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Enoch Burke turns up to school again despite sacking - read OP before posting

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,131 ✭✭✭lmao10


    He's not fit to be on the streets considering he doesn't have the ability to stop hassling the school. He and his family have no issue with him spending the next 40-50 years behind bars rather than purge contempt. I said it before but the mindset of this family hasn't been seen in the Irish court system before. When you have people willing to spend their entire lives in prison when they can get out within the hour if they want, and having their family totally support that, I find that quite scary. It's the mindset of extremists. You can see how much they are convinced of the injustice. There is no sign that they would become violent but when you have individuals with this level of an extreme mindset, I always have it in the back of my mind. I'm glad the chap is behind bars and the way I see it, the courts have to stand firm this time. You can't give these people any leeway. He wants to be in the Joy, grand - let him languish there. Leave the reporting to gutter scumrags like grift.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,164 ✭✭✭✭Pherekydes


    What's to stop the judge from holding any family members disrupting the court in contempt?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,316 ✭✭✭CPTM


    This is exactly what I thought as I read through the latest.



  • Registered Users Posts: 478 ✭✭feelings


    Back in jail where he should be.. When can they start seizing any assets?



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,126 ✭✭✭chicorytip


    Sure, he hasn't the proverbial pot to p--s in.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,733 ✭✭✭Karppi


    Considering we’re about to throw a €56m payment in the direction of RTÉ, there’s better value in paying the costs of Enoch’s unwillingness to purge his contempt until the end of time.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,444 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    He's been getting paid this entire bloody time!!!!

    They can take that back for a start.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,628 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    In the present situation, he seems to have the court system over a barrel, continual disobeying what became a permanent high court order to stay away from the school capped by refusing to apologise to the court for his contempt. It's probably best to let him out so he will head to the school and voluntarily trespass withing the school grounds again.

    Only this time, with the trespassers will be prosecuted sign at the school warning him of the outcome, if he enters the grounds, arrest, prosecution and imprisonment would now be the option for the state for the offence as he knows that he is not welcome at the school or within its grounds and buildings and is under court order not to enter the grounds.

    If he doesn't attend at or trespass at the school again then he'll be seen as having bowed his knee to the school board. A meeting could then be arranged for an official meeting between him and the board at state body level to finalize whatever he feels sore about. If he gets ratty then the state can wash its hands of mediation efforts.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,457 ✭✭✭J.O. Farmer


    Trespass as per the sign is a civil matter. The trespass as per the current injunction is a criminal matter (contempt of court).

    The sign doesn't change anything except the school indicating they will sue trespassers.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,921 ✭✭✭✭AMKC
    Ms


    Exactly. They should find a nice dark cold cell and throw him in that until he admits contempt.

    Live long and Prosper

    Peace and long life.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,628 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    Thanks. I looked for info online if trespass at the school following the erection of the sign was criminal or civil offence and the law pages didn't make it clear, only mentioning it as being in civil law. That covers a multitude.



  • Registered Users Posts: 51,754 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Anyone know if he has an actual conviction as yet?



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,979 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    No, its a finding of civil contempt for disobeying Court orders. He would not have a conviction.

    He has not committed any sort of crime, but ignoring orders of the Court, injunctions and so on, will definitely land you in prison eventually.

    Civil Law and the orders of Courts apply to everyone, all the time. Burke would want to cop on to this soon, before he is left to rot indefinitely and people forget about him.





  • No, none of the trials have been criminal all civil.

    as the garda would say, it’s a civil matter. 😅

    Nothing actually! I’m surprised it hasn’t happened yet, i assume there just isn’t space for all of them.

    The school needs to begin debt collection proceedings first before any money or assets can be seized.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,808 ✭✭✭TinyMuffin


    Could the school not put a sign like this up.





  • Registered Users Posts: 40,412 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Perhaps we could ask the british if the Little Ease in the Tower of London is free. That would soften his cough.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,126 ✭✭✭chicorytip


    There must be grounds for dismissal due to gross misconduct / insubordination at this stage rather than this indefinite suspension.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,877 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    The trouble is that what you suggest wouldn't be mediation.

    Some time ago I posted on this thread suggesting mediation.

    It didn't go down too well so I let it slide.

    At the time I discussed the case with a qualified and experienced mediator.

    They agreed with my assessment that it is an extremely difficult situation with only a small chance of success.

    Just to be clear they also said they wouldn't touch it with the proverbial barge pole.

    I don't expect that any of this will be of interest to most regular posters on the thread.

    However I still think that any endgame, if such exists, will require something more than a purely legalistic approach.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,601 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    👁️ Enoch Watch 👁️

    Updated 3 October 2023

    • Thurs July 6 - High Court (Justice Roberts) grants EB temporary injuction preventing Disciplinary Appeal Panel from proceeding on 7 July.
    • Mon Aug 8 - High Court (Justice Dignam) defers judgement on appeal against the injunction preventing the Disciplinary Appeal Panel from proceeding. Judgement still pending.
    • Mon Aug 28 - EB resumes daily protest at WHS by entering premises and standing in a corridor.
    • Thurs Sept 7 – Day 83 of EB protest at Wilsons Hospital School post dismissal.*
    • Fri Sept 8 - EB re-incarcerated for an indefinite duration due his continued contempt by refusing to stay away from WHS.
    • Tues Oct 3 - Day 26 of EB re-incarceration in Mountjoy Prison. (Sept 8 - Oct 3 inclusive).
    • Tues Oct 3 - High Court review (Justice Sanfey).
      • EB again refuses to purge contempt.
      • Advised he can purge his contempt and leave prison at any time by giving an undertaking that he will abide by the injunction ordering him to stay away from WHS.
      • Next formal review set for Dec 12.
    • Tues Oct 3 – Fines x 250 Days @ €700 per day (27 Jan to 3 Oct inclusive) = €175,000 + legal costs + €15k in damages for trespass.

    🏳️‍🌈 ⚧️ Donations to "Enough Enoch" GoFundMe in support of Irish LGBTQ+ charities = €11,315 ⚧️ 🏳️‍🌈 (+20)

    Donations to "Enoch Burke" GoFundMe to assist Enoch Burke pay daily fines = €40 (no change)

    Donations to gofundme "Pay Enoch Burke's Legal Costs" started 18 July 2023 = €0 (no change)

     *School closures / Public Holidays / Court Dates are excluded.

    Post edited by Ezeoul on


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,200 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    Maybe in other jurisdictions they have found solutions to stuff like this but I can't think of much. They could make him wear an ankle bracelet and say that he can only be in Mayo and intercept him if he tries to leave. But he'd probably cut it off or just leave anyway.

    They could deport him somewhere and ban him from returning :) Except that's illegal and no-where would have him.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,200 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    There's a thin line between what he has and mental illness. He's been brain washed into thinking the way he does. In someways a mental hospital might be a better location for him.

    Note: I'm not saying he should be in a hospital. Like I said there's a thin line there and I'm pretty certain that he hasn't crossed it. Plus there's an argument that a sane person can hold insane ideas. Also I'm not a mental health professional. So I definitely couldn't diagnose.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,708 ✭✭✭Oscar_Madison


    Mediation works in cases where both sides are taking a firm legal position albeit on opposite sides but both sides have at least a realistic sounding valid legal argument and both sides believe they have an equal to or better than 50:50 chance of success in a court decision.

    I don’t really see that in this case- Burke is in denial at least publicly, that the reason he lost his teaching job was due to his behaviour and has nothing to do with transgenderism - as long as he continues to believe or at least state this, then mediation will be useless and pointless



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,444 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Most of the money is owed to the Courts for his contempt so it's the courts that could garnish those wages and I don't understand why they haven't done so yet.





  • I don’t know if I’ve just imagined this but was it not ruled that the fines should be paid to Wilson’s?



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,444 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Wilsons are absolutely due money for costs and a few fines , but the €600/day is a court penalty for his contempt.



  • Registered Users Posts: 527 ✭✭✭Baba Yaga


    as my late grandmother would say 'theres a severe want in that lad'


    "They gave me an impossible task,one which they said I wouldnt return from...."

    ps wheres my free,fancy rte flip-flops...?



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,058 ✭✭✭afatbollix


    We have to start thinking of this as if he's a religious radical.

    If his religion was Islam I think we would be treating this very differently. Some countries have a prevent system in place. In the UK It's used for anyone with extreme views. Right or left wing, Religious extremists or even sexist views.

    They bang on about their own rights but never think of the rights of everyone else.

    With rights comes responsibilities.



  • Registered Users Posts: 51,754 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Imagine ending up in a prison wing with the Burkes??? You'd have grounds for getting your sentence at least halved.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,877 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    As I said in my other post there would be a small chance of success.

    Your suggestion that there might be a difference between the "private Enoch" and the "public Enoch" perhaps offers some hope of dialogue.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 23,519 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    How have Martina, Isaac and Ammi all not been charged with some form of contempt with their repeated disruptions of the judges?



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