Comment_120950577

One thing I'm noticing lately is I'm eating more crap, especially post run. If anyone has any good tips to avoid the sugar bingeing, maybe some nutrient dense and satiating post run meals, send them my way. I have quite a healthy diet, but since training commenced I'm reaching for the treats more and more, and want to get the balance right.

Perversely I have found that eating a pack of clif blocks immediately post-run kills my appetite completely by the time I get home.

That aside, my standard post-run feed is scrambled eggs on toast, followed by greek yoghurt with fruit and lots of mixed nuts. It's the protein that kills appetite. You can boost the effect by drinking loads while you're prepping food, stretches the stomach which is one hunger-suppressing signal. By the time that effect wears off the protein has kicked in.

I'm totally in awe of people marathon training over the summer hols with kids around. A testament to a solid partnership I'm sure!

I was also in Decathlon late morning and bought some of the same stuff 😀 Annoyingly they don't stock the toe socks I wanted in physical shops so I had to make do with their mid-range conventional running ones.

witnessmenow · 07-08-2023 11:07pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120950577#Comment_120950577

I think you and your husband have it all wrong, send the kids out running the LSR and enjoy the peace!

I only have 2/3 of the challenges you do at at home, but the way I have found best to handle it is do my runs early in the morning. Typically I'm trying get back for 8am when the house starts properly waking up. I understand it doesn't suit everyone for lots of reasons and I am also fortunate that my work doesn't start very early either.

Regarding food/snacking, it's tough! I think the best way to handle it is to be very organised to what your having for your main meals and when. And don't be afraid to increase the quantity of your main meals a bit, especially throw some extra veg or something on the plate as you cant really eat too much of that.

I find on days like today, where we are busy doing other things, I end up snacking the most because I didn't get a proper meal at 5 or 6 o'clock when we usually eat dinner.

I have also started taking a whey protein shake on days I run more than 10k. Apparently the protein will help keep you fuller , and if you use water, it's relatively low calorie (I use semi skimmed milk, which makes it a bit of a meal in itself!)

I'm not sure it keeps me fuller, I don't seem to be as snacky on the days I have it. It sort of hits that "treat" spot for me, I have vanilla ice cream flavour.

Do note that some people find whey powder makes them more gassy, I haven't found that to be the case for me, but worth considering before you decide to take it.

Another thing I do is to have really dark chocolate here, like 85% stuff. I like a small bit of it as a treat, but there is not a hope I'm polishing off the bar or anything like I might with milk chocolate

Kellygirl · 08-08-2023 8:19am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120950643#Comment_120950643

Ah that’s a disaster alright. It’s pretty much dietary for me. I tend to stick more to white bread / pasta / rice and not each too much fruit or fibre type foods the few days before long runs. Too much sugar or crappy food add to the problem too. I’ve no idea what to suggest for you though. However, there are loads of bathrooms along the route for Dublin and I’m almost sure they are marked on the map beforehand. I must go look. I don’t think you’ll need to worry on the day at all.

Kellygirl · 08-08-2023 8:29am

In terms of the post run munchies, I used be terrible my first time round for this and managed to pile on 17lbs for my first marathon. Talk about not being able to out run a bad diet! I’d always have food in the car for after my run or ready at home if that’s where I finish. A fulfil bar or chocolate protein milk is very handy on the go. I used make my own chocolate milk in a flask with ice to keep it cool and a little cinnamon. Sometimes I’d have egg muffins made for after or baked oats …. Though that’s usually what I eat beforehand. Even having a sandwich made. Protein is definitely key. Eating well the few days before the run and having your gels or whatever during the run help too though. I’ve loads of recipes I can share for energy balls and stuff like that so you feel you are having a treat and rewarding yourself after but it’s good food. I have to fly now but can share more later.

Clareview · 08-08-2023 11:03am

Week 6 (31st - 6th Aug)

Quick recap on Week 6 (wtf 😮) to keep me accountable on here..

- Did you get in all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not? 6 runs in this week: easy recovery run Monday / as per plan for Tues/Wed/Thurs/Sat LSR, and another short recovery run Sunday, totalling out at 57km for the week.

- Did you run the runs at an appropriate pace? Yeah happy with all the runs midweek pace wise; Ran the PMP section on the wednesday session at 6.22/km pace and felt grand. The LSR 26km on Sat morning I completed at 6.47/km avg pace and felt good for the most of it. Got some water, drop of lucozade sport and half a banana on board after 16km or so with a very swift stop by the car and def helped with energy for the last few couple KM's. Got warm quickly after all the wind and rain!!

DCM 2023 Mentored Novices Thread

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