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N8/N25/N40 - Dunkettle Interchange [open to traffic]

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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,563 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    Indeed. The whole project was sold on the idea that it would eliminate peak hour queues - while the situation has certainly improved on some routes, was it really worth sinking - what, quarter of a billion? - to have little effective improvement to, and even a worsening of in some respects, the East - West corridor which carries the largest volume of traffic? Sticking queueing traffic signs up before they've even finished seems like a case of "sorry lads, it didn't work out". And as you point it, it was predictable really - there's no way to eliminate queues N25W - Tunnel while only giving this route one lane.....but no way to make it freeflow otherwise.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,563 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    I usually take this rat run as well - it definitely knocks a couple of minutes off. Of course, it's more direct to go straight through town as I did for years (to Western suburbs) but given the new commuter - hostile road layout and traffic light timings along the quays, in tandem with the Dunkettle shenanigans, the longest route is actually the quickest - which would seem to fly in the face of the green agenda given the associated greater carbon emissions.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25 Glanmirelad


    It occurred to me this evening if they had only knocked a extra 20 meters of the old retaining wall as you exit the tunnel on the left heading north, and replaced it with a new one set further back , they'd have have three dedicated lanes exiting the tunnel with a very gradual transition into the slip for the city . As it is , as you exit the tunnel it looks like it widens into a hard shoulder lane but then narrows to a few feet again.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    We also don't want traffic passing through the middle of cities where people are trying to live. Competing priorities....



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,902 ✭✭✭Chris_5339762



    In ways it is though. N40E in the evenings... well... everyone assumed that would be fixed but no-one realised that the Mahon junction merging was just as much of an issue as the lights at the tunnel exit.

    N25W in the morning - there is absolutely no need for two lanes.... that should never have been built. All its causing is an unnecessary merge. The LIttle Island West junction merging into this flow is bad enough, but the 3 into 1 will be an even bigger disaster.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 707 ✭✭✭cork_south


    Agreed both N40E and N25W are big disappointments at the moment.

    But both still have speed restrictions in place, while N25W also has 750m of a coned off lane - will need to wait until Feb before we can call it I think.



  • Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭Baldilocks


    Heading south through the tunnel, on N40W, the speed restrictions could be lifted at the top of exit from the tunnel - no need to have them in operation for so long. Very few people are adhering to them anyway.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,563 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    Extending the N25W coned off section will make SFA difference - in fact it may make things worse as it merges at almost the same location as the slip from Little Island. Don't forget the M8N / Dublin traffic also has yet to be routed down the 'tunnel slip'. Only a small number are obeying the speed restrictions as well. Basically, it's as good as it's going to get already. Should have spent the cash on another tunnel bore maybe!



  • Registered Users Posts: 707 ✭✭✭cork_south


    I disagree about the speed limit not making a difference, traffic is braking hard on N40E due to the speed restrictions as it makes it's way around the bend after the Mahon slip due to the speed limit signs. This is certainly adding to the tailbacks in the N40E in the evenings.


    I also think opening that blocked off lane on N25W will help as the merging lane will be shorter. Currently you have cars merging from multiple points along the existing coned off lane.

    Also, why will M8N traffic merge to this slip?



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,563 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    I hope you're right re Mahon and the speed limit but I dunno TBH!


    With the merging lanes you'll have three becoming one in the space of about 50 metres - can't see that being anything less than slow. At least with one merging earlier, it gets one lane going again somewhat before next merge. Again, hope I'm wrong!


    I probably worded it poorly re M8N and slip etc. What I mean is that once they open Link....K is it?.... traffic for the M8 North (Watergrasshill and beyond to Dublin) will be taking the offramp from the N25W towards the tunnel and peeling off to the left - rather than continuing straight on to the Tivoli roundabout as present - meaning increased traffic on the offramp.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 707 ✭✭✭cork_south


    I'm not saying the removal of restrictions will fix all the tailbacks but I believe they will help so am holding judgement until February.


    In fact the cones on N25W were finally removed this morning freeing up 750m of new lane and it has made a big difference. Tailbacks still exist but traffic is flowing way better.


    Ah right, I get you re traffic to M8N from N25W now.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,586 ✭✭✭KrisW1001


    It was sold on reducing peak-hour queueing delays, not removing them... only a fool would promise elimination (yes, I know some local politicians made this claim; my point stands). It has reduced delays, but because traffic has been increasing since covid, and the works themselves are disrupting some flows it feels like things have got worse. There is definitely an element of induced demand at work here too, as people think the new junction is some kind of silver bullet, and so make decisions that involve using this more than they would have before.

    This project was mainly sold on preventing peak hour queues on one movement from blocking traffic that was going in the opposite direction, which is what happened when the interchange was a roundabout. On that point it has definitely succeeded.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,902 ✭✭✭Chris_5339762


    Good to see the cones removed this morning... hopefully that will help and the 3-into-1 will work.


    The "old" merge was at the base of a small hill which really seemed to slow people down. The new merge isn't, so will hopefully be better.


    Certainly felt like it was moving better at about 715am when I came through, but I was a few minutes early.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,563 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    Very strange. Much better this morning, was all set to eat some humble pie re the newly extended merge towards the tunnel.........but it's coned off again! And yet there was zero queue whatsoever - straight through to the tunnel. In heavy rain at 8am on a Thursday in December. I'm confused! (but not complaining).



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,050 ✭✭✭niloc1951


    Perhaps the heavy rain slowed drivers on the N25 westbound with the effect of reducing the speed differential between the mainline and the 3 into 1 merge, therefore reducing the volume of the queueing vehicles.

    Post edited by niloc1951 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 366 ✭✭TheSunIsShining


    Maybe let the South Ring be the southern distributor altogether at this stage - that's what it is for a lot of traffic anyway - and be ambitious (!!!) and build an outer Ring Road as the actual bypass - Cobh to Passage to Carrigaline to Ballinhassig to Ovens to join to the new North Ring that we're going to get soon from Santa!!



  • Registered Users Posts: 366 ✭✭TheSunIsShining


    You know what.....I'm somehow or other thinking the same!



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,715 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    If this was China they'd have got planning to rip up the tunnel, replaced it with a bigger one and rebuild the entire interchange properly - all in the space of 6 months.

    Europe is ludicrous at infrastructure and Ireland is the worst. It's truly mind boggling.

    Once again we get second rate that doesn't fulfill the objective of what it's intended to do because as usual we cheaped out and always looking for the least we can get away with.



  • Registered Users Posts: 146 ✭✭Mrs Dempsey




  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 12,074 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    Yeah, let's all live in a communist autocracy where human rights are there to be trampled on and dissention leads to reeducation camps. Sure if it leads to better infrastructure, isn't it all worth it????? 🙄



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  • Registered Users Posts: 23,715 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    You make an interesting argument for an autocracy. While I wouldn't go that far, and don't agree with your recommendation, I think there is a discussion to be had for suspension of certain democratic rights wrt to infrastructure for a period of time to get the show on the road.

    Or we could just fix out processes and make everything faster and bigger.



  • Registered Users Posts: 566 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    It's me again to talk about signage. I believe the reason they didn't put City Centre signs here are due to the inclusion of multiple cities (I believe someone suggested this before too). TII are in the process of updating signage across the city at the moment and are using City Centre as normal for the N27 and other routes everywhere. However, all just have Cork as the only city on them. The inner city has been filled with new City Centre directional signage everywhere. However, Lower Glanmire Road by its junction with Water Street now has a new sign for straight to Waterford and Dublin, but right for Cork. In every other similar instance they said City Centre. This makes me think they're avoiding putting City Centre when there are multiple cities. This still doesn't explain not using Cork (Centre) like was there before but whatever



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,553 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    What do you mean waiting to happen?

    There hasn’t been any backlog on this movement to date. It is the least trafficked of the 12 major movements.

    It is not at all an issue even if people on here keep moaning about it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,715 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    Where can you see the chaos happening?

    "Keep watching, it'll happen.
    

    If you keep watching long enough there's bound to be chaos on any road here at some stage. Then you can come back with "I told you so"



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,553 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    When? It’s been repeated as nauseum on here and there hasn’t been an issue so far. Traffic levels are much too low.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,553 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    You know, if anything the M8 to City movement might help meter traffic hitting the lights at the Dunkettle roundabout.

    Thats in the event of traffic growing enormously on this movement, which they won’t.



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