Hamas strike on Israel - Threadbans in op - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

no expanding their borders and engaging in ethnic cleansing, attacking their neighbours and stealing land since 1948

i don't hate israel, i just want them to grow up and stop playing the victim while being the aggresser and then whinging when the consequences of their actions come back to bite them, that is all.

Stealing land after they were attacked and had to defend themselves in 1948!

That's what happens after war, territory is won or lost.

Israel have been in a fight for their existence since the creation of their state, Jewish people a lot longer. That people deny that, proves how much they need to look after themselves.

You claimed... oh wait, this is futile.

There are a number of posters here who know what you posted and you came up with zero evidence to support your claim. That will continue to be the case regardless of what you post subsequently.

nope, stealing land is not what happens after war.

military occupation for a time happens after war, but israel doesn't engage in simple military occupation but permanent theft of land and expansion of borders, then subjecting those who live in the land to military rule, apartheid and ethnic cleansing.

israel do the attacking, any of the countries that "attacked" it did so as they got intel that israel were going to invade them and they simply defended themselves.

israel have not been in a fight for their existence, that is just the standard hasbara claim, which even the generals involved in the 1967 and 1973 border expansion campaigns would tell you is one of many bogus claimsm made.

storming through gaza, taking heavy losses while killing very few actual gihadis.

israel are not interested in getting aid in, they are interested in expelling the population and stealing the land and expanding their borders.

the individuals stripped down to their underware were civilians as has been proven.

israel have lost the information war and will lose the war against hamas ultimately via the fact they will never militarily defeat them regardless of how many they rape and slaughter.

Something getting a bit overlooked in all this is that the actions of the Israeli state, the IDF and the legions of semi psychotic fanboys on social media (who are frequently not Jewish and who therefore face no consequences) are making things potentially very unsafe for Jewish people worldwide, especially the ones who want nothing to do with the military action. At a minimum, it leaves them wide open to discrimination and being linked to the crimes of the regime.

The trouble is you cannot, where one side is a guerilla force, and not fighting according to the Gva Conventions regarding soldiers being clearly identifiable. In my experience, and I'm not specifically talking about Hamas / Israel just now, but generally speaking, everyone from 9 to 90 can be a "Rebel". And while the actual fighters would generally be physically fit, and appear as such, the whole population would support the rebels. (And presumably the majority of Gaza citizens support Hamas? But there are stories trickling out about that support being far from 100%, but I digress) So the little old lady sitting in the shade is capable of reporting the location of the enemy, their Nrs and direction they are taking. Ditto, an 8- or nine-year-old can deliver a small bomb with a timer on it, and innocuously plant it somewhere the enemy will actually be or likely to be. And that's the reality. There was a song from the Vietnam War (Tom Paxton) goes something like this: - " Every night the local gentry slip by the sleeping sentry, they go to play at VC, in this little nightly drama, they put on their black pajamas' and come lobbing mortar shells at me" By morning the black pajama's were gone, and their dress was indistinguishable from the thousands of "civilian" Vietnamese. Same as Hamas in Gaza. The fact is that everything and anything can be used against you when you are the "Enemy " (in this case, the IDF, which is why they don't give a damn about any Geneva Conventions when doing a sweep to capture Hamas, and until its proved different, every Palestinian from 9 to 90 is a potential Hamas member. And that's how the IDF see them. So when I see posts on here about the IDF paying closer attention to killing Hamas, and avoiding the civilians, I wonder how they can do this? I'm still waiting for some one to show me the official Hama uniform.

once again israel is not the jewish people and the jewish people are not israel.

i would advise against equating the 2 as it's a bad thing to do for obvious reasons.

I would say a lot of changes. I've seen quite a few non Zionist Jewish people trying to warn where all this is heading. Many of the loudest and most deranged cheerleaders for Israel and the IDF on social media are not Jewish and will therefore face no consequences whatsoever in their real lives, no matter how extreme or unhinged their posts become - it will be left to ordinary Jewish people to pick up the pieces.

Depending on which sources/calculations you use, its likely that a plurality of the worlds Jewish people live in Israel. Jews - Wikipedia

So yes, your stance on Israel is very much overlapping with your stance on Jews by the simple facts of mathematics. And my stance is clear: I'm with the Jews and their right to exist wherever in the world they may live, including the worlds only Jewish state where waves of Jewish refugees have had nowhere else to go.

As for what happened in 1947/1948, the original Zionist plan was to have a very small state of Israel consisting primarily of Jewish-owned or unoccupied lands such as the Negev desert, with the local Arabs being welcome to stay in the new state, have the Arabic language recognised as a working language of the State etc. What happened after that was multiple and indeed ongoing efforts at varying degrees to eliminate the State of Israel and drive the Jews into the Sea.

Thusly in my view, what drives Israeli strategic thinking is the fact that they've been surrounded by mortal enemies since their founding, and that includes Gaza which became a terrorist military base within a year of them leaving it.

So you think it's ok for people to treat all Jewish people badly because of Israeli policy? Because it reads like you're excusing people for anti semitism. Which I don't think is like you, just from reading your posts

Israeli intelligence services know exactly where Hamas active cells are, which is why they are happy to take out an apartment block and massacre a hundred civilians if they know they can confirm one legit kill. You can dress it up whatever way you want, but the Israeli government believe they're the fukn master race. They deserve nobody's sympathy, support or respect in this slaughter.