So UFOs aren't a theory anymore - but we still don't know what they are

Kecksburg UFO incident

It's just another Roswell cover-up. The three reasons they used to explain Roswell were different. Initially, just a weather balloon, then a high-altitude balloon project called Mogul, and then dummies dropped during flight experiments. were the explanations for the bodies. The inability to settle on one story is a sign that they are trying to obscure the truth. Records of an incident that involves NASA and the military, and multiple witnesses to a strange landing just went missing. Whatever you want to believe here. 

There is no doubt that they have used the UFO topic to conceal secret Cold War experiments. This was especially true during the 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, and 1980s when the US and Soviet Union were involved in a heated arms race. By using the UFO topic, they diverted attention away from their activities and kept their experiments secret. There's no problem with that.

 What next?

You will get direct testimony from those involved in the secret access crash retrieval programs

These secret access crash retrieval programs have been kept confidential for decades, and the information within them is highly sensitive. As such, the testimony given by these individuals will be trusted and taken seriously, and it will be a powerful tool to force the politician "on the fence and other media to investigate.

That's not true. The cover-up of UFOs follows the same kind of security system as 9/11, and certain people know how it works. It is likely that some people at the top will have more knowledge than others. It isn't a massive group that acts covertly to keep the lid on it. That's why people like you are stunned by hearing allegations that Grusch makes you think this grand conspiracy involves thousands The reason they can keep 9/11 and UFO crash retrieval programs secret is because they limit the number of people who have direct contact with them

A vehicle is a piece of equipment designed to transport people or cargo. Vehicles include wagons, bicycles, motor vehicles, railed vehicles, watercraft, amphibious vehicles, aircraft and spacecraft. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vehicle

The only type of object that could feasibly outclass an American fighter jet in 2004 during a one-on-one encounter in speed and maneuverability would be a machine or vehicle, whatever you want to call it, of nonhuman origin. No known terrestrial aircraft could outperform a fighter jet of that era.

The FLIR-targeting pod can't keep up with this vehicle. I question debunkers who clearly see what is happening on video and say that is just normal.

The American fighter jet of 2004 was the most technologically advanced aircraft of its time, and it featured advanced avionics and engine systems that allowed it to reach extremely high speeds and perform exceptionally tight maneuvers. This made it virtually impossible for any other aircraft to outperform. Again, I think you do have problems understanding the broader picture of events.

Chad Underwood also said this object jammed his sensor from picking up more details about it. That vehicle is clearly controlled by some type of intelligence, non human the best description.

It's funny how often conspiracy theorists contradict their own arguments.

Before we were being told that the aliens/fairies/whatevers, had unimaginable technology and unknowable motivations.

Now we're being told that they must be using vehicles, cause that's the only possible explanation. There's apparently no other options aliens/fairies could be using to appear on Earth. Can't be alien drones. Can't be aliens using some kind of astral projection kinda thing. Can't be the actual physical aliens themselves.

None of these options are considered or thought about because they don't fit the prefered, marketable image of a flying saucer with little green men inside.

Also, it's funny how we're being told that the fantastical, unknowable advances in technology amounts to slightly better than modern fighters. These craft only seem to be exceptional in their ability to do high g maneuvers that look suspiciously like camera effects or glitches.

We don't see alien craft instantly teleporting away, or warping back to their home system. We don't see them activating any kind of cloak or stealth. We don't even see them evading their pursuers by using their spaceship to just go straight up into, ya know... space.

The fantastical, millions of years of advancment seems to just be the interial dampeners from Stak Trek.

And it doesn't even seem like that technology is that great. As Mick West pointed out in his video, these alien craft are crashing at a rate much much higher than our airliners...

This seems to be a mixed bag of facts and untruths.

Exactly what happened

A severe storm with heavy lighting swept through the sky the night before the discovery. The next morning, after the storm Mack Brazel went to check the cattle and sheep on the ranch were okay.

Mack arrived at a pasture about several miles from his home. There he saw the wreckage field, which was about a mile across, with a lot of thrown-up dirt and strange metallic-looking material scattered around the pasture.

He is astonished by what he has just discovered. He collected bits of the strange metallic metal material from the field and traveled to see his neighbors, nearby, and they all had a discussion inside the house about what it could be and they couldn't tell what it was!!

He decided to bring some metallic material to a small area town called Corona and showed the townspeople there; nobody could tell him what it was there either. Several attempts were made to cut into the metal or burn it, but nothing worked. A day later, he traveled to Roswell because he didn't have a phone at home to contact the sheriff's office in Roswell. He was hoping that the law in Roswell would be able to identify the material and tell him what it was. He was also hoping to find out where the material had come from. Unfortunately, the law in Roswell was unable to identify it either, so contact was made with the Roswell air base, and then the military got involved.

The claim you made that it was first identified as the balloon is false, as Roswell Air Base announced an "alien craft had crashed on the ranch" This was printed in newspapers across the country.

36 hours later, a retraction story claimed it was a weather balloon. That means literally, from time on-site looking at the wreckage, to clearing it away, to the announcement they got a UFO, they had days with the material, and yet it's believed by debunkers they couldn't identify a weather balloon?

Bodies' story is based on what numerous people involved said. Roswell happened in 1947,

People didn't forget, you had to get on with things when the government in those days told you to do so.

One story from a person involved. The Roswell air base contacted a local casket maker and asked if he had any five child-like caskets available. No, he hadn't, the call ended. Apparently, another witness, a nurse who worked on the base, told her friend that the army had recovered nonhuman bodies from the field, and the base was on red alert, with a whole lot of people coming in from Washington to overwatch this and get that wreckage out of Roswell on US military planes.

Years later, the people involved in the balloon cover-up story in Roswell have basically come out to admit the US military lied and it wasn't a balloon. People who were there on the base do not even support the balloon story, which is quite an intriguing change.

Many of the people who were involved in the incident have gone on record to state that the US government was actively covering up what really happened.

It has been almost 19 years since this drone appeared. Where is it?

The pilots' stories are credible to me. Saying they are "liars" is usually used by those who can't handle what they hear.

In order to fly off at an acceleration that Chad Underwood's fighter jet could not match, it was obviously intelligently controlled. I don't know who piloted the object. It has been 19 years since the object first appeared in the skies, and it has been clearly not identified clearly as belonging to humans, so what happens next?

Pilots have years of experience and training in flight and navigation, and they are familiar with the capabilities of human aircraft. Based on their observations and analysis, they concluded that the object they saw didn't appear to have the same characteristics as a human-made aircraft. Making fun of decorated pilots such as Fravor and Underwood at home because you believe it cannot be possible. How that keeping an open mind? Do they rule out the possibility of non-human craft? No, they didn't.

The debunker's kind of attitude can be damaging because it assumes that all of the UFO information out there is wrong and that only the debunkers have the correct answers. This can lead to a lack of critical thinking and an unwillingness to consider alternative perspectives. Calling pilots liars hinders people from finding out the truth when dealing with highly decorated people who seem genuine. Rather than Fravor or Chad Underwood, the bad ones in this story, this shows a darker side of debunker personality.

9/11 is not the subject of this thread. It is important for us to get a better understanding of the nature of those attacks and why it is likely that they were perpetrated by rogue elements within the United States.

Consider the Anthrax attacks a week later. They used a highly sophisticated weaponized form of nano-thermite on 9/11 that was engineered to be explosive. We have more evidence of this world-class sophistication again seven days later.

For the Twin Towers, all this talk about wiring up buildings for weeks and months is false.

Anthrax attacks started 18th of September 2001.

What people are unaware of is Livermore Labs could not reproduce the anthrax used here in 56 attempts further reinforcing the sophistication of the anthrax used in the attack The anthrax also showed high levels of technical work, just like nano-thermite. In 9/11, a second group was involved, both events, show the same fingerprints of this rogue group.

Yea, again, your not helping your credibility.

Arguing that "the government is covering up aliens because 9/11 was done by 16 people using magic thermite" isn't as convincing as you think it is. It actually just highlights the kind of thinking behind conspiracy theories.

It also highlights your own dishonesty and the general dishonesty in conspiracy theory thinking. Because in the other threads, when it suits you, the conspiracy expands to include whoever you want. Then when you want to pretend what your proposing is reasonable, you ignore that previous claim and return to claiming that it was "rogue elements". Of course, you then just completely avoid and ignore all the issues that are pointed out that necessitate massive numbers to be involved. Much how you did with the post you're replying to.

An F18 pilot with experience in various sensors, equipment etc. on the supposed great videos. There are chapters so you can go to specific parts.

In action over the middle east? Spying on people at home in the good ol' USA? Everywhere. Drone technology has exploded in the last 20 years. Why are you ruling out this possibility but think little green men in pilot gear are more likely? And It has been almost 19 years since this 'alien craft' appeared. Where is it?

Cool. How do you know there was a pilot on board? Answer: you don't.

Has it been identified clearly as belonging to aliens? Answer: No, it hasn't

Cheerful, you accuse qualified people of much, much worse all the time. You're constantly making fun of accredited professionals because you believe things aren't possible. You

Correct, they didn't. They said "we don't know what that is/was". What you're doing isn't the same though. You're diving straight, head-first into the "aliens" swimming pool and stating with 100% fact that it is an extra-terrestrial craft which is being piloted by something. That's a million light years away from "they didn't rule it out completely".

You said this, a little over two weeks ago.: "Nanothermite, a military-grade substance, was placed here in addition to the fire caused the collapse of the Twin Towers, not explosions, as I have maintained for years."

If you said it was nano-thermite (which has never been proven to exist) and not explosions, which you have maintained for years, then how could it have been exploded by nano-thermite? You're contradicting yourself all over the place here. If it was explosive nano-thermite, then why can't we see them? Or hear them? Where's the explosions if it was so explosive? the cameras of the entire world were pointed there for weeks and there's no footage of these explosions taking place?

Also, you've no idea how sophisticated or weaponised this form of nano-thermite is because you haven't a clue what you're talking about. It just sounds intelligent to you because you read it on some psuedo-intellectual conspiracy website and now you think it sounds clever to just parrot it back to others. But you haven't the first clue what you're on about and your level of incompetence is exposed at the first or second hurdle. Always.

You've been taken to task by loads of posters on here about the presence of iron microspheres and the lack of "aluminum oxide" (sic), yet you keep banging this particular drum, even though it's completely contradictory. You even acknowledged yourself that there should be aluminium oxide present if thermite was used. You're constantly referring back to someone who said aluminium oxide was not found at ground zero, so you don't agree with him but keep using him as a reference point. You're both agreeing with them and disagreeing with them at the same time. Then you pivoted to saying crap like: "Al oxide was in the dust and not my problem mainstream groups failed to mention it in their report."

This is the crap that people have an issue with. The dishonesty and refusal to acknowledge that your views contradict each other. Along with simply making **** up to cover over any glaring inconsistencies that inevitably show up.

Your inconsistent, contradictory, outright dishonest, ramblings on here make you look like a madman. Your refusal to believe simple facts, while seeing things that aren't there (rivers of molten metal) further proves that point. Anything which has loads of evidence or witnesses to back it up gets dismissed as part of the conspiracy immediately if it doesn't back up your views. Yet the stuff which does back you up is collated from anywhere and everywhere and you still have to misrepresent what they're actually saying in order to lend credence yo your inane ramblings.

'How dare you impugn these highly decorated officers who definitely saw something...…vehicles, that's what they saw, they were definitely vehicles, even though they're on record as saying they don't know what these UFOs were, I'm taking this to mean they knew they were vehicles because I've said vehicles twice now on Boards.ie so that's my new position and I'm going to chastise others for not believing this also, even though 0I have a track record of dismissing every single expert, ever, on 9/11, Covid, Saudi Arabia, JFK........"

Clown show.

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Breach of charter - attack the post not the poster. Warning applied

HS

Listened to this today. It's another good break down of what was actually claimed in the hearing (And why it's mostly nothing.)

One point I picked up from it is that two of the witnesses were talking about how they believed that people who report UAPs would have been harassed and targeted. Yet, the third witness, who did report a UAP straight out states that no such thing happened to him.

Indeed, it's not hard to comprehend, but it is impossible to "prove" to someone who has decided they will never accept it.

That's the classic technique. Not "okay here's the evidence of the thing", instead "prove the facts to me, I'll never accept them".

As much as I want to believe in aliens, as amazing and mind-blowing as that would be, there's simply no credible evidence of them. Only evidence of people making up (and believing) "alien", "ghost" and "bigfoot" stories.

To the sake of clarity. I have no issue in believing in aliens, or to be specific that life exists somewhere else in the universe. Given the vastness it just seems far more likely that not. But existing elsewhere does not suggest they'll ever reach us, or us reach them.

It's hilarious when people see a few unknown pixels on a grainy video. and decide that means that every UFO story must be true.

I have reported but seems to be pretty pointless.

Thank you

Nothing to do with politicians or transparency.

It's another naive guy believing "alien stories" by other people who believe their own made-up stories. This lot just happen to have had jobs in defense or "UFO" departments (gee I wonder why)

We always tend to think of aliens as all powerful ... advanced ... very intelligent ... yet depicted as ugly giant toad-like entities ... little green men et al ... this is all science fiction and could be taken straight out of Star Wars, Star Trek or Avatar ...

Aliens almost certainly do exist ... the universe is just too big for us to be here on our own ... but we never stop and think that it may be as impossible for them to come here as we to go to where they are ... aliens may be very different life forms ... may be actually less advanced than we are ... we never stop and think of that ... perhaps there are very advanced civilisations out there but they have to live in water like fish and cannot travel to anywhere unless they have water ... in reality there are prob a lot of alien civilisations out there more advanced, less advanced and the same level as us ... but none has come here in my view ...

Most UFOs are seen in the US and Russia ... why is that?? Both countries spying on each other is why .... 70-90% of UFO incidents in a given year are manmade with 10-30% relating to weather/shooting stars/etc ...