Hamas strike on Israel - Threadbans in op - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

One of the memories that I can't unsee is when ISI paraded their prisoners, handcuffed and dressed in vivid orange jumpsuits (Guantanamo style) before executing them by beheading them, except for the Jordanian Pilot who they burnt alive. For me, Hamas and ISIS are one and the same thing. There is no difference in either their methods of terror or global aims of an Islamic Caliphate. The Palestinians are just a means to an end for them, nothing more.

I don't accept that the video doesn't exist or never existed. You state that you accept they burned civilians.

We have abundant evidence also that they streamed horrific footage of their the attacks, footage which was then taken down by responsible media outlets. Therefore it is plausible than someone saw footage of one of these horrific acts. It is baffling therefore why you would go to such lengths to dispute it.

"I accept that Hamas committed atrocities?"

Do you miss the step where you were asked to condemn them also? Why are you incapable of giving a straight answer to this question?

And as has been pointed out to you multiple times, and you have offered zero defence, you never post the line "you are making claims, it is up to you to prove them" to anyone making such claims about alleged Israeli atrocities. Only ever Hamas ones.

Therefore your posts here are not to advance the truth or set some bar for evidence, they serve the purpose of muddying the waters of atrocities you accept Hamas committed. If your posts are not intended to act in defence or support of Hamas, that is not the way to go about it because that is the impression they create.

The truth is that Hamas committed atrocities, including deliberate targeting and brutalisation of civilians, including burning of them. That is the truth we must not lose sight of.

No ok. Not going to fall for your attempted distraction. You are the one inserting yourself into the debate questioning claims about atrocities.

You were asked a simple question:

"I accept that Hamas committed atrocities?"

Do you miss the step where you were asked to condemn them also? Why are you incapable of giving a straight answer to this question?

And your response is whataboutery and deflection and paragraphs of text... anything but come out and condemn without reservation Hamas for the atrocities you accept they committed.

And yet you have never questioned similar claims about Israel, proof positive it is not done with regard to establishing some bar for evidence - so no you do not hold them to the same standard. Exactly what we would expect from a Hamas defender and supporter. And that's exactly what we get.

Under international law, there was a ceasefire on October 6th, then on October 7th, Hamas were the aggressor, giving Israel the right to self-defence under international law. You cannot have a right to self-defence under international law unless you are attacked by an aggressor who is not acting under their right to self-defence. So, unless and until Israel overstep the mark e.g. keep attacking Hamas after the hostages taken on 7/10 have been released, then the answer to your question is no.

This has been explained to you multiple times.

You haven't condemned Hamas for the specific atrocity you were asked to, the atrocity you were happy to post paragraphs about discussing earlier. Strange that.

You stated earlier that you accept Hamas burned civilians, you accept that Hamas inflicted atrocities on civilians - this is all in the content of your posts from today. I haven't picked some random atrocity out of the blue.

And yet instead of just accepting and then condemning Hamas for those atrocities against Israeli civilians, instead we get post after post dodging the question, whataboutery or vague indirect responses, and now attacking the poster querying why you can't give a straight answer. Anything but just bloody condemn Hamas for atrocities against civilians. So your continued refusals to condemn Hamas for atrocities against civilians is revealing.

Case in point for those who somehow think there are no Hamas supporters on the thread, when someone is unable to bring themselves to condemn Hamas for atrocities they accept they committed, that is a Hamas supporter and defender.

One of the requirements to exercise the right to self-determination is that you extend that right to others. Given that the Palestinians have elected and maintained in place a regime that seeks the genocidal elimination of the Jews, the answer is that the Palestinians currently don't have the right to self-determination.

Telling the entire population of an area to move? Or do you mean giving a warning to civilians, before you take action, thereby giving them time to move away from the area? Not a war crime, the opposite in fact.

Turning off power, water, internet? Why do you feel Israel should have to supply these to another country? Surely Hamas and all the money they have received the past 20 years, have invested in such infrastructure in their own country? No?

And without investigation, we don't know if war crimes have been committed, and I know about war crimes, I wouldn't begin to decide whether war crimes have been committed, without knowing what actual evidence there is. The real evidence collated by investigators, not some Joe on the internet!