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Hamas strike on Israel - Threadbans in op - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,005 ✭✭✭✭chopperbyrne


    No, HR say absolutely nothing if it was a personal statement not made while representing or advertising the company.

    Just reading the article, and it says she posted comments on LinkedIn.

    I don't use it myself, but as far as I know your employment history and current employer is a big part of your profile.

    If she had Wix listed as her current employer while making those statements on that platform, then there is grounds for disciplinary action.

    I would say that an immediate termination of contract for an employee of over four years however is going to be an easy win in an unfair dismissal case.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,649 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    No

    There is a process.

    Usually HR give a combination of 2 written warnings and a verbal warning followed by dismissal (differs from company to company).

    IE you're given a chance to stop. If you don't stop, then you get dismissed.

    I think this is fair, there's no surprises, people are given a chance to asses and change the situation, and there can be some degree of negotiation. (which is what we need, not the knee jerk reactions we're seeing)



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,911 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Doesn't apply in the case of gross misconduct. Immediate dismissal is possible in such circumstances.

    Supporting terrorist violence against your company's owners could well meet the definition of gross misconduct.



  • Registered Users Posts: 65,414 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    International humanitarian law came from the 1949 Geneva convention, which has been ratified by 196 states. That's pretty much the opposite of what you are saying that they were written and heavily influenced by the great state powers of the world.

    This is as close as a universal set of rules as can be got. But yes I agree with you, it's far from perfect. Bombing Hamas and killing thousands of innocent civilians including children, is within this law. How very tragic that may be.

    As I said, if you can "win" a war by turning the other cheek, you are on a higher moral ground. Like Ghandi did. But he had a billion Indians vs a few thousand Brits and they weren't surrounded by countries that all have stated they wanted to wipe them off the face of the earth either, that made that strategy a bit more viable 😂



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,657 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    She could really be only dismissed if found to be making offensive comments such as racist or homophobic ones. Criticising the Netanyahu regime (a political opinion basically) doesn't seem near enough grounds for dismissal.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 55,701 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Maybe they did their due diligence and were happy to sack. Maybe there wasn’t a need to go through what you’re suggesting. It’s not always an exact science when disciplining an employee



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,649 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    Exactly.

    Like they've done themselves no favors in the instant sacking. Moral will be crap in there now and will affect productivity. If they'd have sat down and discussed it could have all been avoided. But that moderate attitude is lost on Arabs and Israeli's... they're very extreme



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,297 ✭✭✭howiya


    South Korea is not subject to a blockade of any sort.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,826 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    It's obvious Israel has a right to defend itself under international law and is doing so in accordance with that.


    A ceasefire saves Hamas.


    Why would sunak go along with that. No matter what way it is presented for sale.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,649 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    You both could be correct.

    I still think it's for the WRC/Courts. And given this is Ireland I would guess that WIX will lose.



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  • Posts: 0 Nola Scary Hair


    “would suggest”

    You’re trying to guess my intentions here. Never mentioned anything about the border so am not bothered about it. The Hamas run ministry of health releases casualty figures for Gaza. I’d like to see a 3rd party figure for these if possible.

    “What would be sufficient? UN / Human Rights Watch Amnesty International?”

    If they were available, It would be interesting to see them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,763 ✭✭✭✭nacho libre


    Well at least you are consistent. Personally , in this hypothetical, I believe the Israeli employee should not be sacked. It's a dangerous road to go down if people can be sacked for expressing their political views.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,536 ✭✭✭✭Varik


    Going by the Independent it wasn't instant, she got told to stop and then kept going with more posts.

    It's called bringing a company into disrepute, if your boss wakes up to an inbox full of complaints from something you've done in a very public way you're getting fired.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,826 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    They might lose but they'll probably not mind either way. They also have to think of the safety and well being of their Jewish employees and protect them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 569 ✭✭✭Long Sean Silver


    every time Israel is attacked, they claim it's another Holocaust. they then use that to justify the murdering of innocent Palestinian children.

    the attack of Oct attack by Hamas was horrific and barbaric, but it was NOT a holocaust. such misuse of language is extremely unhelpful.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,649 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    If true, well then the process was followed and the dismissal is legitimate.

    Kind of strange in terms of morals isn't it? Like if I fully believed in X and my employer fully believed in Y, and Y and X are incompatible and seek to destroy each other, then why would I work for someone that believes so much in Y?

    I don't get it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 55,701 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Well, that is why people need to be careful and considerate as regards where and how they express themselves.

    We can't hide behind this "political views" for every case of where someone makes claims. I can say what I like because these are my "political views." That is a nonsense

    I think it was mentioned that Courtney hadn't one mention of the Hamas butchery during her political commentary in slating Israel. Not a whiff of compassion/condemnation for the October 7 massacre; she was so keen to jump on the Israel bashing bandwagon, that the October 7 massacre slipped her mind. And when I consider this, it is why I believe that she doesn't give a fiddlers about the situation, really.



  • Registered Users Posts: 55,701 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Exactly. She was (in their mind, and I'd agree) a threat to their company....had to be sacked.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,536 ✭✭✭✭Varik


    Seen a recent enough WRC ruling where a employee did something naughty in the bathroom of another business he got arrested and charged but not yet convicted and it was reported in the papers.

    Employer fires him, he goes to WRC and loses. You don't have to have done anything bad or illegal just get your name out there in a negative way.

    And then there's the case of a Irish rail working maiming 2 women in a drunken car accident getting sent to prison, fired while in prison and somehow wining at the WRC as they took too long to fire him.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,967 ✭✭✭Cordell


    It depends where and when and how you're expressing those political opinions. For example many of my political opinions that I can freely express in most places will absolutely get me sacked if I express them in my place of work or on social media accounts that are linked with my professional life - that is where my account also links me with my employer's by having my place of work and my role visible in the profile. It may be a dangerous road but we're not starting on it now, but we're already a long way in. And she was supposed to know all this.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,287 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    It's only "true" to someone who's entrenched in a particular side and wants to portray a falsehood, or is too lazy to briefly google something.

    This is the flag of Hamas...


    This is the flag of Palestine...


    And the above has been pointed out to you before.



  • Registered Users Posts: 824 ✭✭✭Sir_Name


    From Amnesty

    UN - who actually have people on the ground within Gaza

    Latest: Occupied Palestinian Territory/Israel | OHCHR


    Anyone with a pair of eyes on their head, looking at social media, the news reports with the levels of destruction/pictures of injured would reasonably ascertain that +1,000 people have died within Gaza.



  • Registered Users Posts: 55,701 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    This is just it...one could agree 100 percent with Courtney's views here, but not agree that she can openly and publicly state these views while working for an Israeli company, and expect no comeback.

    It's about where and how one expresses their opinions and views, and that there can be consequences involved.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Nope, that's an Islamic shaddah it's not Hamas,it's seen all across the middle east and further afield sometimes in white,some times in green and sometimes in black,

    It's not the flag of hamas,for the most part the experts say Hamas has no actual flag , but then again that's Wikipedia for you



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,287 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    As much as you keep trying to squirm out of your lie, it'll still be a lie.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    You quoted Amnesty lol .

    Yeah unfortunately the UN are not counting casualties dead or otherwise they are reporting according to hamas what they are saying is the casualties



  • Registered Users Posts: 824 ✭✭✭Sir_Name


    Direct question - yes/no answer will suffice. Do you think +1,000 people have died in Gaza since Oct 7th.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,803 ✭✭✭Large bottle small glass


    The limitation on Israeli deaths is down to the limitation of Hamas's technology (and that of their brethren) not their ideology.

    Hamas want Islamic law on all middle east land and all Jews/Christians removed and will do whatever it takes to do.

    If they had the means it would be a holocaust cheered on a supported by a lot of the middle east and indeed Western universities and the like( on the basis of pre Israeli strike back demonstrations in London and elsewhere).



  • Posts: 0 Nola Scary Hair


    “Looking at social media”

    The last place i’d be looking for accuracy. Depends on who’s posting the info at the end of the day doesn’t it.

    ”the news reports”

    Again, where are they sourcing their info from? If it’s from Hamas only, you need to gauge for yourself how accurate are their figures.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 824 ✭✭✭Sir_Name


    At this stage you are being deliberately obtuse. If I was sprouting numbers like 10k+ maybe just maybe I would have conceded, however social media shows directly and I am not talking about reporting, its real time visible dead bodies injured parties. I am actually shocked that I even am explaining this.

    'If this was a school shooter, hiding out in a classroom when would it ever be morally acceptable to bomb the entire school.' Answer. Never.

    However this is whats happening to Palestinian people. For the love of god 50% of their population is under 18. That means 50% of the population were not in existence when Hamas (with the help of Israel initially might I add) were elected. That's not included an of the people who would even have been too young to vote. And people on here essentially cheering Israel on, I am ashamed of you all who are. I don't have all the answers, or solutions to this but what I do know this is wrong and this is not the solution.



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