Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings and threadbans - updated 11/5/24*

Similar new council estate near my area. But not to EU nationals, but non-EU who claimed refugee status here around 10 -15 years ago, and has since obtained citizenship I presume. First accomidated in Direct Provision, then HAP paid their private rental, and now keys to new local authority houses. I am not saying they dont deserve to be housed. Everyone deserves a roof over their head, if the state allows them to enter or stay. But I know Irish and EU families who work low incomes and are waiting 10+ years for LA housing and are no where near the top of the list. And they get no info on when, what, where, etc.

The state or LA need to be fully transparent on how the housing list works, and who is getting priority. Even publishing statistics to show it is non bias or not racist (against irish/EU white people), and that working people are getting the same oppurtunity as people who dont work or who never worked.

Won't happen unfortunately. It should, but the housing lists/system is as "flexible" as needs be to the demands of local politicians, interest groups, and the council board which means that people can and do skip the queue depending on who asks.

You have identified one of the biggest problems though - our "giveaway citizenship" model which allows anyone who manages to stay here for a period of time (it was/is 5 years but I've seen talk of reducing that) to apply and be given it in a nice ceremony and a spot on the RTE News.

That would be all well and good (well not really, citizenship should be a privilege and earned - not handed out as a reward for "time served"), except for the known and serious flaws in the DP/AS process where appeal after appeal can be undertaken to drag out the time, and where even if an application is rejected there is no enforcement around deportation (people are just asked to please leave, thanks!).

Add these two issues together and we end up with a system where of course native and EU citizens will be pushed down the list to accommodate - but these things can't be said aloud because

1) the media won't cover it objectively,

2) the political system as a whole is full of nepotism, favouritism, "shortcuts" and workarounds, and

3) calling it out would mean upsetting the NGOs and twitter/trend-following senior politicians and our "friends" in Europe - as well as exposing that for all our talk and spin, in many ways we're not much more advanced or developed than some of the 3rd world places these people are coming from.

We just have better benefits and marketing.

"Of course if you open up his twiter feed all you see is racism but he makes good points on the radio"...

Exactly why its him aways on and not others.

Have friends working in the business in Killarney who said that and half the people working with him are poorly paid foreign workers who can't afford to leave.

Hypocrite.

These pre-fabs are popping up all over the country, with no planning permission, no public consultation, and no input from the local county councils.

In many cases they are being built on public green spaces or land allocated for community centres or playgrounds.

The govt. have put OPW in charge of the operation. All the while claiming that its due to "an EU Directive" which they claim says no PP is required.

Well I'd like to see that directive, if it exists, because the EU does not get involved in local planning permissions.

Instead, there is an EU Directive that says the tenders for lucrative govt. contracts must be open and transparent, and open to firms in other EU countries. But there is a derogation for this in emergency situations. So it looks like this govt is

a) riding roughshod over the Irish planning system

b) subverting local democracy and local govt.

c) awarding lucrative contracts in secret

Michael McDowell addresses this in his article in yesterdays Irish Times. He rightly points out that they're not NGOs in the strictest sense as they receive taxpayers money and seem to work hand in glove with the government to advance certain agendas. They're more akin to TANGOs Tax Aided NGOs and are a bad thing for democracy.

The use of public money to advocate to influence public opinion in a particular direction, whatever that is, while normal citizens don't have access to the same government funding. This is highly concerning to anyone who cares about a democratic society rather than advancing their own agenda(s) whatever they may be. Political parties already get taxpayers money depending on how they performed at previous elections. They can then use this money to prepare for the next election campaign. I'll leave the last word to McDowell:

"Use of public money to influence public opinion is deeply problematic . . . . How does that stack up? While they can’t spend public money on the election campaign itself once an election is called, they can spend on all the preparatory organisational efforts. When there is such wide and free access to social media, is there not now a strong case for radically reviewing the growth of tangos as State-funded vehicles for promoting political agendas?"

So they can send money to TANGOs to circumvent political spending laws. How can anybody argue that this is good for democracy?

No doubt this may trigger some TANGO adjacent posters, which isn't the intention. I don't care what side of the divide people fall on this, this is dangerous for democracy.

All are welcome apparently. Pile a few thousand into D4

Problem with quoting McDowell is that you seem ignorant of the fact that he is not just a disinterested journalist, but a very partisan failed politician, who would have privatised our country if he could have.. But he was thwarted by the parties in government now, and democracy.

Its democracy that got rid of him and his party in this country.

Ghadaffi's prophecy has come to pass.

Very childish answer with made up words, and comment..

And not what I said at all as regards NGOs.

Why would anybody quote McDowell and democracy in the same post?

Because they haven't a clue maybe?

As you have proven with your reply above./s

ah here keep D4 out of it, we have it nice here, dont spoil it, that's what west dublin and the regions are for.

Pretty childish to call McDowell a "failed" politician when he was Tanaiste, a Minister for Justice, an elected TD on 3 occasions, and is now a Senator.

It's a very pointed piece from McDowell and cuts to the heart of the Problem that these NGOs are causing our society and democracy.

Queue the outrage from the usual suspects here..

https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/social-affairs/2023/02/23/irish-times-poll-majority-of-voters-support-ban-on-protests-at-refugee-centres/

I look forward to your moving of the goalposts

Your assumption is wrong. There is some of us old enough on here to remember a time before your imported culture wars were a thing. You have just however proven my point.

McDowell is spot on and the outrage will continue from the usual suspects on this forum.

Meanwhile the veil of secrecy surrounding these insidious institutions is slowly being lifted to the wider public. Reading McDowells piece certainly reveals some interesting modus operandi of these people and their operation within this governments circles.

In a normal functioning state this would have been fodder for the electoral commission and Sipo to call out but their silence has been deafening. They are going to find it harder and harder to ignore.

"Sponsored by the government of Ireland" indeed.

Plus the fact that McDowell is also a respected (in the legal sense anyway) constitutional lawyer and former attorney general. So he would know more about this fact than any numpty commenters on here, myself included. But the real unforgiveable thing to many TANGO adjacent people is the fact that he brought forward the citizenship referendum which stopped the situation where heavily pregnant migrant women were coming on the ferries to Dublin purely to give birth in Ireland, get citizenship for their child and circumvent immigration system. There were newspaper reports of ambulances having to wait for ferry arrivals at Dun Laoghaire. the masters of the maternity hospitals warned the Department that pregnant women were arriving from abroad with their antenatal notes.

This referendum was overwhelmingly passed by the Irish people despite the usual calls of racist by the usual suspects.