Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

How would they "make off with the formulas"?

Baby formula is imported to China since they don't have the cattle herd or soy to make it..

I believe interest rates are a soft cost and are not captured in construction costs.

They are separate in the esri publications on the total cost of housing delivery.

I'm open to correction as always

People probably failing the stress tests to 5.5 or 6%.

That was the best time to be a renter being honest and continued for another 3 to 6 years depending on location.

Renting will always be a more favorable option if you are younger and single and want to be close to urban centres, maybe starting out in your career, moved to a new town or city and unsure if this will be a longterm move for you and you've yet to build up a deposit or mortgage approval earnings. But after that, once you become attached to an area, have the income to buy and/ or planning a family etc then buying absolutely trumps long term renting.

I think you may not have been about then because it wasn't about youth and renting. There were a lot of people taking delight in the house price crash laughing at people who bought property. People they knew who were living in remote locations and long commutes were paying higher mortgages than their rent close to the centre of things. People who got council support to buy property abandoning them as it was higher than rent.

Great time to rent and they thought it would never end no matter warnings. Then while supply was dwindling and rents rising they started getting mad claiming a coordinated plan to enrich politicians friends. The reality was rent was be subsidised by landlords well below true cost and were always going to recoup losses later if they could hold out. Tenants laughing at new charges added to landlords because they couldn't pass them on ignoring the fact that they would be passed on when they could.

Don't forget the public didn't want investment into the construction industry when the ERSI warned that there were not enough being built for the future. So the government didn't but that then became the government conspired to push house prices up.

Increasing restriction and charges on landlords was hailed by the general public but warning landlords would sell up were seen as nonsense. Even while it is happening people are still saying it isn't happening and claims the property doesn't disappear so it makes no difference yet we can see less property to rent and higher demand.

There are some people out there who think because they can see dangers from how things are think they are really clever. Very easy to do but everything has danger and you have to eventually decide what to do for yourself. I know there are houses in Dublin selling about the height of the market rate of the past, the difference is there are multiples of them not the odd one like it was at the peak. Property sales dropped before the crash and not many bought at the peak and many who weren't buying then don't realise this and think everyone bought at peak prices.

The public really have a lot to do with the situation and will always blame the government there is no magic party that can sort the mess the public pushed for.

If sustained for a long period it would more than likely just translate to less supply in low/mid priced as you would have less people trading up.

Such a completely limited view point as there are certainly more than 2 types of private landlords with many buying before the only period of time you seem to see.

There is a lack of gratitude because there is nothing to be grateful for. Nothing done has sorted the situation and leaves landlords subsidising tenants by penalty of law. If I had sold the property and invested in anything that rose in price you wouldn't expect me to be grateful and the same applies to property as nobody was trying to help landlords.

Magic savvy tenants who somehow know the financial situation of their landlords never existed. It is such fiction and insulting to both tenants and landlords.

I have no idea what you are talking about with my "general assessment of renter". The public were delight with very ill conceived ideas where they saw landlords funding them, the fact these policies are responsible for higher rents is being ignored.

Reports on availability of rentals and those for affordable rents are ignoring all the people who have below market rents. Landlords are paying for that but the very slight budget change does not compensate for the increased costs while rents are artificially kept low.

I doubt I will be contributing much more to the debate as their are certain people (get a mirror) who never really debate but just shout down people or just make the same argument proven wrong many times.

I have friends, family and work colleagues that I feel sorry for due to accommodation options. None of the reason are my fault or responsibility but there are those who will blame me just because I have property and expect me to be grateful because the property market is a mess. I am not and never will be grateful for bad planing even if people try to claim I benefited or even if I do that was never done for me.

You knew by the rent charged and word of mouth from other renters, and mostly avoiding lettings from EA. Some LL's were very open that this was there strategy

Falling rates environment meant landlords outgoings were falling also

Having a house with someone else paying the mortgage was the path to wealth in the 90's noughties for many

We just let get out of hand

But he welcomes debate! Even if these Sherlock deduction can be done it is only on some properties IF others are willing to give the information AND telling the truth. What we have here is the Yogi bear philosophy of being smarter than the average. Boo-Boo was actually the smart one

Having rented all through the recession along with my entire generational cohort, the notion of these supposed renters laughing it up at the expense of the poor long-suffering landlords is sheer self-justifying delusion.

BOI hiking variable rate by 0.25%. Are they playing catch up or are they ahead of the others?

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2023/1027/1413304-bank-of-ireland-mortgage-rates/

Its laughable honestly, looking back on previous houses and the state of them. I spent 3 years in a grungy apartment in the west that used to be student accommodation. I paid €550 per month they're now €1400 today on daft which is higher than better quality houses and flats in the same town. Best of luck is all I can say to them, clearly someone is a bit over leveraged and feeling the pinch on the other end.

No self pity there then.

If you want rents to come down, you need more LLs, if more LLs are to enter the market, you either need to entice them or at a minimum stop them from leaving. Alternatively, leave to the big investors who run it like any business should be run, for profit. No use whinging about apathetic LLs, there is apathy on both sides.

Do you not see the irony in your post?

Renting is a business as you rightly highlight but if you rig the market (this is the key phrase) then the participants will react accordingly. If you want a market then let it be a functioning market. Don't force it to be something it's not.

You know have a situation where the govt wants to legislate what a private individual does with their own private asset (a rental property).