Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Peter McVerry Trust has 'financial issues'.

2456713

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,638 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Actually, it tells you an awful lot, you get a very clear idea of the commission that they pay the chuggers and others who collect money on their behalf. You are lucky if 60% of what you donate to a chugger makes it to the organisation, and after that, there is the money that is spent on administration, on lobbying and on marketing.

    In some cases, it seems to me that the donated element is spent on administration, commission, lobbying and marketing, and it is only the government grants that actually get spent on what they should be spent on, presumably because the C&AG will come after them for that.

    Wouldn't give a penny to any of the big charities.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,638 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    I know St. Francis Hospice, a small and excellent charity, and the other one, where you know and trust the people is worth donating to.

    However, if you know a charity from their own publicity, like Trocaire, Concern, Goal, PMVT, Simon Community, SVDP etc., don't bother giving them anything.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,412 ✭✭✭corner of hells


    Especially those fuckers in the RNLI or ONE and definitely that shower DEBRA.

    Guess what charity I work ?

    “posting from my holiday home in the Caribbean “.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,125 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    I doubt it.

    I've had the opportunity to closely observe housing officers working for one of the big-five NGO non-profit housing organisations. They worked a LOT harder than any council worker I've ever seen.

    Councils are restricted by in what they can do by the Public Finance Act etc -private organisations have a lot more leeway. Arguably we'd get better value by handing over all the council housing to a non-peofit organisation.

    Operationally, it makes sense to have two organisations operating in each area: troublesome tenants can be evicted from one and housed by the as a "last resort": if there's only one organisation then eviction is meaningless because the same people have to rehouse you.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,412 ✭✭✭corner of hells


    That’s exactly what happens in hostels , if you’re troublesome I.e. aggressive, not paying rent , not engaging around care plans you’ll be swapped between the likes of Focus , Simon etc



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 651 ✭✭✭cheese sandwich


    McVerry was shouting recently that Ireland was a failed state.

    Not so failed that it can’t give his charity 50m a year though



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,998 ✭✭✭griffin100


    I remember him saying that the government had judges sending people to jail to lower the homelessness figures. He’s Paul Murphy in a cassock.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,659 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    I am sure it will be much better run and better value when its take over by the HSE or housing department or various councils :)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 60,969 ✭✭✭✭Agent Coulson


    The local councils admit they are aren’t experts when it comes to dealing with homelessness and they along HSE fund PMVT and the other homeless charities to the tune of millions a week because they call themselves the experts in dealing with homelessness.

    They aren’t they just want to get their foot in the door and become landlords these charities want a revolving door of homelessness to keep that money flowing.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 779 ✭✭✭RonanG86


    De Paul are getting over €1m via the Council and the HSE to run a homeless hostel in one county. Can't be more exact cos I don't work in that area anymore.

    Housing Charities are basically a product of the government farming out their responsibilities re: Housing and Homeless Accommodation to the private sector in the 2000s and 2010s. Ditto the Housing Association Sector (Cluid, CHI etc.)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,730 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    And huge amounts of mental health, disability care etc charities also doing the HSEs work.

    The funding going to these gets thrown in to the "NGO" bucket in the over-simplistic reporting that makes up most Irish media; which feeds conspiracy theory loons thinking that that's all going to foreign aid charities etc.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,537 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    The “charity NGO” scam is a runaway train in Ireland- all with taxpayer’s money on board, burned through at a rate of knots with very very questionable “outcomes”. For me, it’s one of the national scandals of our time



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,730 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    All done to keep the figures - and more importantly, the responsibility - on someone else's books.

    That court cases that stopped the state blaming the patrons of schools for sexual abuse liability should have been enough to stop this charade dead though. But it wasn't somehow



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,459 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    110k is bugger all for a CEO of a medium sized property development firm, which is what these basically are.


    110k would be great for a well qualified person with good experience and knowledge

    I don't think you man would have been competing for any C suite role in the real world though based on his CV


    You asked who would do it on a voluntary basis? I'd say a few well-off retirees would. It wouldn't be difficult to find one with the same level of credentials as your man apparently has



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,786 ✭✭✭DownByTheGarden


    A good few years ago my nephew got a job as a chugger for 2 weeks before he was let go for not making his sales.

    If I remember correctly he told me he was getting €11 an hour at the time, but he had to make an average of 6 DD sign ups per day each week or he was let go. He made 6 in week opne and 2 in week 2 and was asked to go. He was sick of it at that point anyway. Said he just felt he was conning people out of their money.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,638 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    He was conning people out of their money. Giving money via a chugger is the worst way to contribute to a charity.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,786 ✭✭✭DownByTheGarden


    He said that he enjoyed it the first week because he got to chat to good looking tourists, who never signed up, but used to chat to him.

    By the second week he noticed that almost all of the actual signups were little old ladies probably on the OAP that he felt he guilted into and his heart just wasnt in it anymore.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,638 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    It is a very accurate portrayal of what happens. Vulnerable people are exploited by chuggers when they are the sort of people that charities should be looking after. It is what makes the whole chugging system so horrible.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1 sterling


    I currently rent in Ashtown. I have been outbid in the past by Peter McVerry for apartments closeby. Both times the price went 20% or more over the asking. Both properties are now problem properties for neighbours. Drugs and alcohol abuse rife and management company are aware but have done nothing. Peter McVerry van will appear occasionally with new furniture or mattresses but will not listen to neighbours concerns.While I commend the charity initiative to help others, I don't think their system is helping too many people. Unfortunately you normally hear about the one success story in the media so these charities can justify their work.



  • Registered Users Posts: 483 ✭✭hymenelectra


    It's a crying shame that charity within a society is being undermined.

    You can't blame people for turning their backs on most of them. But that's precisely the kind of socio economic hole we've been thrust into.

    It's not a good thing.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,085 ✭✭✭Rubberchikken


    I can take the flack so I'll say I never had faith in this outfit or a lot like it.

    For a country our size we have way too many charities. Are the regulators really watching every cent they collect or what it's actually spent on?

    Could it even be possible to do so. I'm guessing there aren't too many employed in the regulators office.

    We had Console the suicide charity a. Ouple of years ago and all the shenanigans involved there

    CEO's of these organisations being paid large sums and for what exactly.

    And don't givee this C suite nonsense. For a certain type of person working and being paid by these groups is a very cushy number and for some am opportunity to feather their own nest.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,730 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    The regulators would not be able to watch every cent they collect nor is it their job. They aren't their auditors.

    The charities providing housing services shouldn't exist as councils should be doing that. Charities providing counselling shouldn't exist as the HSE should be doing that. Etc etc for virtually every charity that gets substantial state funding - they're doing something the state is failing to do, either by negligence or deliberately - having a charity provide it provides plausible deniability for failings.

    For the current McVerry financial issues, it should be folded in to one of the other housing charities with only regular staff transferred; doubt that'll happen though. Or split between the various councils in the areas its serving.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,318 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    Homeless "charities" have become an industry in themselves. This is not a good thing for anyone.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,662 ✭✭✭✭For Forks Sake


    Well well, what do we have here 🙄


    PMVT received more than €38m in state funding in 2021, which accounted for most of its €53m in income that year.

    One senior figure said the possibility of the charity needing an immediate bailout has already been mentioned.


    They can fock right off, not another cent of taxpayers money should be let anywhere near that organisation until it's been forensically examined



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,978 ✭✭✭standardg60


    Apart from any irregularities which may or may not be found the numbers listed are staggering in themselves, 53million on over 2000 service users and tenants is circa 250k on each one. That's a scandal in itself.

    Questions really need to be asked whether any of these bodies are actually providing a realistic return on the funds they receive, there seems to be no deep dive into their actual results. Everyone seems happy to just accept their word that they are while they clamour for more funding.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,662 ✭✭✭✭For Forks Sake


    Next time you hear one of these housing charities whining about the state not doing enough for them..🙄





  • Registered Users Posts: 85 ✭✭Henry James


    All those charities are scams. I know someone who has an animal charity and a shop where they sell second hand donations. She loves animals and has a wage caring for them funded by others.Nice job. I wouldn't give any of them a red cent.

    I gave to one of the homeless 'charities' until I saw the CEO salary and his badly written patronising sales letters to me.

    They sometimes feature ex addicts who say " without charity x I'd be dead." They forget addicts are extremely manipulative and will say anything to get what they want. Especially when prompted by a copywriter. Then they can sometimes get the story in mainstream media. I saw one recently, in the examiner I think.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,195 ✭✭✭TinyMuffin


    If you want to get rich, start a religion or a charity.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,727 ✭✭✭Montage of Feck


    We've tried this before, farming out public services to private interests, it ended in scandal. So it will again.

    🙈🙉🙊



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 60,969 ✭✭✭✭Agent Coulson


    No real surprise there

    They could do putting inspector to look into the other major homeless charities.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,638 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    I've been critical of McVerry and his charity for quite a long time. Not a bit surprised by this, the regulator was bound to catch up with them sooner or later.



  • Posts: 0 Jude Wide Wasp


    Considering the extremely high consumption of money, I’d love to see a reasonably detailed account of expenses spent on the service users. Eg, was money used to finance any debts?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,625 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    Called this long ago.


    Wouldn’t trust Mcverry one bit, if only people knew what he does with the donated money.


    Country is corrupt from top to bottom.


    But Da Homeless!!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,791 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    All those charities are scams. I know someone who has an animal charity and a shop where they sell second hand donations. She loves animals and has a wage caring for them funded by others.Nice job. I wouldn't give any of them a red cent

    How is that a "scam"?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,383 ✭✭✭crusd


    Do you not know that nobody should ever get paid for doing something they enjoy. And people getting paid for providing a service that other people value is a scam

    Post edited by crusd on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,638 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    What a load of rubbish. The waste of money in that charity has been colossal.

    Have you forgotten the man who lay dead for a week in a Peter McVerry apartment that was supposed to be checked every day?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,638 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    This is mad stuff.

    I have voted Green for over a decade now. Previously, I voted on various occasions for Fine Gael, Labour, Fianna Fail, Progressive Democrats and independents. There has never been a political party that accurately represented my views.

    What my views on "republicanism" have to do with my views on Peter McVerry Trust is strange, all seems to be wrapped up to have a go at me.

    I first got interested in Peter McVerry Trust about a decade ago following a chugger keeping my talking for nearly an hour. I didn't sign up, went away, talked to people about it, looked up the finances etc., and I did not like what I saw. Huge money spent to raise not much more. Huge money wasted on publicity campaigns to boost the McVerry name, overpaid staff and executives, duplication of work of other charities leading to problems etc. I have posted on this for a long time, so not new to this.

    Let us see what comes out of this investigation. I am not a whistleblower or anything like that, but I wanted this and other similar charities investigated years ago. At the very least, I am correct about that, and along you come to shoot the messenger.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,638 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    What has any of that to do with Peter McVerry?



  • Registered Users Posts: 625 ✭✭✭Cal4567


    Anyone with any knowledge of the AHB sector will have noticed the significant increase and national profile of this organisation in recent years. Both the existing CEO and McVerry himself have made references to the group just trying to do too much in this period.

    Peter McVerry Trust is now a very large social enterprise. My reading of it is that in their efforts to meet the needs of clients and service users across the country, they lost the run of themselves. Both they and the regulator should have dealt with this 2-3 years ago.

    An example of both poor internal governance as well as external regulation. Yes, one solution could be to move away from some of their substantial activity but that would need another AHB/s to be able to step in.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,638 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Well, as far as I understand it, this site operates on the basis of evidence not motive.

    However, if you are talking about veneers of moral superiority, your posts ooze with it. Pretty much pay zero attention to those like you who attack the poster not the post.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,638 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Not only did they lose the run of themselves, but they got caught up in pointless finger-wagging and blame, while ignoring the huge problems inside their own organisation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 87,862 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1


    The Approved Housing Bodies Regulatory Authority (AHBRA) said it appointed the inspectors to conduct a statutory investigation

    Last month, the trust said it had notified the Department of Housing of "potential financial issues" at the charity.

    At the time, the charity said it was experiencing "acute" cash flow pressures and said it was aware of its obligations to "regulators and statutory funders to disclose challenges" when they arise. The trust was established in 1993 by Fr Peter McVerry, who had witnessed homelessness and deprivation in Dublin’s north inner-city in the years prior.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 87,862 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,662 ✭✭✭✭For Forks Sake




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    It'll need to be cleared up what exactly has happened.

    I like his comment “We’ll have to wait and see – and I am emphasising in all honesty there is no fraud. It’s simply a cash-flow problem that will hopefully encourage people to donate a bit more,” he said.


    Fair play, we all need to dig deep for him this year. I hope he calls out the government for it.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,638 ✭✭✭✭blanch152




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,469 ✭✭✭✭ednwireland


    because its doing stuff the government should be doing.

    I always wondered how much in total of the budget does the government give to charity and ngos?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,791 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Would you be in favour of stopping all foreign aid so?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 941 ✭✭✭mikep


    I get the feeling that all is not well here...what will further investigation uncover??

    Has there ever been an explanation as to how a body lay in one of their flats, for possibly over a week, despite regular MVT staff visits?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,791 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    A combination of things I imagine.

    The body was covered, the place had turned into a "crack den" and the person who died wasn't a client of the Trust.

    These charities deal with some of the most mentally damaged, chronically addicted and sometimes dangerous people in society.

    Now if people want to get rid of all them which they seem to, there is nothing to backfill the services.

    So addiction, crime, health, society as a whole will suffer.

    Unless you think with their record on these issues our governance will step in and manage it?



  • Advertisement
Advertisement