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Find out what % of an estate is social housing

  • 29-09-2023 1:04pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 168 ✭✭


    Is it possible to find out what percentage of an estate is made up of social housing?

    Moved into a new build estate with a mix of houses and apartments. Can see from the property price register which of the houses didn't pay full market value which indicates a social house (bought by govt./council/charity) but for a block of apartments that have been sold off en masse, is there a way to find out who these are going to?

    Post edited by L1011 on


«13

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    Why would it matter?

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,439 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    No.

    You'll never find out who's on HAP, among other things.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭suvigirl


    Any particular reason you want to know all your neighbours personal information?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,003 ✭✭✭DarkJager21


    It does matter to someone paying full price for a house, better forewarned about a potential ghetto in the making than throwing 300-500k down the shitter.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,620 ✭✭✭JeffKenna


    In a way it doesn't matter because councils are buying houses in estates at a rapid manner so it's only a matter of time and they'll be all around you



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 150 ✭✭Alonzo Mosley


    Biggest Investment of your life , I'd want to know.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    Social housing is everywhere now. Better get used to it.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 168 ✭✭Inforapenny


    This and this.

    Not going to take it off topic as just wanted to understand was it possible to find out who will be taking these apartments.

    In "fairness" to some of the people in the social houses, the partners seem to be going out and working full days work. So they are probably well off with 50/60 a week rent and a fulltime salary.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,003 ✭✭✭DarkJager21


    No it doesn't have to be accepted, in fact it needs to be reviewed and the practice of X amount of social housing in private estates stopped. Plenty of space to set up a new generation of ghettos for those who want a free house, I don't see why they should be getting accommodation of a standard that hard working people have to pay through the eyes for



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    Social housing isn't free.

    I know because i live in one and pay a percentage of my monthly wages for the house. Maybe im not a "hard worker"

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 293 ✭✭Subutai


    Census small areas data was published recently. You can probably get a certain insight into this question from that - it will let you know the percentage renting from a local authority or AHB. It won't include HAP tenancies though, for example.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,518 ✭✭✭Quitelife


    Dont think anybody has a problem with workers like yourself getting social houses .

    The problem is people who never worked or contributed anything positive getting houses for very small rent out of their welfare and destroying the lives of law abiding people in the houses round them. Lot of Irish families & their cousins seem to be allowed get away with this .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 168 ✭✭Inforapenny


    100% agree with you. All new housing estates must have a minimum of 20% of units offered to social housing which is absolutely bananas.

    The cost of new build is massive. People dropping 500k on a new build and then probably another 200k in mortgage interest payments on top.

    For 500k you could easily buy 2/3 existing houses In certain areas of Dublin anyway and give to social housing.

    Even the rent those on the social housing pay for their new build house is usually very low and lots of them working anyway.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,669 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    Perfectly reasonable not to want to live in a community of social rentals but I am not of anyway to find this information. Maybe you could try to FOI it?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 990 ✭✭✭Fred Cryton


    It's very likely the council have leased the entire block of apartments. This allows them to get around the Part V regulations of only 10% social. They buy their 10% social from the developer, then they lease another chunk. Don't be surprised if 50% of the development is not privately owned or rented.

    The forced integration of social with private is one of the greatest injustices of modern Ireland, and has no parallel in other Western countries. Anyone think Americans would accept buying in an estate where half the people are on government welfare? It is honestly outrageous and makes the blood boil.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    You've obviously never been to America if you believe that. I lived in NY for 5 years east 28th and 2nd Ave beside Murray Hill and some of the most expensive real estate in the country that had social housing blocks dotted around the area. Social integration is fantastic and it's the route all political parties in this country are going down.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 990 ✭✭✭Fred Cryton


    in the US thats very likely to be subsidized housing for low income families, where the parents are working in low paid jobs.

    In ireland you and I know social housing is a very different beast and usually means life long government welfare dependency and has a close correlation with anti-social behaviour.

    You are correct that integration is the route alll political parties are going down, but doesn't mean it's right or just. It just forces the kids of middle class parents to mix with delinquents and brings all the kids down to the lowest common denominator. Private schools are the only hope for parents to keep their kids out of that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,901 ✭✭✭thomas 123


    Makes my blood boil also.

    The private buyer housing their family off their own back has to compete with the council and the investment firms attempting to make a killing on rent.

    I've dubbed it the spit roast myself but social injustice sounds better.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    You dont even seem to understand what social housing is.

    Actually forget I've just checked back on some of your posting history. You just have hate for those in social housing and on welfare.

    Carry on I'm not wasting my time conversing with someone of that ilk.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 170 ✭✭JCN12


    No point being a victim.

    The reality is that you are in a very advantageous position. The rent you pay is based on the differential rent scheme, so approx. 15% of your total income. Their is also the option of buying the house for a heavily discounted rate.

    This is all subvented by the tax payer.

    It's much like a millionaire complaining about all the troubles that having money can bring. He won't get much sympathy from those struggling to get by.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    I am a taxpayer. What's your point?

    Who's a victim? You are making no sense.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,592 ✭✭✭Tork


    This ^^^, assuming you're looking for a sensible answer and aren't trying to stir things. It doesn't matter whether you're hoping to buy in a brand-new estate or an older one. Over time, the number of council-owned and rented houses creeps up.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 238 ✭✭rowantree18


    It matters.

    If there's antisocial behaviour, which in the real world is more associated with high levels of social housing, then the estate gets a name and your house is worth less and less.

    But you already know this....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 170 ✭✭JCN12


    Whilst you may be a tax payer, collectively all the tax payers in this country subvent council houses.

    "Maybe I'm not a 'hard worker' " - Victim mentality.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 238 ✭✭rowantree18


    I accept you're a working person whose salary is at a level entitling you to social housing. Fine. But you probably pay approximately 15% of your salary which is an absolutely amazing deal by today's standards.

    Those on social welfare pay a nominal amount of rent - from the free money they receive, making the housing completely free.

    Most people are happy for social housing to be provided to those genuinely unable to work - disabled, complex issues etc. But people are definitely not happy shelling out 5 to 800k to live next door to someone doing nothing. Yeah, not woke or PC, but reality.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,119 ✭✭✭Emblematic


    I can understand a certain feeling of unfairness but people but rather than begrudging those in social housing, people never seem to question why they are paying a fortune to either purchase or rent in the private sector? It was not always the case here and need not be in the future.

    There are things that could be done to bring prices down for purchasers and private renters but these are never campaigned for. I think the reason for this is that people want to get themselves personally on the upward moving ladder and, once on it, will pull the ladder up and to hell with anyone else.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    Begrudgery and punching down, two things Irish people are world leaders in.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,436 ✭✭✭sprucemoose


    so its better to continue with the old method of lumping all the council houses together in estates? i see that as even worse, that breeds a monkey see-monkey do attitude in people living there imo



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,076 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    Are you suggesting that people living in social housing are particularly guillable or so easily led by others in their community that they all resort to anti-social behaviour?

    I dont know how many times i've read on boards and other media that its necessary to house social tenants within 'privately built developments' to ensure there is less anti-social behaviour from social tenants. That's an outrageous slur on the many people living in social housing. The idea that social tenants need to live beside owner occupiers in order to learn how to live 'properly' is disgraceful and whoever came up with that excuse to stop building social housing should be ashamed.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,215 ✭✭✭CollyFlower


    You can identify social housing in Dublin estates by the window blinds, they normally put the same blinds on council units.

    Think they get a job lot.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭suvigirl


    That's just those jealous begrudgers. Personally I couldn't care less what the person next door paid or didn't pay for their house.

    has absolutely no affect on anyone else whatsoever



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭suvigirl




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 170 ✭✭JCN12


    Rumour has it they are also very good at apportioning anecdotal labels when confronted with facts.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 85,560 ✭✭✭✭Atlantic Dawn
    GDY151


    If you go to Landdirect.ie you can view the folio of a house for €5, this will tell you the owner. I suppose not cheap if there's 100 houses but you might only need to know what houses are immediately around you.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,020 ✭✭✭boetstark


    And what about the very large percentage of those on housing list here in Limerick that don't work, isn't that free housing.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 296 ✭✭Bobby_Bolivia


    You pay very, very little tax compared to others if you qualify for social housing.

    You take more than you give.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,436 ✭✭✭sprucemoose


    yes

    ghettoisation is a thing, its not a new idea. spreading social housing throughout a development is a much better idea that clustering them together



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,397 ✭✭✭CPTM


    There's also the massive datasets on data.gov that have planning permissions, along with descriptions (sometimes with notes on social housing) in the description field.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,020 ✭✭✭boetstark


    That's complete and utter rubbish. Of course it has if it affects the value of the house you are working hard to repay.

    And unfortunately it only takes one or two social housing families to cause chaos in an area.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,390 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    A variation of this exact same thread must pop up at least a couple of times a month, honest to god, do people not know the score by now?

    I'm a private owner. I've a social house to my left, and another private owner to my right.

    Guess which neighbour is the anti-social nightmare. I'll give you a hint. They live on my right.

    Vast social housing estates that likes of those built in the 70s and 80s are never coming back. Nor should they.

    Honestly, get over it.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,076 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    Are you saying that people living in every social housing community in the country are living in ghettos?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 625 ✭✭✭Cal4567


    Department of Housing produces this every quarter which has a breakdown of all new social housing in an area. This is public record.

    This would be in addition to the Part V provision that applies to all projects over 10 units, I believe.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,076 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    Why do you think large social housing estates are any different to large privately built developments? The SH buildings are not of a lesser standard, people living in SH have access to the same education system, health service, job opportunities, sports and other cultural and community activities. No matter where people live they usually have the same aspirations to live a happy peaceful life. Imo anyone who thinks that people who avail of subsidized housing are living in ghettos, and should be housed in a more costly house to prevent them falling into a life of ASB, is seriously arrogant and condescending.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,390 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    I don't think the buildings are of lesser standards.

    But I can tell you something, having grown up in a council estate with an extremely rough reputation, that the families living there most definitely did not have the same access or the same opportunities as those in "better" areas. Always last on the list for funding when it came to schools, medical centres etc, or basically anything - and we were actually told to lie about where we lived when applying for jobs or our CVs would go in the bin.

    Sprawling estates with little or no services, where families are just dumped and forgotten about, should never happen again.

    I can also tell you from my own experience, having moved on from social housing and into home ownership, that anti-social behavior and assholes come in all shapes, sizes, and income brackets, and they don't all live in social housing.

    Post edited by Ezeoul on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,076 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    Where did the rough reputation come from and what opportunities do you mean? I know many schools didn't encourage students to go to third level in the past but that wasn't confined to SH estates.

    Agree that those who engage in asb and dodgy people come from all walks of life and all areas of the country, so why are entire SH estates constantly labelled as rough, ghettos, and generally undesirable places to live when problems are from a tiny minority of residents.

    If any local council built a 100+ unit estate of SH today, do you think that people would not want to live in those properties just because they were built by the council and not a private developer? Or that those people would be better people, or live a better life, simply by living adjacent to an owner occupier? It's an absurd notion. Anyone who thinks that some areas (and really they mean the people living there) are undesirable or inferior or defective or flawed in some way and need rescuing needs to lose that attitude.

    I also believe that labelling children from a young age by calling local schools 'Deis' is wrong. How is it helpful to tell young children that the area they live in and their community is socially disadvantaged and deprived. Even ads on tv are at it at the moment - look how great we are providing free nutritious food through Deis schools to kids who need it most - pretty disgusting saying parents in those areas are not taking care of their kids properly. No issue with any organisation helping local communities but don't demean those receiving the help and then brag about it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    Or private housing families.

    It's actually disgusting the view on this site against people like myself in social housing.

    Amnesty International’s new investigation shows that Israel imposes a system of oppression and domination against Palestinians across all areas under its control: in Israel and the OPT, and against Palestinian refugees, in order to benefit Jewish Israelis. This amounts to apartheid as prohibited in international law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 168 ✭✭Inforapenny


    15% of income, wow. Is that 15% of gross income or take home pay? Presume the latter.

    Im currently spending nearly 50% of my take home pay on my mortgage.

    So much for rewarding the people who get up in the morning. We reward people who want, take, want, take etc



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 168 ✭✭Inforapenny


    Disagree, you have it easier than the person going out and working and having to pay a big mortgage because you pay a small amount of rent each week for a fancy social house.

    You can afford to live a better life as a good portion of your disposable income is not going on a mortgage compared to those not taking.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭suvigirl


    No, it doesn't effect the price of my house, particularly as No one even knows the ownership of the rest of the houses.

    Oh, and just to correct you, it only takes one or two families in any area to cause chaos.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭suvigirl




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