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The future of RTE after Tubsgate.

245678

Comments

  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 11,922 Mod ✭✭✭✭icdg


    Aertel has been on borrowed time for about 20 years and will probably go sooner rather than later now that the statutory requirement has finally been removed.

    The DAB network has been axed, has it not?

    RTE will almost certainly be going, if it hasn’t already, for direct Exchequer funding and there will be a price to be paid, in terms of savings.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,161 ✭✭✭bigroad


    I wouldn't put or buy any office for rte.

    Plenty of industrial units outside of the M50 .

    A few containers converted or portacabins would do nicely and they can go to the local shop for their lunch.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    Reform of RTÉ isn't really an option from what I can see. It seems to be that almost everyone thinks it is a quality service and it should be preserved. I seem on the wrong side, even after all that has happened.

    It's clearly a case that the only real problem that RTÉ has is the way it is funded: -

    1. Not governance (those mistakes are excused due to the dual model funding they have)
    2. Not how they spend money (rather that is excused because these are natural cost of such an organization)
    3. Not how they cut funding in certain areas (rather that is excused because they had to, rather then trying to examine the smaller incidental funding that they have that they could cut and when they could fairly cut)
    4. Not the decision to fund 2fm from the license fee since 2011 (This is excused because they should have some yuff programming as a PSB)
    5. Not the decision to cut funding to children's content (this is excused because hard decision had to be made)
    6. Not mismanagement of the service for the past 2 decades (if not more)

    No the only real reason for the downfall of RTÉ is the funding model and once that is fixed....

    Carry on Repeating

    Carry on Taking

    Carry on Erring


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users Posts: 794 ✭✭✭Mickey Mike


    Just a thought, some of the services could be relocated in Athlone, RTE have a 14 acer field in Moydrum. A central studio or hub smack bang in the middle of Ireland, could take in Galway, Limerick and Cork.

    RTE have made some progress in making cuts, ie, switching off MW, LW and DAB. All the digital radio channels can go too, we are swamped with online radio stations.

    And the number one thing, cut all salaries, no one should be paid above €170,000 pm.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,006 ✭✭✭Sorolla


    RTE is broke.

    i betcha Ireland will win next years Eurovision in Stockholm and that will be the end of RTE as we know it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    Why sit on that land? It looks to me like they just stopped maintaining a huge amount of buildings, not just building that they seem to have abandoned but also buildings that they are using.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,990 ✭✭✭ebbsy


    I see RTE has to pay out €300,000 in WRC settlements.

    That is a lot of €160s..........



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,045 ✭✭✭iseegirls


    So you think they should be looking at any sports coverage that they don't necessarily need, and renegotiate or sell off. I'm sure VM would take the Tuesday CL game.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    I think they mean Workplace Relations Commission not the Rugby World Cup.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,045 ✭✭✭iseegirls


    Oh sorry, I started that question incorrectly. I didn't even mean that to be related to the earlier point.

    Would just be interesting if they would be reviewing their sports deals especially for international events like the football World Cup and Euro's. Fair play to them though for broadcasting such events like the U21 international games and Women's football including the upcoming Nations League matches. It's possible that no other independent broadcaster would choose to show them



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    I can't see it happening tbh. I think they will let go of their international acquisitions first. And VMTV seem to have a good amount of sport I wonder how much they could take on.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,939 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    I think VM would need to improve the chances of anyone actually viewing their sports coverage if they went for HD of their Saorview coverage. It is appalling as it is impossible to see what is going on. That is very important for sports coverage.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    I think RTÉ will be massively different. Looking at what's coming from them, I think people will look to see it split up into its constituent parts.

    I disagree with the idea that you can split it across commercial lines and have it in the same organization. If this were the case RTÉ should just move to do that now.

    Simply we sell advertising and sponsorship, but we have no access to programmes in any shape or form. We simple sell a product, if you are unhappy with the editorial at RTÉ we suggest you advertise elsewhere, but we point out that RTÉ programmes are the highest rate in the country.

    No I don't think this will work or it might for a few years before some arguing that it is unworkable.

    While I see the idea of putting "commercial services", such as RTÉ2 and 2fm, into a separate company, I rather they split it up between Irish Language & Children (into TG4), TV into Screen Ireland, Radio & Montrose into 2RN, Lyric & CO into National Concert Hall and a News and Current Affairs service meeting the needs of those services.

    But it will be interesting to see the push back, I don't have hope for RTÉ's own strategy.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly



    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    Should RTÉ Split (as I have outlined) the name conventions would not be hard to change

    Television with FÍS ÉIREANN

    FÍS 1 (RTÉ ONE)

    FÍS 2 (RTÉ2)

    television with TG4

    4JR (RTÉjr | English Language Children's TV from TG4)

    Television NMN (Nuacht na Mean | Media News)

    NMN (replacing the RTÉ News Channel, News from FÍS and TG4, with a mix of European International news programming)

    Radio with 2RN

    2RN (replacing RTÉ Radio 1)

    2FM

    2OR (Replacing RTÉ Gold)

    2XM

    2PL (Replacing RTÉ Pulse)

    Radio with TG4

    RG4 (replacing RTÉ RnaG)

    CULA4jr (Replacing RTÉ Radio Jr mix of Irish and English)

    Radio RiRa (Replacing RTÉ Chill)

    Radio with National Concert Hall

    Lyric (Replacing RTÉ Lyric FM)

    Radio with NMN

    NMN Radio (Replacing RTÉ R1 Extra, News from 2RN, RG4 and Lyric, with a mix of European International news programming)



    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



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  • Registered Users Posts: 794 ✭✭✭Mickey Mike


    They should be no split in RTE, the idea of selling off RTE2 and RTE Radio2fm is bonkers, it doesn't make any sense, and the idea of moving out of Montrose is simply stupid, why? stay where you are. It will cost endless millions to setup shop somewhere else again.





  • Whatever about RTE2, what does 2FM do that could be considered public service broadcasting? In 2019 for example €11.5 million was sunk into it. It should be closed down and the resultant vacant spectrum auctioned off IMO.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,569 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    Ads cost a lot of money to make and broadcast. Why should companies pay for a second ad in Irish just for one channel that, no offence to TG4, hasn't got a fraction of RTE's viewership?

    Everyone, bar a small number of some foreign nationals will understand an ad in English. Most Irish people won't understand an ad in their own language.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,247 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams


    Tg4 is superior to rte and I can't speak Irish



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    Why no split, I haven't suggested selling RTÉ2 OR RTÉ2fm.

    I have also not suggested moving out of Montrose, I have suggested that it should become the National Screen and Sound Studio, owned by 2RN (a current subsidiary of RTÉ).

    I have sold nothing, and it would be up to 2RN if it might consider selling Montrose to move elsewhere in the country.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    It is a public service and RTÉ only provide TG4 with an hour of TV per day, An Nuacht and mainly repeats of their own Irish Lanugage shows with a few children's programmes thrown in. TG4 do not get any of the licence fee. There budget comes from the exchequre.

    Also you find that TG4 don't take up those ads, though they are used for that purpose, Irish language ads are used across all levels.

    I'd question the need for many of the PSAs on TV and Radio, regardless of language.

    2FM was always supposed to be self-sustaining. RTÉ are funding the channel from the licence fee since 2011, failing to ever bring it back from public funding requirements.

    Post edited by RoTelly on


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,569 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    Much of a muchness. I don't find anything interesting on either, or anything that I do find interesting that I can find anywhere else.

    .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    I'd argue that TG4 at the very least beats RTÉ2, which is devoid of any local programming outside of sport. And when you look at TG4 you realize they have no good reason not to have local programming on RTÉ2.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,247 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams


    It's just a better ran station , it's like rte is delaneys FAI and tg4 is the gaa , just run by better people



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 887 ✭✭✭decor58


    Is that not the idea, RTE1 has mainly domestic, RTE2 a younger audience and and foreign programming.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    Times change, RTÉ2/Network2 always had some domestic programming aimed a younger audience. The idea that you'd invest €25m on imports for RTÉ in an era when those types of programmes are ubiquitously available is killing the audience for RTÉ2 and its home produced programming. RTÉ should be trying to create something else and they can't even say ... but wait we moved it online ... look at the player originals... RTÉ's strategies are failing the era from which it was developed is now over time for something new and now is the time for that change.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,741 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Yet public sector bodies are now obliged to have ads in Irish most people can't understand - and not just on TG4 either!

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,569 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    Ridiculous box ticking exercise. Even more so when they google translate and get it wrong.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,342 ✭✭✭Tow


    The tax payer is spending a fortune on translations. What is more, it added unseen costs by causing delays in important information being released by government departments.

    When is the money (including lost growth) Michael Noonan took in the Pension Levy going to be paid back?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    Really this is where An Coimisinéir Teanga comes in, nothing to do with the broadcasters at all.

    I am not the strongest Irish speaker but have found the PSA translations to be dodgy and some of the pronunciation dodgier, but this really need to be put to the An Coimisinéir Teanga, they can't just make a rule and not follow through on the rule properly.

    I'd also argue that many of the PSA even in English are largely pointless but also ineffective due to how they are produced. The ad people really need to re-think their strategies. Now it could be due to interference with the end product from the client but they should really point out how ineffective they all are.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



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  • Registered Users Posts: 60 ✭✭Micheal Varadkar


    Aren't all those psa's on the radio basically the government bailing out traditional media by the back door? Back in the 90s and 00s when radio was king, I don't recall much if any government advertising on the radio.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    It seems that way alright. It'd be interesting to know who the top national advertisers are on Radio, and then to take a look at who are the top advertisers on local Radio. It helps them to increase their price for advertising due to the increase in competition from the PSAs.

    Unfortunately Departments are taken as separate clients, TAM Ireland usually has a list and "The Government Of Ireland" is never one of the top TV advertisers.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 11,922 Mod ✭✭✭✭icdg


    We might take the Irish language arguments elsewhere, thanks.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    RTÉ's new direction approved by Board, to be presented to Staff, audience and stakeholders to be consulted. ENDS.

    https://about.rte.ie/2023/11/08/update-a-new-direction-for-rte/


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users Posts: 3 gLazenby


    It sounds like their new plan will be more wishy washy than the last one. They'll probably try and find a buyer for the RTE Guide again



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,249 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    The big thing is that TV as it is, is on the way out. None of the young people I know watch RTE or any TV station anymore.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    That is fine but what about content, the platform doesn't really matter nowadays you are right, but linear still has a role in marketing weather we like it or not.

    Also I know loads of older people in the same situation as the yuff. RTÉ isn't just about TV and Radio.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,249 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    The TV licence is dead. They need to come up with something else.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    Do you think young people will use RTÉ when they are forced to pay for? The funding of RTÉ is a side issue. RTÉ has been run into the ground, do you think that RTÉ should be the main recipients of the license fee or whatever funding model you adopt?


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,249 ✭✭✭saabsaab




  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 11,922 Mod ✭✭✭✭icdg


    The problem is that the “something else” will come in one of two forms.

    Either it will be direct taxation and that will come with strings attached (see the CBC in Canada or ABC Australia for how that could turn out).

    Or it will be increased reliance on commercial revenue, possibly to the point of essentially being a state owned commercial broadcaster a la TVNZ.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    There are even problems with both CBC and ABC. (Though I have little knowledge of ABC, some of its Drama and Comedy out put seems good at times)

    CBC TV is commercial it runs ads, only CBC Radio has no advertising. CBC RE: sports its a slightly different market, with little sports appearing on CBC over their commercial rivals, their commercial rivals...well both NZ and Canada's commercial players did involve Canwest much like TV3, though canwest has gone.

    Also Canada is heavily influence by the US, while Australian commercial TV has a content requirement for Australian Drama and programming, though they could have eased that at this point.

    As I say even though I don't like those 3 options ... (btw Australia also has SBS, NZ has Whakaata Māori and while not separate CBC has Société Radio-Canada, long with several provincially run PSB such as TVO in Ontario, Télé-Québec and the Knowledge Network in British Columbia)

    I think we have moved beyond the monolith that is RTÉ, and as I say time for it to be broken up while remaining in state hands.

    And in fairness to ABC and CBC both have regional variants something we don't have.

    There is always the 3rd option and that is to split up RTÉ, much like that of France, which can't be much worse than what we currently have.

    I think keeping RTÉ they way it is will just lead to it staying the same, and as much as I think CBC is bad, I think RTÉ has sunk and my bias to being attach to RTÉ may taint my eyes to CBC.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,904 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    If part of the RTE reform was the sale of Montrose and them relocated, with Modern Technology for broadcasting Radio & TV would they need as much room?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 616 ✭✭✭TAFKAlawhec


    I guess the question is wherever, after the costs of relocation & purchase of new associated equipment, there would be enough monies raised to both tackle existing liabilities as well as keep costs sustainable in the longer term?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,845 ✭✭✭✭thesandeman


    They moved Joe Duffy to a bigger room 🙄

    His is pretty much the only programme that doesn't need space for studio guests or anything.

    Liveline could be broadcast from a medium-sized broom cupboard without too many alterations.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    Yeah I was just reading there that they put a new radio studio in to the Television Centre, I'd assumed that they upgraded RTÉ Radio Studios, can anyone confirm either or both happened.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,342 ✭✭✭Tow


    Joe is stationed in the second new studio S7-1. I believe this is in a new building, built with the money from selling the site. Old studios are still there, in need of updating, according to Kevin.

    The second studio, S7-1, is still under construction and will be completed by the end of the year. This studio is designed for one presenter with four to five guest positions. It will be mainly for current affairs, talk shows and an arts programme. consists of a 1+5 studio and a control room. The studio has an internal area of 6.1m x 6.6m accommodating 6 microphone positions. The studio is designed for video and includes 8 PAN-AW-UE100 4K PTZ remote-controlled cameras. The control room has internal area of 6.1m x 4m with direct line of sight to the studio for the sound engineer and production team. The Systems Integrator for both studios is Dublin-based Creative Technology.


    Article on the first new studio RN3:https://www.ibc.org/features/in-depth-behind-the-scenes-at-rte-visual-radio-studios/9344.article

    When is the money (including lost growth) Michael Noonan took in the Pension Levy going to be paid back?





  • Irish Times article suggesting that there will be 400 redundancies at RTE, about 20% of the workforce. Also some radio services such as RTE Pulse, 2XM, Junior and R1 Extra are due for the chop. Also more money will be spent on independent productions.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    Basically it is strategy 2024 and RTÉ just move on, no improvement of services.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,139 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    How much money will axing Pulse, XM, Junior and R1 Extra save?

    Never heard any of them.



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