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Why some people think 9/11 was an inside job

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


    In order to assess the consistency of iron composition, it is necessary to compare the iron found in the Harrit tests with the iron found in WTC dust samples collected by the R j Lee group. This comparison will help determine whether the iron content is consistent between the two sources.

    Burning of the nanothermite chips, produced Iron.



    The R J Lee study does not provide a greater analysis on this particular matter, as it only observes a large mass of iron in the dust, which they believe was caused by the melting of steel and iron.

    The main point of contention revolves around the argument that fire alone cannot explain the observed melting of iron and steel in certain scenarios. While traditional fires can reach high temperatures, they are typically not sufficient to melt steel and Iron. This is where nanothermite comes into play ( like it or not)

    As mentioned, NIST (National Institute of Standards and Technology) does not believe that the fires in the World Trade Center were hot enough to reach the temperatures required for the melting of steel and iron. Therefore, it is necessary to consider an additional source of heat that could have caused this phenomenon.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,236 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    No, it was an analysis of the dust and what was in it. That's what you were presenting the study as before you realised that it disproved your theory.

    It didn't detect any of the byproducts of this nanothermite.

    Nor did it find any of the nanothermite chips you believe were there.


    So either the study is flawed cause they were incompetent or they are part of the conspiracy again.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


    Iron melted spheres in the Dust, as clearly stated by the R J group (fact one). However, the second fact presented by the group, claiming that fires caused this melting, is incorrect. There is no official study that supports this claim. So, if we discard this explanation, what are we left with?

    In conclusion, while the R J group has brought attention to the existence of iron melted spheres in the Dust, their claim regarding the cause of this melting lacks substantial support.

    Debunkers often dismiss the process and simply claim, "Look, they don't talk about nanothermite." However, this approach overlooks the flaws in their argument.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,236 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    Oh okay. So you believe that the study is false and incompetent cause they claimed the ironspheres were caused by the fire.

    Then the study is invalid and should be dismissed.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


     I do not blame the R J Lee group for their conclusions, it is possible that there is a lack of familiarity with the claims presented in NIST's study.

    R J Lee Group even today may not have read the NIST (National Institute of Standards and Technology) report and simply assumed that fires caused the steel to melt. It seems that not many people have taken the time to closely examine any of the other reports produced by NIST. Instead, they have relied on the belief that fire was the cause, as some government officials have stated.

    A comprehensive new investigation that brings together all anomalies into a collective review, followed by a scientific debate in court, is vital to ensure a fair and transparent evaluation of any issue..

    The NIST study on the collapse of Building Seven has faced significant scrutiny due to various problems raised by skeptics. The lack of transparency, incomplete investigation, controversial fire-induced collapse theory, and omission of critical evidence have all contributed to the controversy surrounding the study.

    The ongoing debate surrounding Building Seven underscores the need for prompt discussions and thorough investigations.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 18,037 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    You keep recycling the same stuff, luring people into "proving" it to you and dragging them into technical whataboutery.

    The equivalent of denying satellites exist, demanding people explain how they work, rejecting that, then going into vapid technical details about it.

    If something else occurred on 911 according to you, okay, detail it. Start with a basic timeline..

    (the fact that your story changes every time you attempt this should be a big red flag to even yourself)



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


    I agree with the moderator that we never agree on such issues, and this takes up debunker time and mine posting about it. Let's put 9/11 on the back burner for now. There is the UFO topic that has a better chance of changing people's opinions on conspiracy theory. So I think I only post in there from now on. 



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,575 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose




  • Registered Users Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭silliussoddius


    There is nothing in current UFOology that is going to change people's minds, just more empty promises.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭silliussoddius




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  • Registered Users Posts: 25,236 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    Very very strange. Cause when you originally posted that study you were declaring it infallible and that there was no reason to doubt any part of it.


    This was before you actually realised the study disproved your theory though.


    Also it's very very strange to claim that these guys who were experts in forensic investigations of building failures didn't read or weren't familiar with the report on how the buildings they were investigating collapsed.

    If that's the case then you're accusing them of being even more incompetent and thus the study is even more invalid and dismissable.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,839 ✭✭✭✭The Nal


    Have you seen the video where Larry Silverstein admitted talking to the Fire Department and telling them to go ahead and pull the building?


    No. No one has because thats not what happened. He told them to "pull" the firemen out of there. Pull the rescue operation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,575 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose




  • Registered Users Posts: 25,236 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    The actual full statement is:

    "I suggested that they should pull it. And they made the decision to pull."

    So if we are to believe that this can only be referring to a controlled demolition and that everything he said is inerrant gospel, then this means that Larry wasn't the mastermind of the plot. It was some FDNY chief.

    Weird how conspiracy theorists don't seem to want to chase down this guys identity given how he out ranks even someone like Silverstein.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭silliussoddius


    But it’s a picture with added text taken from the internet, it’s not the kind of thing people just make up.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


    On the day in question, firefighters were actively engaged in fighting a fire at building 5, which took priority over any other operations. This fact alone casts doubt on the claim of a rescue operation taking place at seven at that specified time. The firefighters' presence at the scene of the fire further supports this argument. It's a false claim I read often.

    Moreover, there is video evidence that a CBS reporter was inside building seven at 3 pm. During his time there, the reporter encountered an individual who was behaving strangely. This person identified themselves as a secret service agent and claimed to be clearing out the building of individuals. However, it is important to note that the validity of this person's claims was later called into question.

    In the years that followed, this individual was charged with fraud for stealing cars. What makes this story even more peculiar is that the thefts occurred at ground zero, adding an additional layer of intrigue to the situation.

    Based on the information presented, it is evident that there was no rescue operation at building seven, as claimed in the false post heree/

    However, it is important to note that the term "pull it" can have different meanings in different contexts. In the context of controlled demolition, it refers to the deliberate use of explosives to bring down a building in a controlled manner. Some argue that Silverstein's use of this term suggests his involvement or prior knowledge of the events on 9/11.While the suspicion surrounding Larry Silverstein's role in the collapse of the World Trade Center towers persists, it is important to approach the issue with caution. The lack of concrete evidence linking him to the controlled demolition of Building 7 leaves room for doubt regarding his direct involvement. Until substantial evidence emerges, it is reasonable to consider the possibility of Silverstein's innocence. Either way, some people did it, who exactly did the mystery?



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,037 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Silverstein was not admitting on national TV to blowing up his own building. You keep trying to distort it at every attempt into something it isn't. Which in itself is telling.

    You have never once presented any credible evidence of a "controlled demolition" of any the buildings. Just the same lazy innuendo that Alex Jones et al use.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,236 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    Again you're presenting things with this air of authority and objectivity that no one is going to buy.

    There's no mystery or debate about Silverstiens statements. It's simply that conspiracy theorists like yourself are wrong about it. They are inventing a fantastical, nonsensical story about out of context quotes to prove their prefered beliefs. Then of course avoiding any discussion or doubt about that story.

    It's ridiculous for you to argue that it's impossible that he's referring to a fire fighting operation real or planned, but then argue that he might be confessing on camera for no reason.


    Your rambling about stolen cars is complete distraction and has no bearing on the point brought up.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,839 ✭✭✭✭The Nal




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


    From the same poster who lied about JFK wounds, it is no surprise that they continue making nonsensical arguments about the event at 9/11 too.

    Fact: If there were a fire fighting effort at WTC7 prior to its collapse, there would be evidence of it in the form of pictures and videos.

    Additionally, it is known that a CBS reporter was given exclusive access to a street near WTC7 between 2pm and 3pm on 9/11 (video online of it) During this time, there were no fire trucks or firemen actively hosing down the building, further reinforcing the conclusion that there was no fire fighting effort at this location.

    Again, I don't care who did it; it's not my job to figure that out. It is clear as day to anyone who looked at the 9/11 event that people in the government back in 2001 covered up a wide range of things related to the event. These cover-ups included various aspects of the financing of the hijackers.

    You should start asking questions about why people in Saudi intelligence and ISI used intermediaries to finance an Al-Qaeda attack against an ally.

    These questions are completely ignored by some because they are uncomfortable questions on preknowledge and the role of elites in getting some young men to hijack planes. People want to be stuck in the mindset of bin Laden being the mastermind of it all hiding out in deep cave. The media totally ignore the fact that with those with knowledge about Al Qaeda (outside the elite) was arrested, captured, killed, and sent to Guantanamo Bay concentration camp. All the Al Qaeda narratives are solely based on forced confessions.In conclusion, the construct surrounding 9/11 is widely believed to have been influenced by the CIA. 



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  • Registered Users Posts: 18,037 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    You state the buildings were "blown up", yet you never support that with credible evidence.

    Whenever you are ready to actually start supporting that claim, feel free.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


    Where is your friend tonight?

    I often support it, but it seems you dismiss the scientific evidence and anomalies as insignificant problems.

    You fail to provide a reasonable explanation for the fire's involvement in all the observed phenomena. Moreover, you refuse to engage in a debate regarding controlled demolition.

    If you possess an alternative theory that can explain everything through fire, go ahead. I have made claims supported by evidence, but certain posters have dismissed or misinterpreted these statements. 

    Scientific evidence of omission and fraud is found in a government investigation into the Building Seven collapse; how is that not credible evidence?

    Another aspect that fuels skepticism is the NIST's stance on data release. The agency has faced criticism for withholding certain pieces of information. Critics argue that the lack of transparency in releasing the full dataset hampers independent analysis and further fuels doubts. 

    There may be no issue for you here, but it is definitely a very curious way to do things when you claim that everything here is due to the fire.NIST has consistently played up the national security card to justify their actions and deflect criticism. By invoking national security concerns, NIST has been able to shield itself from scrutiny and hinder scientific discourse. This strategy has not only hindered independent analysis but has also contributed to the perpetuation of conspiracy theories surrounding 9/11.

    You can call them cranks and fraudsters, but in my view, the AE911 truth community has clearly shown problems with the study that would undermine their entire hypothesis.

    Only other studies that I am aware of involved a court case, but we do not have any actual documentation or works available online from that particular case. However, based on the information we have, the collapse is believed to have occurred on the 10th floor.

    The NIST hypothesis suggests that the collapse started on the 12th and 13th floors. However, it is important to note that there are several discrepancies among these studies. Each study presents a different version of events, leading to confusion and disagreement among researchers.

    ----------

    Warning applied for ignoring mod instruction

    Post edited by Hannibal_Smith on


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,037 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    According to you it was an insurance scam by Silverstein, then it was all about the Saudi's, then you got into all that Barry Seal stuff, then it was all the CIA when you discovered the complaints from that one FBI guy, then you decided it was "secret Nazis", and now you're have hybrid mixes of .. everything.

    We have seen plenty of creative writing, but absolutely nothing approaching supporting evidence.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


    NIST's own statements prove them wrong, yet you continue to be in denial. The NIST Twin tower report maintains that fires in the Twin Towers reached temperatures only around 1,000 degrees Celsius for a short period of time. However, this assertion contradicts the R J Lee group's claim of evaporated lead and finding buckets full of molten iron microspheres in the WTC dust.

    Furthermore, NIST asserts that no steel in the Towers melted.Debunkers may dismiss these anomalies, but I provided evidence directly from FEMA that stated steel melted during the 9/11 attacks. Regardless of their working theory on how that occurred, the fact is that it did happen. Why does NIST ignore mainstream scientific reporting?

    FEMA even said that melting could have occurred before the collapse, therefore they very much open this phenomenon could have accelerated the collapse on 9/11 at the twin towers.NIST came along two years later and just ignored all the strange anomalies that may explain the collapse?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


    A plausible explanation for the building collapse is that the CIA may have been infiltrated by bad actors from different countries. The CIA's global operations make it vulnerable to infiltration by individuals with malicious intent. Example of this Reinhard Gehlen, a German NAZI intelligence officer during World War II, was one such individual.Reinhard Gehlen was a key figure in shaping post-war intelligence operations in Germany. After the collapse of the Nazi regime, Gehlen was recruited by the CIA to establish an intelligence network in Eastern Germany. This network, known as the Gehlen Organization, supplied valuable information to the CIA regarding Soviet activities in the region.

    When you gather a entire list of bad people from diverse backgrounds, including various faiths and religions, as well as individuals with different agendas in the Middle East, there is a potential for creating rogue actors. The statement by John Bolton and Lesley Graham provides a stark reminder of this danger. Nuke everyone if they could, and yet you're trying to convince me that there couldn't be people like this that got organized to use 9/11 for their agenda?

    The list of suspects in such cases is often limited due to the stringent criteria required. The individuals or groups responsible for such acts generally require a certain level of power and access to pull off such a feat on 9/11.

    You Thought Was All Nonsense About Saudi Links Years Ago, Until the Mainstream Picked It Up and Showed You to be Wrong.You changed your argument, oh well, maybe people within the Saudi government knew, but it is unlikely the Royal Family of Saudi Arabia sanctioned it.It was a claim you made years ago that Al Qaeda did not receive support and trying to cover up those postings I made.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,037 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    A plausible explanation

    You then proceed to make up something in your head.

    From your posts it comes across like you think that history is just "made up" by people. And you are simply joining in by making up your own history that appeals to you.

    You Thought Was All Nonsense

    Nope. I always maintained that people in Saudi would have known about the attacks (considering 15 of the hijackers were Saudi). It was determined that the Saudi leadership weren't behind the attacks and that hasn't changed.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,236 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    Fact: it makes zero sense for why Silverstein would confess on camera.

    Fact: his statement is incompatible with the rest of your theory as he says that a firechief was behind the whole plot.

    Fact: he was referring to a *planned* fire fighting operation. This explanation is far more plausible thay anything you can provide. Which is why you have to keep lying about what people's argument is.

    Fact: you and your fellow conspiracy theorists have never addressed any of the problems around this claim. You just dumb the quote, then run away and throw out more distraction points. The questions are ignored entirely.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,236 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    Remember though, it was only 8 people. One of which must have been Silverstein, one of which must be a fire chief and one must be someone from the BBC.

    And that these people did all of the research to know that the planes wouldn't be able to destroy the buildings. They developed this untested method of demolition. They managed to find super secret highly advanced nanothermite. They planted it all in a weekend. And at some point also maybe organised a pair of planes to do the whole thing at the Pentagon.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


    During the invasion of Iraq in 2003, the Saudis played a crucial role in assisting the United States in its military operation. Saudi Arabia eventually offered logistical support and intelligence coordination, helping to fuel the war effort. This cooperation shed light on the behind-the-scenes dealings between the Saudis and the CIA and Isreal, showcasing their shared strategic objectives.

    Despite what you believe, there is evidence to suggest that the Saudis were running intelligence operations years before the 9/11 attacks. One such incident was the Air West Flight 90 incident, which occurred in early 1999.

    The 9/11 hijacking was primarily a payment system where intelligence operatives used unwitting people from the Middle East to carry out terrorist attacks on America. The operatives would manipulate the unsuspecting individuals into believing that they were engaging in a jihad, or a holy war, when in fact their true purpose was to get America involved in a war against their enemies.

    The pilot of Flight of 93 ( Ziah Jarrah) has a notable family history of espionage. In 2009 and 2007, it was made public that his uncle and cousin were exposed as Israeli spies in Lebanon. They had been turned to spy on Hezbollah,  There is a remarkable problem that has emerged regarding a family who is believed to have been spying for Israel. This family, in question, has been linked to the tragic events of 9/11 

    Some information about his uncle very little of anything about his cousin.

    All this proves that the narrative around 9/11 is clearly false and that there are a whole bunch of fellas involved in 9/11 who have different dealings or goings on with different intelligence figures and people in the Middle East and the west. Dry runs to takeover planes are highly suspicious behavior and knowing how the hijackers were all financed clearly indicates an intelligence operation, rather than an Al-Qaeda operation. It is possible that gullible individuals from Al-Qaeda were used as a source of muscle, but it is unlikely that they were actively involved in the planning and execution of the attacks.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


    During 9/11, when the entire area was engulfed in dust and recovery efforts were underway, it made no sense for the Fire Chief to call Silverstein. Phone lines would have been extremely unreliable, making it an unlikely means of communication. Additionally, it raises questions as to why the Fire Chief would reach out to Silverstein, especially considering his absence from work that day. The absence of any mention of how they got Silverstein's number further complicates the situation.

    The claim made in the phone call is directly contradicted by numerous videos and photographs that clearly show the absence of firefighting activity in Building 7 during the afternoon. These visual records serve as reliable evidence, corroborating the official narrative that there was no firefighting effort in that building at the time of the collapse.

    There are two possible explanations as to why the person in question may have attempted to insert themselves into the story of 9/11. One possibility is that they may have acted out of ego, seeking attention and validation by associating themselves with a tragic and significant event. Alternatively, the person may have inadvertently made a slip of the tongue, revealing their true concerns about the possibility of controlled demolition. This slip may indicate that they had been privately concerned about the events surrounding 9/11 and had inadvertently revealed their thoughts. 

    The phone call in question appears to be fabricated based on the available evidence.Where Silverstein got himself in a spot of trouble when he made the claim that the building collapsed and the "pull it" was connected. His own language seemed to link the two events, raising suspicions and causing controversy.



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