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SCEP Scheme

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,994 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    Am I right in thinking that it could happen that for two farmers with the same reference number, that one that has more AI calves could fail the sire requirement and one with less could hit it?


    e.g. reference number 10.

    John has 5 calves - 4 of which are from qualifying AI bulls. Hits the 80%

    Pat has 10 calves. 7 of which are from qualifying AI bulls. Fails to hit the 80% ???



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,275 ✭✭✭tanko


    Depends what Pats other calves ore off, doesn’t have to be an Ai bull , can be a qualifying stock bull. If they’re off non qualifying Ai bulls then no he doesn’t hit the target.

    Im pretty sure that the 80% requirement has been waived for this year because farmers had their cows in calf last year before they knew what the terms and conditions of the SCEP scheme were.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,816 ✭✭✭Lime Tree Farm


    Is it not the females, heifers & cow's that the % is based on and not on females under 16 months.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,994 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    There is a requirement for bulls with enough stars as well. It increases over time as well. That is based on the parentage of the reference calves for that year



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,275 ✭✭✭tanko


    There’s a Teagasc webinar starting soon about the changes to the Eurostars, link on the Teagasc website



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  • Registered Users Posts: 484 ✭✭anthony500_1


    Have just put it on here now, will be interesting to hear where they are going with the stars



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,275 ✭✭✭tanko


    I think Pat needs a good lie down after that.

    They’re just making this shyte up as they go along, I wonder how many Suckler cows they have between them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 484 ✭✭anthony500_1


    Possibly the Greatest waste of an hour and a half of my life. And I've wasted plenty of hours.

    I really lost intrest when the lad talking about 7 million sperm in an ejaculate and only 1 fertilizes the egg. And you won't know which sperm won the race till you gene type the animal..........

    Biggest factor or change I can see is the Addition of carbon to how they determine the stars. Just moving the goal posts to suit the overall gov agenda from what I can see.

    I feel sorry for anyone with bb breading looks like they are going to take a massive hit in star ratings by the way they were talking



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,072 ✭✭✭bogman_bass




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,049 ✭✭✭Hard Knocks


    What will the day when BB weanling make good prices at next year’s weanling sales



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  • Registered Users Posts: 75 ✭✭V6400


    Anyone know if there’s anywhere to watch the webinar back? Did they give any straight answer on how they justify changing the rules now after the scheme started?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 670 ✭✭✭ABitofsense


    It will be up on ICBF & teagasc website they said. Not sure if it's up yet.

    I feel sorry anyone with BB stock as they'll be hit badly under the new stars. Anything that's genotyped 4/5 now and drop still qualify based on initial stars for SCEP.

    Very annoying there doing this after lads signed up based on their current herds.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,822 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    I think this will s a yearly contract and you can exit the scheme at any stage without penalty

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,275 ✭✭✭tanko


    Clueless as ever, it’s a five year contract and if you don’t stay in it for the five years whatever money you get has to be paid back.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,822 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    I taught they changed the rules this time that you can leave at any stage without having to refund the previous years. If I am incorrect I accept that but there was at some stage an indication that farmers were not going to be tied in for the five years

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,353 ✭✭✭Anto_Meath


    You can keep reducing your reference number number each year without any penalty. But you have to stay in the scheme for the 5 years. If you reduce your reference number this year you can bring it back up to its original reference number at any point over the course of the scheme.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,275 ✭✭✭tanko


    It’s up on the Teagasc YouTube channel now, all one hour fifty two minutes and eighteen seconds of it, enjoy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,994 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    Well there is a "penalty" in the sense that your payment will be reduced - but it will only be pro-rata. I think it is by a max of 20% of the previous year's reference number or something like that. You can't jump down to 0 for example.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,303 ✭✭✭✭Base price


    ICBF are to delay the new index changes for a week to enable further discussion with farmers.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 670 ✭✭✭ABitofsense


    Week wont do much to ease the worry people have. They should do some worked examples of the impact of the changes on some of the popular AI bulls so people can understand/see the impact the changes will have. So far the information being shared is very poor and an over complicated delivery of the information.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 239 ✭✭Fotish


    Did anyone else get an Invoice from ICBF for the SCEP scheme .

    I seem to have an Invoice of €252 for my 14 calves , that is € 18 each.

    i don’t remember hearing anything about it before now ?



  • Registered Users Posts: 315 ✭✭Rusheseverywhere


    That's the cost of genotyping to be fair cheaper then getting it done privately. If my memory is right I paid €25 per heifer for some 5 star heifers I was selling made no real difference to price I got.



  • Registered Users Posts: 239 ✭✭Fotish


    Thank you for that, I looked up the terms and conditions, see below, after seeing you mail and spotted the relevant condition.

    For some reason , I thought that the Dept covered this cost.!!


    What is the cost of genomic sampling?

    It costs €20/animal. A herd with a ref number of 30 will be sampling 21 animals (70%). This would be €420/year. The herd’s gross payment will be €4,275. The annual cost of genotyping, therefore, will be about 9-10% of a herd’s gross payment. This is down from approx. 14% under BDGP.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,865 ✭✭✭✭patsy_mccabe


    Well I passed my Bord Bia audit. Have one transgression to deal with, but it's something I want to do anyway. The animal remedies record was fine when printed from an MS Excel worksheet. That makes it easier going forward. Just copy and delete lines.

    Tags were on all cattle. Thanks to Cormac Tagging for that. All movements were on line too, so no hassle there. I did a lot of tidying up too prior to the inspection, so no harm

    'If I ventured in the slipstream, Between the viaducts of your dream'



  • Registered Users Posts: 239 ✭✭Fotish


    Do you not have to fill out the Animal remedies in the book that is supplied ?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 670 ✭✭✭ABitofsense


    That's only if you have no order way of tracking. I use HerdAp & then use Google forms for majority of other things. No issue with bord bia audit once all recorded that they want



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,865 ✭✭✭✭patsy_mccabe


    No, I never filled in the book for remedies, just purchased meal. I did use the same format as in the book though. I'd prefer an Excel version a lot more, as it gets rid of all the writing and withdrawal dates are calculated automatically. I even used conditional formatting to change the dates to red writing for those still in the withdrawal period.

    'If I ventured in the slipstream, Between the viaducts of your dream'



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 670 ✭✭✭ABitofsense


    New updates are live. The feckers have taken a dislike to my Purebreed LM with the changes!!! Good cut on some of them (one has dropped from 5 star to 3 star). My whole herd has shifted down and now ive more 3 & 4 stars. Thankfully all genotyped before this update so meet the SCEP conditions for the 5yrs.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,049 ✭✭✭Hard Knocks




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,275 ✭✭✭tanko


    About a quarter of mine have gone down a star, most stayed much the same, my overall replacement value hasn’t changed. Salers much the same, Sims and Lims slightly down. The whole thing is a joke, they’re not even trying to hide it any more. I might go to Carrick on Shannon tonight for the laugh to see ICBF getting an earful from the sucker farmers.



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