Did it ever make sense to move from an old combustion car to a new EV

If you want a new car, just go ahead and buy one, whether it is an EV or not. All of the calculations done in people's heads to justify it are mostly meaningless as there is always something you will miss along the way such as servicing, wear and tear, repairs out of warranty and so on.

Unless you are getting a new EV for free, it does not make much financial sense to switch from an ICE vehicle to "save money". Cars are depreciating assets and we are now seeing a correction of second hand values (and GFMV calculations) in the market after the craziness of post COVID prices and shortages of vehicles. When changing my car last time I actually "made" €2k on the price I had originally paid for my car against a trade in for an EV. Looking at it now, however, the price I paid for my EV has dropped by at least as much if not more so I have now effectively "lost" money. I did not change my car out of necessity but because I wanted a full EV. That was a choice. In the grand scheme of things, I would have been financially better off to the tune of about €10k by not changing.

The running costs for my EV, in terms of fuel, are practically zero (I can charge in work for free) but they were roughly the same with my previous car (a PHEV that I could also charge in work for free). Truth be told, and this will be controversial; I sometimes wish I had not changed from the PHEV as it was the best of both worlds for me. I don't like having to use public fast charging when I travel to the West of Ireland for family visits as it is usually either busy or busted and at least with the PHEV, I could just fill up with petrol and go (I usually make the return trip on the same day so destination charging is useless with a granny cable once I arrive). I will think very long and hard before replacing my current EV with another one and may even go back to a PHEV when the time comes.

I certainly will be under no illusions that I am saving money by buying one car over another. Everything has pros and cons and everyone's circumstances will be different... or, as has been said in countless vehicle ads in the last few years: YMMV! 🙂

Well, we'll see - but it would be naïve to think that government policy won't use whatever stick it can in order to persuade the public in the new direction. They'll incentivise EVs whilst increasing cost of ownership/ running of petrol/ diesel. Of course, it'll be a balancing act too as they need to be mindful of how to recover motoring taxes from EVs.

The real green deal of course should be to persuade the public to give up their cars, whether EV or ICE.

They will actually still be available to buy new until 2035, the EU over ruled the Irish government saying they were nor allowed to jump the gun. Even 2035 is open to question due to the German car industry using their political power in Germany to push this out further due to not being ready by 2035

In terms of electric cars, does it make sense? I bought during the last crash in electric cars. Kept for years and then sold on during the boom.

Took a company car out then on 0% BIK and drive that for years, once it didn't make sense I bought it out and still have it today. It will be driven till the wheels fall off it, over 150k km so far.

I looked at a new Electric car and when I seen people paying over 40k for a Renault I knew it was totally ridiculous and left them at the show room.

Anyone who paid crazy money on an EV in the last few years must have been aware the depreciation was going to be huge on them.

Yeah. My father never bought a new car in his life. He drove plenty of cars with the current year number on the registration plate. (He had contacts in the car industry so he would buy the cars that others registered and didn't like so they traded them soon after)

He was driving top spec practically new cars that someone else took the biggest depreciation hit on.

I was always amazed that there were people out there who just changed their mind on a brand new car after a few weeks and were happy to take the hit, but it seems there were always a few

"I was always amazed that there were people out there who just changed their mind on a brand new car after a few weeks and were happy to take the hit, but it seems there were always a few"

Ireland is a very very very rich country. Something like €150bn in savings accounts of all sorts at the moment and rising. 300,000+ or so working in FDI, all well paid with serious pensions etc. Im not begrudging at all .. just saying when you do have lots of coin and are secure with same taking hits like that are a thing of nothing.

Just an enthusiast, not a dealer at all. Dealers make money 😁

Ah but I wrote "The real green deal of course should be to persuade the public to give up their cars, whether EV or ICE."

Government and Greens are not quite the same thing are they. Presumably EV owners are partly persuaded by 'low emissions' motoring? If they are really concerned, they should give up personal transport vehicles altogether.

As for fuel taxes, they are putting them back on as quickly as they can.

I did not say I have an EV. I have nothing against EVs.

Your "Totally Incorrect" statement is i assume your own conclusion from your own EV experience vs a general all around statement of fact?

Re tyres - just from reading ( eg recent article on this in Irish times - paywall ) .. discussing pretty much this:

( The findings are based on data from e-commerce specialist epyx )

I have found .. especially from people who it is there first foray into EVs - that EV tyres are different from and more expensive than ICE tyres for these reasons:

"The cost of replacing EV tyres more frequently is exacerbated by the higher price of EV tyres due to reinforced sidewalls to deal with the extra weight of batteries, as well as special compounds for quieter driving and lower rolling resistance. Some EV tyres may even have reduced tread depths, which would also impact on the frequency of their replacement cycle."

Not advisable to use regular ICE tyres on an EV

Cheapest non BEV Automatic Kona is 20K+ same like EV kona with similar mileage. I would compare Automatic non BEV vehicles to EVs as manual ICE cars are in different market segment.

January 2019 Kona for €15900 was a High mileage example. You would need to see vehicle and drive to compare. 2019 Kona with 157,000km would not be valued same money as one with 30,000km. So €20K+ would be a fair price point for 64kWh battery 2019 Kona with working AC, and replaced battery under recall.

All depends on a driving stile. Had original set of tires for 60,000km on a 2017 Ioniq 28kWh.

Now driving Kona with 32k km, looks like tires will be road legal after 50K. Somebody driving in Sport Mode, utilizing full power, will kill them in no time. Same with ICE cars.

The focus of this discussion seems to be entirely on the cost.

Nothing wrong with that but there is a big element on the purchase of an EV that is influenced by the environmental impact -- at least there was on my decision and I am sure it is for others too.

Also, the running cost of an EV is dramatically cheaper than a diesel or, in particular, a petrol car.

I am getting 350-450kms on my EV for under €7. Some are getting it for free if they have PV solar.

€7 is less than the cost of 1 gallon of petrol or diesel which might get a petrol car 40miles/65km or a diesel 50miles/80km.

It doesn't make sense to move from a debt free ICE to any car where you would need a loan to buy that car.

I don’t think anyone can realistically argue with the above statement.

I did it and saved money. Going from bangernomics diesels to an EV. I was doing 50-60k a year though.

I did these maths multiple times over the last few years for Mrs Tracos bus and it was hard to justity savings. She had a 2007 Mercedes ML320Cdi so €1,500 tax per year and last few years a fill was an average of €150 which hurt. I am farily handy so did most of the looking after it myself. Working the numbers it would be several years before we would be net positive by switching.

However in mid September it threw a fault. I scanned and loads of canbus errors. Water in rear wheelarches so suspected a rear SAM at miniumum which wouls cost GBP£800+ with my contacts and alos me coding it and getting it working. No gaurantee it would end there and tax was also due in Oct. Based on that I reckoned we would be at least 3k down and potentially have more issues plus she is on the M50 for work and had sort of lost confidence in it. Probably average 20k kms per year.

Anyway some rapid fire tets drives and comparisions and then with the Tesla end od Q3 push it was decided that the best value option was a Model Y out the door for 45.7k which I think was a very good deal for what we got. Hopefully there won't be more huge discounts but I'm not that bothered as we tend to keep cars for teh long haul as tools and I have fun cars for entertainment.

So even with out exterem use case I would honestly think we aren't saving a whole lot and she has free charging at work. I'd say its about a wash but there is big step up in terms of the user experience and tech for a 16 year old Merc but she still misses it.

My own daily, currently not being used is a 2010 Skoda Tdi with just shy of 400k kms and the plan is to keep it untill it throws in the towel at which point I may jump to a used EV but who knows as work needs (currently not an option for me) when do require long distance runs.

If you have to change and look at like for like pricing either new or used then an EV will save you something every year but its not free money and you won't retire off it.

In terms of reducing emissions CO2 etc. many diesels can run unaltered on HVO. A 90% reduction is quoted pity its nor more widely available and on a par price wise. Pity it's nor promoted by the Government like the EVs..

Still a significant improvement over diesel.

Re: PHEV, my partner is exactly the same as you, she is trading in her EV for a PHEV next month.

I Kan 😁

If the monthly cost to service the loan, plus the running costs of the other (presumably newer) car are less than the cost of running the "debt free" car, then it does make sense to move from one car to the other. This is especially true if you have an expensive service on the way.

My Audi A4 diesel estate and 5 series petrol needed reinforced tyres, same as my Tesla M3. Nothing special about them, the media and marketing are really doing a job on people.

LoL imitation is the highest form of flattery, ascribing someone else's posts as mine is strange, I am the defender of phevs and hybrids, I am not against EVs, just some of the fantasy stuff, I feel sorry for who purchased recently, I actually received abuse when I mentioned about depreciation on EVs 2 months ago in the bargain thread, in response to another well known who claimed the opposite.

I don't think EV sales in the last couple of years were going to be long term keepers as mostly early adopters want to move on to the next car with different chemistry or some other faff, it might be the case now with the new price drops, that or realise the loss,

going forward how are sales going to be, any purchase I make I do put a lot of thought into resale, 25 years ago I expected to loose 2000 pounds a year, now I buy 2nd hand and sell for profit/no loss or minimal loss, I am sure others are like me who can accept some loss, but not whats happening now.

You used US units and any engine , its a little better when you go imperial and select diesel.

Based on data from 21 vehicles, 638 fuel-ups and 374,601 miles of driving, the 2010 Volkswagen Passat gets a combined Avg UK MPG of 44.03 with a 0.71 UK MPG margin of error.

Entirely possible to get 50 mpg.

I lurked a long time also, only started to post when I got my outlander PHEV.