Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Hamas strike on Israel - Threadbans in op - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

Options
173747678791266

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 19,364 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    Plenty of far-right pro-Israel groups


    Anti-Muslim groups tend to be pro-Israel.......... "enemy of my enemy" is how they see it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,240 ✭✭✭kabakuyu


    You are f%^^%$ naive if you dont think the the extreme left and far right dont buy into the whole world jewish conspiracy, they both have a visceral hatred of jews, this hatred is growing in Ireland, it may be a small clique but its there.



  • Registered Users Posts: 698 ✭✭✭TedBundysDriver


    It's okay though as they have terrorists living among them something something.....



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,456 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Ah the Muslim Brotherhood

    That Bastien of democracy. It was trying to impose Islam doctrine similar to the Taliban. There was a popular uprising against it.

    Problem with organisations like that that when they get into power they abolish all Democratic institutions in a state

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,498 ✭✭✭An Ri rua


    Serious questions, if so, should be reflected upon prior to asking and should stand the test of logic.

    Q) Is North Korea Israel and, if so, who is the NK Gaza?? If there is an NK Gaza, can they access their own coastline?

    Just curious as to how your brain 'works'.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 27,675 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Egypt has a border with Gaza.

    I never said I was ok with what they are doing, I was just asking a question as to how shutting your borders and indeed, protecting your coastal waters from infiltration is a war crime and incompatible with international law. I am not saying what Israel is doing is morally right, but I haven't seen anything that confirms it is illegal.

    There is nothing disingenuous about asking a question as to how Israel's actions in closing its border (as opposed to its actions in indiscriminate bombing) are a war crime, as been claimed on Twitter and on here.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,364 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    See, this is the nasty crap. Implying that anyone criticizing the Israeli state is either a far-left antisemite or a far-right antisemite.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,675 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Horseshoe theory of politics.

    Paul Murphy and John McGuirk have more in common with each other than they do with centrist politicians like Leo Varadkar and Micheal Martin.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,364 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    They are not just closing off the border (as you well know). They control all supplies going in and out and have cut those off too as a collective punishment against the Palestinian's who live there. Water, food, electricity, medicine.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,456 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    The people of Gaza chose Hamas as there government. It's not just Israel is pi$$ed with them so is Egypt. Organisations like Hamas do not want peace

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 4,498 ✭✭✭An Ri rua


    Yes the extreme far right left party are b#stids and need watching.

    Good spot chief.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,675 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Again, this is not a question about the logistical implications, this is about the legal consequences of closing your borders. There has been a claim, and it has been repeated many times, that Israel is committing a war crime by closing its borders. There are humanitarian implications from that, but I am asking as to how international law is being broken. It is a fundamental principle of international law that a country can close its borders and the example I have given - North Korea - have been doing it for decades.

    This isn't about how my brain works, this is about what is legally wrong. If there is a war crime, people should be actually able to explain what that is, rather than just spouting out "Oh, that is a war crime".



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,675 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Nothing travels from North Korea to South Korea, a collective punishment against the South Koreans by North Korea. That it is less effective than Israel against Gaza is acknowledged, but that still doesn't clarify the allegation of war crimes.

    I am asking for those who believe it is a war crime to specify what part of international or other law has been broken.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,666 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    ****


    The only reasonable position for any elected official in this country to take on this issue is to call for a ceasefire and to encourage a peaceful resolution.

    Paul Murphy is happy to stir things up and lead protests that result in laws being broken and other attendees being arrested (notably stays out of handcuffs himself).

    Like all champagne socialists he's happy to take a hard line from a safe distance of a few thousand miles.

    This is what you get with political extremists though so it shouldn't be a surprise to anyone this guy is a fvcking TD for Christ's sake.

    Glazers Out!



  • Registered Users Posts: 569 ✭✭✭Long Sean Silver


    Israel's sense of security and dominion over the Palestinians has been totally shattered.

    Bombing innocent women & children will not make it return.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,364 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    Don't be feigning ignorance and making up dishonest false equivalences. It's nonsense.

    Israel controls everything going into and out of Gaza. South Korea does not control anything going into and out of NK.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,498 ✭✭✭An Ri rua


    This may ywt well be about how your brain works.

    And a quick lesson about Google/Wikipedia also. All that you seek is within reach.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blockade_of_the_Gaza_Strip

    "The ICRC termed Israel's blockade of Gaza "collective punishment" in violation of international humanitarian law. In 2010 it also called the blockade a violation of the Geneva Conventions and called for its lifting".

    These views are supported by further legal analyses. A multi-referenced University of California, Hastings College of the Law analysis recorded:

    "Under customary international law, a blockade is an act of war. It is employed to cut off communications and supplies of an enemy. While the modern concept extends beyond its original and exclusive maritime roots to include both land and technological blockades, the consistent feature is that a blockade's purpose has been to deprive a military adversary of necessary supplies. A belligerent imposing a blockade upon a region consisting of a civilian population must allow the free passage of relief consignments to the civilian population. In fact, the legality of a blockade under customary international law hinges on the requirement that aid for the civilian population be met with free passage.

    The reasons cited for Israel's refusal to allow passage of basic necessities are untenable. Israel claimed that its restrictions were necessary to put pressure on Hamas officials to halt or substantially hinder the firing of rockets into Southern Israel. However, there is no reasonable relationship between depriving Gazan civilians of subsistence items and the suppression of Hamas' rocket launchings against Israeli towns. Israel's duties to "protected persons" as an occupier of the Gaza Strip under Article 55 of the Fourth Geneva Convention require that it allow the passage of all aid, foodstuffs, and water given the severity of the humanitarian crisis. The blockade appears to have clearly violated this provision of the law of occupation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 812 ✭✭✭Hey boy




  • Registered Users Posts: 569 ✭✭✭Long Sean Silver


    i'm not sure they choose Hamas as you put it, but let's indulge your inaccuracy for a moment. they have been backed into a corner by a much more powerful occupier, backed and pay-rolled by the most powerful war machine on the planet.

    perhaps the people of Palestine have been left with little or no choice. when you have no choice left, you must do what you have to do to survive.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,675 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Article 55, which you quote, and I am not conceding as to its applicability to the current circumstances, also has an exceptional clause - "temporary restrictions are made necessary by imperative military requirements". Given what happened to Israel over the weekend, and given the over-riding right to self defence, those exceptions are clearly in play. Now, if Israel continued this blockade for say, a month, and it could be established that Article 55 does apply (which I am not conceding) then you may have a point.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 27,675 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Either closing your borders is allowed under international law and both North Korea and Israel are allowed to do it, or it isn't.

    The problem you have is that international law, or any law, does not take account of equivalences.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,782 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Some of the Nazi scum protesting outside the Israeli embassy tore up flowers and cards sympathising over the attacks.


    There is a very sizeable group in the Pro Palestinian group that are among the most disturbed and vile people in modern political activism.



  • Registered Users Posts: 812 ✭✭✭Hey boy


    naive.

    try publishing a cartoon of a certain person.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,041 ✭✭✭winstonia


    Interesting how many Irish people would be supporting the Brits going by their love of Israel to "defend itself"



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,675 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    That is horrendous is true. Paul Murphy was leading that protest, wasn't he?



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,998 ✭✭✭Red Silurian


    Interesting to see the (American) Republicans wanting a hands off approach to Ukraine but very quick to say they need to do something in Israel

    Putin pulling strings there I wonder



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,049 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    the muslim brotherhood are **** certainly, but it is not quite true to say there was a popular uprising against them when they were elected to government.

    there were some protests certainly, but it was the military who used those protests as a means to overthrow the elected government because said government were going to take away some of the military's powers.

    the military didn't do what they did to preserve democracy or because they care about it, they don't and were as if not more brutal then what they replaced.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I find the triumphalism on this thread very interesting. Let’s say 1000 Israeli civilians are dead. The IDF go 20-1 as per SOP and kill 20,000 plus in Gaza.

    Whst happens next? Hamas cannot defeat Israel militarily? So they escalate and do this every month. It doesn’t take long before Israel runs out of people in the Gaza Strip to kill.

    There are no winners in this here, just 1,000s and 1,000s dead. Both sides would want to remember that rather than replying the undergraduate debates on structures of power and international relations.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,364 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    Again, please stop feigning ignorance. Closing their border is not the issue. The issue is the deliberate cutting off the supply of basic human necessities from the people of Gaza.

    Ships that attempt to bring food and water to dying kids in Gaza will have to brave serious threats of being blown out of the water.


    Some previous incidents:


    Alan Shatter denounced the killing by Israel of other activists trying to bring humanitarian aid into Gaza




  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 35,953 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde


    Insanity Is Doing the Same Thing Over and Over Again and Expecting Different Results''

    This is Israel. They are going to inspire another generation of terrorists, by killing the innocent, Hamas needs wiping out, not the innocent people of Palestine. Can you imagine the UK bombing Ireland, Dublin, Galway, Kilkenny, Cork, over the actions of the IRA, but his is what Israel does, and then terrorists are born from those actions, and they do the same to Israel. The innocent people on both sides suffer.

    Israel needs to be more precise in their actions, go in, and hunt those terrorists down, not kill kids with bombs from the air



Advertisement