Rugby world cup post mortem

Dick phelan · 17-10-2023 12:49am

Also I saw someone mention it's an opportunity missed because other teams will be better in 4 years. There's really no evidence for that. Welsh rugby is bankrupt and in serious trouble. Scotland appear to have very little coming through. Australia how will they be much better when interest and participation keeps declining in favor of Aussie Rules. I actually expect in 4 years time for the top 4 or 5 teams being the same as they are now. Even the club game in England is facing serious issues although I expect they will remain a top side through sheer weight of numbers.

Piskin · 17-10-2023 2:54am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248001#Comment_121248001

It was fatal..

Piskin · 17-10-2023 2:58am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248134#Comment_121248134

Well said and needs to be said. WE are a joke when it comes to the greatest stage

walshb · 17-10-2023 8:10am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248134#Comment_121248134

The fact you straight away are calling them frauds kind of bars the rest of the nonsense you have written. Just shows you are delighted with the loss, which allows you to have a rant.

TheCitizen · 17-10-2023 8:40am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248057#Comment_121248057

C’mon now.

FrancieBrady · 17-10-2023 8:45am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248486#Comment_121248486

Go watch it.

He was active around the ruck for the very last play trying to keep the ball moving.

He was not 'standing still' in the middle unable to move for that entire last play as stated.

I.E. 'he was out on his feet' is a totally wrong take.

Like everyone else on the field he was tired.

After that, second guessing the decision a coach is paid to make, because you have the benefit of hindsight and a bee in your bonnet about one player is wrong. Or pointless. Take your pick.

mascher8933 · 17-10-2023 9:52am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248498#Comment_121248498

In the final Phase Ireland were trying to engineer a penalty that would enable a kick to the corner and a maul which would have most likely got over for a try. Sexton was experienced to know this and not risk anything loose. Prior to that Ireland went 40/50 metres up the field to get into that position, with Sexton marhsalling. Unfortunately it did not materialise but I (and the obviously Andy Farrell) trusts Sexton in that position to organise and keep the structure. The move ended due to a bad clearout from McCarthy. Not a Sexton issue

FrancieBrady · 17-10-2023 10:04am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248738#Comment_121248738

Totally agree here. I posted that exact same take earlier. Except I think Barnes was extremely harsh on the team going forward when ignoring multiple infringements and particularly Whitelock not releasing in the final play.

Sexton, the player 'out on his feet' was buzzing around that final ruck doing the marshalling as you say. I too believe he was trying to engineer a penalty, based on previous success with the lineout maul and the phenomenal NZ defensive line that was proving difficult to breach late in a gruelling game. The correct play in my opinion.

Podge_irl · 17-10-2023 11:21am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248132#Comment_121248132

Aside from Hansen potentially being not 100% I'm not sure how any of this impacted the QF.

If the matches had fallen differently we would have planned differently. As it is he basically used Tonga/Romania as warm up games for the first team. People love to moan about squad depth, but I can't see what impact it had here. We had quite a good injury slate compared to everyone else tbh.

TheCitizen · 17-10-2023 1:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248784#Comment_121248784

Nah.

They’re a great team and an excellent manager but they were favourites in that game with the bookies in New Zealand and elsewhere and with the pundits. So when they come up short there were a few things that were part of that on Ireland’s part. Among those the line out, the scrum and the difficult one for you Johnny Sexton playing the full 80.

In my view I think it’d have been great to bring someone like Sexton with his experience on in the last 10 to 20 minutes in a situation like that but I’ve read elsewhere that he wouldn’t be up for that kind of role? Seeing as he started I’m of the view that fresh legs at 10 could have been crucial at that point. Might be a slight minority view? but I’m certainly not the only one that thinks that. That view and others of what might have been will prevail until the next time Ireland get to a quarter final.

FrancieBrady · 17-10-2023 2:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121249847#Comment_121249847

When you are paid to make the in-game calls, get back to us.

When you are getting paid I will make sure to challenge those exaggerating the effects of your decision making just to have a go at a player they clearly don't like.

How's that?

Podge_irl · 17-10-2023 2:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121249847#Comment_121249847

but I’ve read elsewhere that he wouldn’t be up for that kind of role?

I'd suggest you stop reading whatever establishment came out with that claptrap.

TheCitizen · 17-10-2023 3:05pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121249892#Comment_121249892

Who’s exaggerating now. LOL

FrancieBrady · 17-10-2023 3:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121250242#Comment_121250242

Yeh, it's so easy to do.

TheCitizen · 17-10-2023 3:25pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121250249#Comment_121250249

Especially for you.

OldRio · 17-10-2023 3:38pm

Still bleating on about Sexton. Unhealthy.

aloooof · 17-10-2023 3:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248738#Comment_121248738

a maul which would have most likely got over for a try.

It'd have given us a shot at it, but I certainly wouldn't have it in the "most likely got over for a try" category. That's far too strong imo.

FrancieBrady · 17-10-2023 3:56pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121250435#Comment_121250435

Well they had done it twice. And would have learned from the held up one.

hahashake · 17-10-2023 4:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248204#Comment_121248204

Side note: Rugby League is the biggest rival to Rugby Union in Australia. AFL is more of an indirect rival. Geographically RL & RU are popular in the same regions. RU is more of a private school sport with some suburban & rural community + immigrant support, whereas RL has much wider appeal. The silver-lining for Australia is that you can transfer players fairly easily between codes depending on the position, and some kids grow up playing both. AFL regions have always been relatively untapped but you would think there would be plenty of potential RU backs going by skillset and body-type.

Lions tour + next RWC should hopefully give them enough of a boost to at least not go backwards.

aloooof · 17-10-2023 4:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121250483#Comment_121250483

They also would've had to win the lineout tho. It'd have given us a great shot at it, but I think "most likely" is just too strong.

mascher8933 · 17-10-2023 4:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121250540#Comment_121250540

The Lions tour, especially to Australia is embarrassing and should be scrapped but thats another thread entirely

mascher8933 · 17-10-2023 4:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121250547#Comment_121250547

NZ would not have competed if it was a line out and would have prepared to defend the maul

But our actual forward substitutions were on top and we had the better of NZ in that dept will never know

hahashake · 17-10-2023 4:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121250561#Comment_121250561

Perhaps but it's a money-spinner for all sides so won't be.

jiltloop · 17-10-2023 4:25pm

I'm still absolutely gutted about that exit. The most frustrating thing is that Ireland didn't play at their best, it was there for the taking if they had got the performance right but they didn't. Despite the shambles of a draw, we still should have been in the final.

I would be very hopeful that given a more sensible draw in the future we will break the QF curse. Also I think the acheivements and performances of this team have been incredible and there is a lot to be hopeful for in the future.

As someone else stated, we should prepare for the next WC. Not just the 6N and the test series/tours. We need to do a full squad review and focus on geting the next generation of players up to speed for 4 years time. If can be competitive and maintain our high rankings in the interim (which we absolutely should be able to do) then great. But there should be a long term plan for the next WC. And I think Andy Farrell is the right guy to keep at the helm for the foreseeable future.

Field east · 17-10-2023 9:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121248784#Comment_121248784

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121250612#Comment_121250612

After every defeat the losing team mentions about lessons learned - said in a kind of standard/throw away remark / just to be saying something

well , after this WC , this LESSONS LEARNED comment is definately relevant. Ireland has come a long,long way in skills, etc, over the last , circa , 20 years. There was a time when we were very competitive for the first 60 to 70 minutes and then fell away because opposition being much fitter / more stamina . That day is gone now.

BUT lessons need to be learned now after this WC Eg

(1) We need to start the scrum straight , keep it straight and keep it up . Porter , I think, was pushing the wrong way- ref pointed it out but he persisted and fave back possession to NZ. We need to have a range of strategies when we lose the ball in the scrum

(2) in mauling near/ on the oppositions try line we need to MAKE SURE that the ball is in the possession of a player at the back of the maul. I could not believe what happened in the NZ match

(3) we need to ‘ play ‘ the ref’. If he has no problem with some of the NZ players being off their’lines’ at the throw ins then we should reciprocate at the oppositions throw ins. I wonder was it pointed out enough to the ref in the NZ match. The ref in the NZ match seem to have been prickly aboutt some of the play and blowing the whistle while letting other things go

(4) irl is at a disadvantage because of its relatively small pop and rugby still in the Cinderella bracket when compared to UK, France, NZ, Australia, South Africa so it is more challenging to amass a good number of Very skilled players and with the appropriate ‘bulk’ where required. This probably has a bearing on Irelands ability to rotate players in a tournament such as the WC. BUT it HAS to be done - otherwise players get exhausted, not rested up enough between matches and there is a higher risk of injury

Unflushable Turd · 18-10-2023 1:16pm

A question I’ve not seen posed, or maybe I have missed it, is how is a player still playing top class rugby at 38?

is player management, in that clubs like Leinster only play the top players in European matches and they can therefore play for longer, a good thing, or should they be playing week in week out and therefore the clubs are forced to look at younger replacements earlier?

Ireland looked jaded in that game, was it because they just can’t handle a game per week like that?

I am only throwing this out as a suggestion.

Podge_irl · 18-10-2023 1:25pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121254367#Comment_121254367

is player management, in that clubs like Leinster only play the top players in European matches and they can therefore play for longer, a good thing, or should they be playing week in week out and therefore the clubs are forced to look at younger replacements earlier?

Sexton has played 22 times for Leinster over the past 3 years, including missing many big games. Lots of replacements have been looked at.

Why was Sexton able to play at such a high level at 38? Cause he's not normal. He is a terrible example of anything really as he is a generational if not more talent.

Tommysocks11 · 18-10-2023 1:29pm

Ur right, was porter trying to win an early scrum penalty, just keep it up and keep square for first one anyway and see, also the all blacks were definitely encroaching on our line out but we didn't on theirs, if the referee isn't reffing it then work away but no point being the good boys, we just seem to try to be the non sinners but other teams push every limit. We need to wise up, and kelleher should have scored 100%, no excuse if in doubt stay in maul until he has more protection and then drop, very bad mistake to make that cost us the game and the opposition getting a drop out is a ridiculous reward.

riddles · 18-10-2023 1:38pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121254428#Comment_121254428

needing a trying at that stage was also a factor - given we had three points on offer at the start and a kickable penalty in the second half.

We saw in the France and SA the value of taking points on offer.

FrancieBrady · 18-10-2023 2:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121254478#Comment_121254478

We also saw the value of not doing it and going for the max.

Rugby world cup post mortem

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