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Leinster Team Talk Thread (Love you Furlong time)

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  • Registered Users Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    Somehow coming away with 4 wins from the last 4 games so can't complain. Plenty still to be sorted on the training field though on both sides of the ball. Conceding 27 points at home to a second string Sale is really not good enough and I'm sure the players will know that themselves too. A lot of sloppy errors still happening. We're missing a few guys around the place but the team is still close to full strength.

    With the interpros on the horizon, I'd imagine they've already identified some of their selections which are likely to be impacted by player management. I can see guys playing one or the other but not both when it comes to the games.

    For each game, I'd expect something along the lines of:

    Keenan, Larmour, Ringrose, Frawley, Lowe, Byrne, JGP, Conan, Connors, Baird, Molony, McCarthy, Ala'alatoa, Kelleher, Healy

    JOB, Russell, Turner, Henshaw, Lowe, Byrne, McGrath, Doris, Penny, Ruddock, Ryan, Jenkins, Furlong, Sheehan, Porter.

    It will be interesting to see if opponents have to rotate similarly. I'd expect Crowley and Beirne have to take a break at some point, most likely visiting Connacht. Henderson has already missed some game time with injury so may be exempt from resting.



  • Registered Users Posts: 161 ✭✭letsbefair


    Jamison Gibson-Park continues to deliver an all-round linking game that no other scrum-half on the island can match. Tony Ward on Indo today. Some experts on Boards continue to criticise him.



  • Posts: 0 Lia Sweet Racist


    Yeah, agreed. Crowley & Beirne in particular have racked up big minutes, but there is no way they'll sit them for Leinster in Thomond.

    Crowley didn't play a lot of minutes in the RWC (59 mins total), but has played 483 out of a possible 560 since then (86%).

    Beirne played 367 minutes at the RWC, and has played another 390 since then. If you take James Ryan as a good comparison for Beirne, Ryan played 190 mins at the RWC and has only played 288 since then.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,484 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney




  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,980 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    And the comments for that article rightly call out the Journalist for talking utter nonsense - They also accuse him of having an anti-Leinster bias , but I have no idea if that's accurate.

    The Article certainly reads that way , but don't know if that's a one off or a pattern.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,846 ✭✭✭ionadnapokot


    He's head and shoulders above the rest

    Still makes some bad decisions



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,846 ✭✭✭ionadnapokot




  • Registered Users Posts: 3,697 ✭✭✭arsebiscuits1


    The upcoming Munster game presents an intriguing prospect from many different facets which will definitely add to the rivalry.

    Obviously Snyman (allegedly) coming here has added good narrative and some of the less rational cousins down south will of course use this as an additional space in their heads where Leinster continue to live rent free.

    Adding to this, the La Rochelle game came at a good time for the hype for this fixture. It's been an unexpected narrative this whole "La Rogchelle" thing but it's certainly added additional animosity between the more parochial facets of both sets of fans. I would by lying if I told you seeing Rog in his coaching box sulking in the rain after the game didn't add a little bit of sugar on top of the win given how the banter in the whatsapp chats had gone in the lead up.

    However the most interesting angle for me is the stark contrast in styles of both teams in recent weeks.

    Munster have played some extremely attractive rugby and their backline and link play has been fantastic.

    When Munster are clicking it's hard not to like how they're playing as the attacking brand of rugby is universally attractive. They found width so effectively against Exeter and just failed to make it count when needed.

    Leinster conversely have failed to fire yet really this season and it has been littered with inaccuracies. But we are still coming away with good results.

    I definitely know which I would rather



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    He does things that most lads can't. He certainly has made some goofy fup ups too! Critics will critique and remember this is coming from the same Tony Ward that was pushing Dardis into the international team a few years back.

    Park had some errors yesterday. His form is inconsistent, imo. He's not immune from criticism.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Certainly Lowe will tog out in Limerick. I'd expect Furlong too.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    I don't think he hs an anti Leinster bias. It's one pundits take.



  • Posts: 0 Lia Sweet Racist


    Yeah, Leinster are definitely playing a more abrasive and direct style this season. We're still scoring plenty of tries (10 more than Munster from as many games at this stage), and definitely look far more effective, despite our glitchy attack.

    Leinster have had very little continuity at 10 in recent weeks, which to me has to be a factor in why our attack is struggling to click.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,697 ✭✭✭arsebiscuits1


    Rory O'Connor in the Indo is reporting that RG Snyman will be on the bench for Leinster



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    That academy in Sale is doing good work. Some absolute units in that team. The replacement tight head is just 19! They have the makings of a really good team.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,559 ✭✭✭Clo-Clo


    Munster coaching ticket is same as last year, had a full preseason with the majority of the squad. Playing some good stuff and building on last year but really they should be beating Exeter and winning at home.

    leinster have had a lot of coaching changes and the biggest Lancaster leaving, who seemed to have his fingers in all the pies, then his replacement not available till a few weeks ago. Plus a change up now with a defence/attack coach instead of Lancaster.

    Huge number of the leadership team unavailable for preseason and in preseason most of the coach's bar Leo/Seanie? didn't work with the team with Goodman gone as well.

    Honestly I expected Leinster to be a bit all over the place, last time something like this happened was in Aug 2015 and after the WC we got hockied in Europe and knocked out in Europe, didn't they have to do Ireland calls at lineout because nobody knew the leinster ones or something mad like that?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    The Ulster match will likely see a full strenght squad. I reckon it will be some rotation in Limerick. For Munster

    Boyle

    Kelleher

    Furlong

    Molony

    McCarthy

    Soroka

    Penny

    Conan

    Luke

    Harry

    Lowe

    Henshaw

    Turner

    Russell

    JOB

    Barron, Milne, Clarkson, Deeny, Connors, Murphy, Sam and Larmour.



  • Registered Users Posts: 568 ✭✭✭jonok28


    Just read that RG Snyman is going to cost Leinster €500,000. I wonder will the IRFU sanction that? They probably would if Leinster move off of the three NIQ players.

    They also might say that he will stop other Irish locks from developing, to be fair the young locks coming up do have potential but I think they aren't of the same quality or potential of James Ryan or Joe McCarthy, Leinster can also argue that Baird is moving to Flanker and that he wouldn't be obstructed.

    With Doris and Sheehan more than likely moving to Central contracts, Leinster should have some money to sign Snyman and potentially another prop to replace Ala'alatoa.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,559 ✭✭✭Clo-Clo


    Was talking to a friend of a friend at weekend, all whispers of course but he says it's a pay per play deal. It is big money but he won't be close to it unless he is playing a number of games per season and hitting goals etc.

    Now no idea if true or not but would make sense, I can't see the IRFU or Leinster handing a player big money like that after his injury record

    He is replacing Jenkins who is off to SA from all reports. He will be one of 4 locks with Ryan/Maloney/Big Joe. Synman. So I don't see the blocking angle but Im sure people will find one.

    Personally I said it before if they have a NIQ I would go for someone with a better injury record but it looks like this will happen, he is happy in Ireland and the main reports seem to be his misses doesn't want to leave.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,188 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    why wouldn't they sanction it? If they have an issue with the signing it is not going to be about the money.



  • Posts: 0 Lia Sweet Racist


    That academy didn't produce the guy you cited - he was someone they signed from Wasps after they folded (though agreed he looks a serious prospect).

    The average age of the starting XVs on the weekend was broadly the same - they were 26.2 versus 26.9 for Leinster, and we also had a couple of 22 year olds and a 20 year old who came off the bench here.

    Some of their better performers on the day were not necessarily callow inexperienced youngsters, guys like Tommy Taylor (hooker - 32 years old), Sam Bedlow (centre - 28 years old), Rob Du Preez (out half - 30 years old) and Telusu Veainu (full back - 32 years old) have all been around the block a few times, plus they brought Jonny Hill (thug) and JL du Preez off the bench for impetus.

    They were very game and up for the fight, but still scored 2 of their 3 tries in the final couple of the plays when the game was over and Leinster were down to 13 men. I feel like if Leinster had taken some of the chances in the first half (VDF's one when Baird knocked on or the one where Baird was held up) then Leinster would have cruised into an even more comfortable victory.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    I'd be shocked if it was a pay for play deal.

    Snyman could command €500k easily enough elsewhere without a pay for play deal. A few niggly injuries and his salary is massively reduced. Great for Leinster but he'd be absolutely mad to sign such a contract.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,559 ✭✭✭Clo-Clo


    With who? France won't pay that because of the JIFF rule and the medicals in France are very stringent as a few English players have found. Bath was been floated and yes they have money but the salary cap is reduced and isn't it only one star player, so they would struggle especailly with the squad they have build.

    I don't think anyone else was in for him.

    I would say he would have a base salary of course and then pay per play, max he could earn is 500k.



  • Registered Users Posts: 568 ✭✭✭jonok28


    They might not sanction it not on money concerns but can it be argued that he will be obstructing Irish talent from getting opportunities while he is there? Can it be argued that McCarthy might get less game time or see a reduced role because of it? Can it be argued that while Baird is playing flanker, is Snyman stopping him from getting game time at lock?

    Can it be argued that Leinster don't particularly need the signing in order to remain competitive and win trophies?

    Can it be argued by the other provinces that the rich are getting richer at Leinster with the Snyman signing?

    The IRFU might also not be pleased that repeated use of the NIQ designation on a lock. First it was Scott Fardy, then Jason Jenkins and now RG Snyman. I think this is less of a concern.

    I still think the deal goes through as Leinster did not make any signings this past season, they will have Sheehan and Doris moving onto central contracts and at least 2 of the 3 NIQ players are moving on at the end of the year clearing space for the move. Leinster have also seen a lot of talented players move to the other provinces. Roman Salanoa, Joey Carbery, Jordi Murphy, Jack Aungier, Andrew Conway, Sam Ilo, etc... and more than likely they will lose another player or two next season to the other provinces. It can be argued that Leinster would not have a problem at tighthead prop and therefore not needed to use the NIQ designation on Ala'alatoa if it wasn't for Salanoa, Ilo and Aungier all be moved to Munster and Connacht respectively.

    I do think the signing happens and I also think Leinster pick up a prop. Either a loosehead that allows Porter to move back to tighthead or a tighthead that can lighten the load for Furlong. It won't be Jack Aungier anyway, there would be war if Leinster were to take Snyman from Munster and Aungier from Connacht, it would be hilarious though lol.



  • Registered Users Posts: 568 ✭✭✭jonok28


    I can't imagine it would be a pay as you play deal. If that was the case, Snyman would be leaving an awful lot of potential money on the table. I'm really curious to see the contract length. I'd nearly guarantee it's a one year deal but wouldn't be surprised if Leinster had to give him a multi year deal in order to stop him going to Bath.



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Harper Whispering Police


    New 3 year IRFU contract for Doris.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,697 ✭✭✭arsebiscuits1


    To the surprise of no one - Doris has been bumped onto a central contract until 2027. Richly deserved.

    Presumably Sheehan next

    https://www.irishrugby.ie/2023/12/18/caelandoris-irfucontract/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 696 ✭✭✭Ben Bailey


    ".. Jonny Hill (thug) .."

    Brilliant 😆

    and true.

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • Posts: 0 Lia Sweet Racist


    Can it be argued that McCarthy might get less game time or see a reduced role because of it?

    No, I don't think this is credible. We're signing Snyman to replace Jenkins, to be one of the 3 first choice match day 23 locks. Joe McCarthy will still be one of those.

    Can it be argued that while Baird is playing flanker, is Snyman stopping him from getting game time at lock?

    No, as you've said yourself, Leinster are playing him at flanker. He had more minutes at 6 last season than any other Leinster player, despite missing a sizable chunk of the season to injury. Leinster clearly see him as a flanker. It's not Snyman stopping him getting minutes at lock, and if Leinster don't sign Snyman, they'll sign another NIQ lock who will still be selected in 23s there ahead of Baird.

    Can it be argued that Leinster don't particularly need the signing in order to remain competitive and win trophies?

    We've had two trophyless seasons back to back, and remain the bulk supplier to the Irish squad. It's entirely credible we need external reinforcement, and if we're doing it we should be targeting top tier players like Snyman rather than journeymen like Jason Jenkins.

    Can it be argued by the other provinces that the rich are getting richer at Leinster with the Snyman signing?

    Leinster are better than the other provinces with or without Snyman. The other provinces spend pretty heavily themselves on external recruitment, and, in all likelihood you would struggle to convince Snyman to move to Ulster or Connacht. He isn't what either of those teams need anyway- if they committed that salary to him they'd need 25 games a year from him, which he likely can't give you. He's there to be the final piece in a European Cup winning jigsaw for Leinster, just like Brad Thorn et al before him.

    The IRFU might also not be pleased that repeated use of the NIQ designation on a lock. First it was Scott Fardy, then Jason Jenkins and now RG Snyman.

    I really don't think this is a concern. We've a lot of very good locks at the moment - James Ryan, Tadhg Beirne and Iain Henderson (when at his best) are all top tier locks. Joe McCarthy has shown huge promise, and as have a smattering of young players like Ed Edogbo, Tom Ahern, Niall & Darragh Murray, Harry Sheridan etc.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    The English salary cap is increasing by £1.4m for next season so there's scope for teams to bring in a few big names (if they have the money). They can have one player exempt from this (Finn Russell for Bath). Japan is also the other obvious one. Extremely popular with SA players and no shortage of money. French teams would gladly pay for him. Their medical restrictions are more intensive but it's more for uncovering underlying or potentially long term issues such as LCD's neck nerve damage or Vakatawa's cardiac issues.

    The other option would have been to return to SA. Whilst he definitely would have taken a pay cut, he'd be going home having spent 5-6 years on the road and has made a small fortune already. There has been significant investment in a couple of SA teams of late too which has allowed them bring guys like WLR, Etzebeth, Coetzee, Marco van Staden etc. back there in the last year.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,173 ✭✭✭✭Sangre


    I really don't think RG's negotiating position is as good as people are making out. I really don't think there are that many teams willing to pay big wedge these days either due to (i) state of English game and limits on marquee players (ii) French JIFF rules and (iii) Japan pay-day isn't always mega money (but relatively big given number of games played). Club rugby teams do actually care quite a lot how often a player plays, regardless of his world cup pedigree. Of course he would command good money but he isn't a player to can dictate terms given his history.



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