The emergence of "Zombie" by The Cranberries as an Irish sporting anthem

And we can thank SF for that. They started all this because they don't like Irish people being reminded of their history. And they don't like the fact that most Irish people think the RA were a bunch of murderous, terrorist ****.

And what's your issue with what Leo said? Was he wrong?

Don’t worry. We’re ashamed you’re Irish too.

You think it's the few SF supporters on Twitter pushing this? Or the leaders of FFG out briefing the press?

I know the Cranberries were criticized in some quarters at the time for cashing in on terrorism with the song. I don't think that was the case for the band, but it's certainly what FFG are up to now.

Disgusting carry on.

Hello everyone.

I registered as I felt the need to clarify a few things on this issue. I skimmed through a few pages so apologies if I'm repeating what someone has already said.

There has been a lot of misunderstanding about the gripe that many people here in the north have towards this song. That she (Dolores O'Riordan) sang against violence is not the issue; 99.9% of people would endorse that message.

Criticising the song has got nothing to do with supporting terrorism.

The issue (and it's not just Dolores, she is just one of many that hold such a view in the south) is the one sided view of what took place up here, with an emphasis on what nationalists did combined with little regard for what nationalists went through (Joe Brolly has spoken much more on this prevailing attitude in the south). Ultimately (and this is the main gripe) she is a foreigner, writing a song about a subject she hadn't lived through nor had much knowledge of. The troubles had been going on 25 years, she had plenty of subject matter to go on if she really wanted to sing "an anti-war song".

What happend to those two young boys in Warrington was obviously an abomination, and the dignity shown by the parents has been very moving (the one we're most accustomed to is Tim Parry who has appeared on Ulster television over the years. An incredible human being who somehow is able to forgive). I'd witnessed ten years of violence at that point. The year previous to Warrington a 17 year old from my school (and a friend of my brother with both them musicians) was killed and we went to his funeral. While I never lost anyone in my family you were in the constant presence of death, including in my own housing estate when we heard a car bomb that took the life of an innocent young man (visiting his girlfriend), and then witnessing doors frantically being knocked in search of a nurse to try and save him.

The problem is this song should have skewered all violence, rather than just references to one side (again, a southern trait). At the very least she could have done some research, especially if you are going to be the public face of a song on the subject. The Newsletter (unionist newspaper) fully endorses the song, of course they would.

She could have gone to her local library in Limerick and read a bit.

Here's an Irish Times article (I cant post the link as a new user, so just Google the headline to read more)

Children of the Troubles: They took a child off the road, put a hood over his head and killed him

"Patrick Rooney loved horror movies and Halloween, and wanted to be a priest when he grew up. In August 1969, the nine-year-old was killed when the RUC fired into his home during rioting in Belfast, the first of at least 186 children to die in what would become known as the Troubles in Northern Ireland."

"When 14-year-old Philip Rafferty left his home in west Belfast to go to band practice, his mother, Maureen, made sure he was wearing his new winter coat. The next time she saw it was in a plastic bag at his inquest, saturated with blood. On January 30th, 1973, Philip was on his way home when he was abducted from the street by loyalist paramilitaries. He was taken to the Giant’s Ring, outside Belfast, where they hooded him with his coat, beat him, and then shot him several times. The night before, the same UDA gang had shot and killed another teenager, Peter Watterson, who was standing outside his mother’s newsagents on the nearby Falls Road. Philip and Peter were among a number of victims of sectarian murders of Catholic children carried out by loyalists at that time."

"Of the children killed during the course of the Troubles, 80 per cent were Catholic. Twenty-nine per cent of deaths took place in west Belfast, and 24 per cent in north Belfast. Together they represent 95 fatalities, more than half of the children killed as a result of the Troubles. Two-thirds of children’s deaths took place in Belfast and Derry."

That's just that's some cases, there are of course plenty of young protestant kids who were killed.

All deaths of innocent civilians (and in this case children) were abhorrent, which the song doesn't represent. It's a song of phenomenal ignorance given her lack of knowledge on the subject, and arrogance to think she had the stature to produce it.

Attacking irish people in the north is a form of southern snobbery. A holier than thou attitude. "Look at those troublemaking Irish northerners" is what the song encompasses. Perhaps those who do it do so because they feel being of the same faith/identity they can. The "West Brit" label somewhat covers this type of attitude, certainly in terms of constantly looking at it from one side. Just to be clear on the West Brit mention, I brought it up as it's a known phrase. While I'm Irish I hold both an Ireland and a UK passport and have no issue regarding Brits (nor should we given the immense amount of British culture we consume). No truck with violence, bigotry etc.

Ultimately, the song is from a foreign source and does not represent what it could have had the writer of it properly done research on what she was singing about.

Just reading through the comments and thought I'd quote this, as I think you're getting the gist of this issue.

This place has developed an echo.

FFS get over yourself. We don't need essays explaining every incident and aspect of the Troubles. Most Irish people are probably well aware of what happened and many would have their own stories from th es or lived experience. No need for lectures.

This thread is about the song Zombie. Not the troubles as a whole. A song written by a young artist who was so disgusted by the actions of few who were killing children and said they were doing it in her name. She said they were not. And she was saying **** you to both sides who believed the killings were justified.

If the song upset nationalists in the north, it's because it held a mirror up to them and they didn't like what they saw.

So northern nationalists problem was Dolores was a foreigner ehh? Sounds a bit partitionist to me.....

Maybe DC77 regards themselves as British.

When you consider that a faction of FF cabinet ministers ran guns to the PIRA, it was a bit more ambivalent than that.

Plenty of people semi-supported the IRA especially prior to the killing of Mountbatten. I remember all sorts of people with various shades of sympathy. Lots would have been FFers. ("Sneaking regarders" was a phrase for people who deniably or secretly admired the IRA)

In those days SF were a minor afterthought down south. They didn't campaign widely though I remember they did have posters in the poorest of poor areas of Dublin. Simply adding up old ballot totals doesn't tell the full story of who supported whom.

There was a groundswell of public sympathy for the hunger strikers for instance and dislike of M Thatcher. Do you recall?

But anyway as I keep saying all this stuff is a distraction from here and now SF wowing students, construction workers, service workers and young middle-class types with their (so far unopposed, in the main) economic populism(-lite?) agenda.

Refuse to address SF on their (and the country's) core issue of economics between now and election day and what you could have is a SF government. So good luck with that. Absent anyone who will properly oppose them and articulate the case against socialism they are arguably in something of a can't-lose position. They can just walk across the finish line essentially.

Sad, as Donald Trump would say, very sad. Its so sad.

I'm appalled at how Irish rugby fans have allowed sectarian politics get in the door of the sport like this.

The wilful ignorance, the contempt for the nationalist population in the north and the reinforcing of rugby as a closed shop - the preserve of the haves who are so far removed from the experience of Irish people in the north at a dreadful time in our history - never mind the rest of the population.

I don't think any favours have been done here for rugby. All that's achieved is to alienate people and reinforce rugby stereotypes.

I think it's a real pity. There are many posters here, myself included, who if Ireland take a hiding tonight will be here after the game saying "I don't want Ireland to lose at any sport but thank Christ we don't have to listen to this rubbish anymore".

I can't understand why at a time everyone should be getting behind the rugby team this poison has been injected in to it.

It's not good.

I agree with much of what you say. Taking your first sentence, about the " faction of FF cabinet ministers ran guns to the PIRA", at least nobody can deny there was much more collusion between government and paramilitaries south of the border than there was collusion between government and paramilitaries north of the border.

Zombie is an excellent song, the people who planted IRA bombs in Warrington were not in our name any more than the few renegade FF politicians involved in the arms trial ( for smuggling arms to IRA) were in our name either.

Are Limerick hurling fans into sectarian politics also?

What a load of shíte.

Nonsense, there no contempt for northern population. Simple message in that song : Peace good. Murder bad.

embarrassing to read the awful sh6te “proud Irish men” are posting. Your a joke.

Amy Huberman, Lord Henry Mountcharles, Neale Richmond, Dr. Ciara Kelly, Bono, Donal Lenihan, Jennifer Carroll MacNeill, we have beaten them all, we have beaten them all!. Leo Varadkar, can you hear me? Leo Varadkar ... your boys took a hell of a beating! Your boys took a hell of a beating!"

I have a message for you in the middle of your anti Sinn Fein campaign. I have a message for you: We have knocked Ireland out of the rugby World Cup. Leo Varadkar as they say in your language in the bars around Baggot Street: Your boys took a hell of a beating! Your boys took a hell of a beating