Kildare-Newbridge-Naas Transport

TravelCounty · 08-08-2023 10:52am #1

The combined populations of the Kildare-Newbridge-Naas (+ smaller towns in between) area is just over 78k and large amounts of development is continuing. It's a large area with a lot of car travel between them for various reasons. However, getting between the areas is poor.

Currently, it's served by two buses - the 126 (PSO - GoAhead) and the 726 (Dublin Coach). The train also serves Kildare, Newbridge and Sallins - the latter being poorly connected to Naas and similarly, the former not having great connections to the towns either. The pricing for rail travel between these areas is also ridiculous due to Sallins being in the SHZ and the other two not (a separate issue).

While the 126 is fairly good, it suffers from a few issues:

It isn't the most punctual
The ticketing is slow (no Leap validators + the fare system wouldn't allow for them) - if a crowd gathers it could be quite some time before setting off
Often, people leave and enter the bus through the same door - it makes for a fairly slow process (often coach style busses)

I feel little is done about it because, on paper, there are two busses serving the area, however Dublin Coach's 726 is extremely poor and cannot be relied upon (+ it has less stops).

Also, these routes go through the centre of the towns and getting to the outer edges (where often the amenities are) is long. By now, a very large portion of the populations are a good 25-30min walk away from the centres.

What would people think the best way to help alleviate some of these issues would be? Perahps a mixture of town busses in the separate centres and then keeping the other busses as they are?

hero001 · 08-08-2023 2:01pm

Although the infrastructure of Kildare has come a long way since I moved there 20 years ago, it is still a very car-dependent county.

As you point out, the few bus routes that we have, go through the centers of the main towns, and have not been altered to take account of the growth of the towns. The last 126 GoAhead services out of Dublin is now 01:05, compared to 23:00 when Bus Eireann operated that route, so that is a big help to anyone going to Dublin for the night. The last train is however still 23:10, from Heuston, so if you are at an event in Dublin city centre which ends after 22:30, you are not going to make the last train home. There can also be 3 hour plus gaps in the train timetable on Sundays, which puts people off using the service.

There have also been some new Locallink routes added from Sallins station to link some of the surrounding towns such as Carragh and Blessington. There is also the 139 route from Naas to Blanchardstown via Clane, Maynooth, and Lexlip. The 139 service is popular despite the fact that it only runs every 2 hours and takes over 1 hour 30 minutes to complete its journey.

Tomrota · 08-08-2023 2:18pm

If I were KCC attempting to alleviate the situation I would tell the NTA the following:

- To address the needs of the area effectively, a BusConnects-style plan is essential for Kildare. Despite having a population of 250,000, the public transport in Kildare is severely lacking. The existing system consists of a confusing mix of private operators, disconnected PSO bus routes, varying fare structures, and illogical setups. Amazingly the two largest towns within the county (Naas and Newbridge) lack any PSO bus connections to/from the train station. The N7 experiences peak-time congestion that surpasses other arterial roads. As a result, there's an urgent need to alleviate the strain on this road and car dependency in the area.

- My first proposal for this new plan would be the elimination of Route 126 (or its downsizing), replaced by a new key arterial route connecting Newbridge to the city center. Additionally, I would suggest a second parallel arterial route, mirroring much of Route 126, but with a focus on servicing Newbridge-Naas-Kill and terminating at Citywest/Tallaght instead of the city center. For trips to Dublin City centre, the emphasis should shift to rail connections for Kildare town. A seamless transition from Kildare station to home, work or Kildare Village via a high frequency local bus route should not be a fairy tale - it should be a reality.

- The new arterial routes would serve as the backbone for a series of local bus routes in Naas, Newbridge, and Kildare. These localised routes would cater to local accessibility requirements, placing a strong emphasis on high-frequency services to/ from Newbridge and to/from Sallins train station. These routes would address various local needs such as commuting to work, school transport, hospitals/healthcare, and shopping. It's a disgrace that neither station is currently served by any frequent PSO routes (I haven’t determined if that’s pure incompetence by the NTA or if there is something more to it). Within Naas/Sallins, three high-frequency local bus routes are more than justifiable, with another two/three in Newbridge and one in Kildare. Route 139 would undergo a complete rebranding, transforming it into a high-frequency service with integrated fares. With integrated fares, route 139 could now be used as a bus to commute to Sallins train station. Exploring additional local bus routes for rapidly growing areas like Clane should also be considered.

- The successful execution of this plans hinges on the expansion of DART services to Kildare. Maintaining the current rail frequency and capacity would undermine the entire plan as despite current barriers of accessibility to Sallins train station, trains are consistency overcrowded as things stand. Given that the DART extension is reaching Drogheda and deep into Wicklow, there should be ample justification to extend it to Kildare, encompassing Naas, Sallins, and Newbridge. This would also benefit rapidly growing surrounding areas such as Clane, Kill, Kilcullen, and more.

- Achieving seamless connectivity and accessibility requires the implementation of fare integration across all these routes and with rail. Applying the 90-minute fare to all of the above mentioned would allow accessibility, eliminate fare-related penalties, and facilitate effortless transfers between arterial routes, local routes, and trains. In other words, it would get people onto public transport.

-(Unsure about how feasible this would be however…) Another smart move would be to consider converting Route 726 into a PSO route from Newbridge to Dublin Airport via the red cow. This would complete the trio of arterial routes from Newbridge. This well-coordinated network would make sure that the entire region enjoys a robust, interconnected system that's ready to bring thousands of individuals from their cars and onto the public transport system. The positive impacts on both the community and the environment would be substantial, and that's not even factoring in the countless of other advantages it brings to the table.

Making sure that Newbridge and Naas are easy to get around within is a must, but it's also super important to have good connections outside for things like school, shopping, the hospital, work, and university. That's why I came up with the idea to extend another part of Route 126 to finish up at Citywest/Tallaght. This could help take some pressure off the busy N7, especially since a lot of folks travel there for work, TUD university, the hospital, and shopping. It would also open the door to even more connections. And just to make sure it all works smoothly, fare integration is beyond crucial in this plan

TravelCounty · 08-08-2023 3:13pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120952556#Comment_120952556

Definitely improving. I think it's a bit disappointing to see a bit of a fracture between North and South Kildare. Especially as Kildare-Newbridge-Naas are sold to people as Dublin commuting towns so expect a lot more pressure on N7/trains/busses. Maynooth/Celbridge/Leixlip have a fairly good system now (C3/4/5/6, W61, L routes, planned DART line), though I understand that's mostly to do with BusConnects and being much closer to the city centre.

Local Link is definitely a welcome addition. 139 is a route that definitely should be more frequent/expanded. It sees a lot of users that want to go to Maynooth University from Kildare/Newbridge as there's no direct links to there (although train to Hazelhatch and Celbridge then W61 to Maynooth is now a possibility - but again, no integrated fares).

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120952668#Comment_120952668

A bus route terminating in Tallaght would be very beneficial. I often wonder about the feasibility of a 'Dublin Bus' style route that would go through to Kill, then onto Rathcoole through to Tallaght, though I'm not sure if people would be happy about the potentially longer journey. Getting to Tallaght currently involves a trip on the dreaded 726 then backtracking via Luas to Tallaght.
DART expansion to Kildare Town is something I'm surprised there's a bit of division over. An extension to Wicklow is planned even though it would serve a much smaller population, and DART+ Coastal North to Drogheda would serve a similar population as the combined Kildare/Newbridge/Naas population.
Similarly, expansion of the Short Hop Zone is a controversial topic. I do understand that there needs to be end to it but I do think an exception for Kildare and Newbridge is justified. Even a Medium Hop Zone would be acceptable, the lack of Leap and 90 min fare is the more pertinent issue.
Local bus routes that are frequent (even every 30 mins) is a must, akin to what's being implemented in Carlow and Athlone. Unfortunately, seems like it could be some time before town busses will be rolled out here. Sallins station to Naas should be the priority, I could see the appeal for travelling to Naas via train to Sallins + local bus to Naas, but just not feasible at the moment.

TravelCounty · 09-08-2023 1:45pm

If anyone is interested, here's just some of the routes I think would be badly needed. The Naas routes are adapted from these good proposals (Naas Town Bus Services - A Proposal)

New 126 (or differently numbered route) - Newbridge to Tallaght

Serves the centres of Newbridge, Naas and Kill, then heading onto the N7 to go to Saggart (and Luas), CityWest and Tallaght. Perhaps encouraging more city centre directed traffic onto trains (though a more infrequent 126 that exists now could still be in use, or maybe later in the evening similar to how the C3/4 and C5/6 work). The new 126 would be very useful in terms of getting around the suburbs of Dublin. Currently, going all the way to the city centre to go back again is a time consuming and transfer-heavy approach.

If it had integrated fares, it would also be of benefit in an additional bus for commuting in these Dublin suburbs (e.g. Saggart to TUD, etc.)

The 126 as it is could still exist but perhaps to a limited capacity.

NAAS

NS1 - Sallins Station to Newhall Retail park

From Sallins train station, cutting through Monread down Sallins Road to the town and then onwards to Newhall.

NS2 - Globe Retail Park - Millennium Business Park - Sallins Station - Newhall - South Ring

Orbital route connecting Blessington Road/South Ring to the train station and various business parks.

NS3 - Piper's Hill to Sallins Station

Connects the newly developed area at Piper's Hill to Sallins Station via the Sallins Bypass.

139 - Naas to Blanchardstown

Remain much the same, except starting at the Blessington Road end of Naas where much development is ongoing. Would have to be more frequent and integrated.

The integration with rail would make train travel to Naas from other Kildare towns (like Celbridge, Newbridge, Kildare, Monasterevin) viable.

NEWBRIDGE

NB1 - Old Connell Weir to Athgarvan

Goes to the train station and loops around to head back into the town. The placement of the train station makes it hard to access without doubling back. Continues to Athgarvan serving the highly populated and poorly connected Athgarvan Road

NB2 - Roseberry to Curragh Camp

Served the Roseberry area and the train station heading into older estates and through the town onwards towards the Curragh.

DUBLIN COACH'S 726

The 726 could continue to exist as a way to go to the airport via Red Cow Luas. It serves as a very last resort solution to get from Dublin to Kildare when other options aren't available (perhaps G1 bus could be scheduled to arrive at Red Cow Luas before 726 departs later at night).

Not sure if these would be useful routes, but I think they would be somewhat helpful in rectifying the lack of KCC/NTA transport investment in this region of Kildare.

LXFlyer · 09-08-2023 2:10pm

There is the rail feeder bus between Sallins station and Naas.

The full timetable is at the bottom of the rail timetable pdf along with the list of stops.

https://www.irishrail.ie/IrishRail/media/Timetable-PDF-s/Heuston-timetables/16-Dublin-Portlaoise-%28from-8th-August-2023%29.pdf

Other improvements in bus services will come from the NTA Connecting Ireland project. The 139 is due to be enhanced this year.

Fares are being reviewed with the NTA National Fares Strategy to start being implemented from the end of 2023.

The 726 is a commercial bus service and when and where it operates is entirely down to the private operator concerned. Routes do not just get “converted to PSO”. That operator clearly feels it makes an adequate profit from it and unless they change their minds, then that’s that.

Introducing a subsidised bus route on the exact same route as a commercial operator is a non-starter as it would constitute unfair competition. Any PSO bus would have to differ from the 726 (like the 126 does).

TravelCounty · 09-08-2023 3:03pm

Of course, definitely great improvements in the works and recognise that drivers, busses, etc. cannot be produced out of thin air. The National Fare Strategy is welcome but definitely beginning to stall already. I guess my main point is that while there are enhancements coming for this area, it's very fragmented and fails to recognise that the towns have grown beyond the centres.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120956597#Comment_120956597

I'm sure the routes I have up there have all sorts of caveats in them (and probably nonsensical in some areas). Just out of interest would you think a bus route that terminates in Tallaght would be unfair competition? 726 operates non-stop from Naas to Red Cow Luas and then to the airport (+ originates in Portlaoise). Not too familiar with all this stuff so never gave that too much thought.

LXFlyer · 09-08-2023 3:39pm

The fares strategy isn’t stalling.

The next fares determination report isn’t due to be published until after the budget in October, and to be implemented from either December or January.

It has to be budgeted for.

TravelCounty · 09-08-2023 4:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120956956#Comment_120956956

The National Fare Strategy (https://www.nationaltransport.ie/wp-content/uploads/2023/04/20230109_National-Fare-Strategy-Summary_v3.1.pdf) does mention that the Fares Determination were due for publication by the end of Q2 2023 (June 30th).

It is anticipated that the first phase of implementation will be undertaken in late 2023, following the NTA’s Fare Determination due to be published in Q2 2023.

The current response from the NTA is that this should now be 'in the coming month'. However, you are right that implementation was not due until 'late 2023' so it wasn't particularly fair of me to say it's stalling when we're not there yet.

Kildare-Newbridge-Naas Transport

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