Dublin - Metrolink (Swords to Charlemont only)

spacetweek · 28-12-2023 8:26pm

Are we looking at the same video? It’s 1 set of lights. The rest of the road junctions are with pedestrianised streets where pedestrians don’t have to wait at a light.

Sam Russell · 28-12-2023 9:56pm

Mod: Can we stop the lights. By the time Metrolink is carrying passengers, the whole OCS might be pedestrianised.

We should await ABP.

gjim · 28-12-2023 10:45pm

Utilities prep work for ML?

Road Reinstatement/Resurfacing works scheduled to begin Monday the 8th of January 2024 by KLM Utilities on behalf of TII Metrolink.

Can't wait until this thread is full of such links.

L1011 · 28-12-2023 10:52pm

Might be ground conditions/ground penetrating radar work, as ML is going to be in an open cutting alongside the bypass in places as far as I remember (and can't be arsed checking)

Strumms · 28-12-2023 11:03pm

11 years away…… it’s a wonderful country it really is… politicians sticking it to the citizens…

and the word used today by that Eamonn Ryan… “ hope to be “…. Hope… not after everything will, or should or shall…

‘hope’….

That’s as much as he is willing to give, a bit more tokenism…

this the same character that wants us all out of our cars or paying congestion charges…. When asked about what we can do instead to get around Dublin ? He ‘hopes’ the metro will be up and running in 2034….

this.. is our Minister for Transport… 😒

KrisW1001 · 28-12-2023 11:47pm

Yes, but he's only the Minister for Transport, not an absolute monarch*

These delays infuriate me, but on balance I'd rather live in a county where citizens are able to challenge government plans than in one with great infrastructure but fewer civic freedoms.

__

*in fairness, some posters on the Roads forum do think he has a kind of malevolent omnipotence.. for them, there is no setback to any project that isn't somehow directly caused by E. Ryan. Give him a white fluffy cat and a scar, and you get the picture...

gjim · 29-12-2023 12:05am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121545392#Comment_121545392

Could you please give this political ranting a rest? If that's not possible, could you and the rest of the "ML will never happen/Ireland is the worst country in the world/Eamon Ryan is useless" crew open a separate thread - so you can enjoy your circle jerk without forcing the rest of us to watch? It adds absolutely nothing to this thread. It's not news, it's not analysis, it contains no interesting information.

Qrt · 29-12-2023 12:43am

Has there been any statement made on the preferred seating arrangements of the rolling stock? i.e. longitudinal or transverse?

I think given the limited acceleration and deceleration and sharp turns the former would probably work out better.

bk · 29-12-2023 10:19am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121545774#Comment_121545774

I don’t think there has been any official indication, but if it helps, Metrolink seems to be closely modelled off the Copenhagen Metro and in Copenhagen they actually use both directions on the same vehicle, some seats are traverse, while others are flip down longitudinal:

https://www.dreamstime.com/copenhagen-metro-train-interior-copenhagen-denmark-september-interior-view-driverless-rapid-transit-metro-train-image157993969

Brightlights66 · 29-12-2023 10:29am

My post answering the posters bk and spacetweek seems to have been mislaid by this board.

I think I understand the misunderstanding here re traffic lights.

I fully agree that there are no obstacles to walking along O'Connell Street, on either side. In the relevant section, as has been pointed out above, there is only a crossing at Abbey Street.

And there is no problem crossing O'Connell Street in the relevant section at any given set of lights, as they change regularly. A commuter only needs to cross at one.

It may sound like clutching at straws, but the only positive aspect I can see from this proposed lengthy interchange, is that not every interchanger will be crossing O'Connell Street at the same point. (It should work out at 25% at each crossing, as I said above).

The point of the video was to illustrate the remoteness of the LUAS Red line from the metrolink station, and vice versa. It seems it's about 450 metres, and that's before you even take into account the time to get up from or down to the metro platforms.

The entire length of the 'Ryanair' terminal in Dublin Airport. Twice a day. In this allegedly 'easy' connection.

Mod: My post #4473 suggested that discussion about lights has been done to death. Yet immediately following, you continue the discussion. Leave it or sanctions will follow.

Brightlights66 · 29-12-2023 11:59am

I felt I had to reply, to clear up the misunderstanding.

Mod: Read the charter. Do not reply to Mod instructions on thread. This is the second time.

If you need to reply, use DM or Report post.

With just 9 posts, you appear to have got off to a bad start.

Consonata · 29-12-2023 2:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121546200#Comment_121546200

I kind of took it as read that the metro used in the various videos would be the model used but will there be different rolling stock ordered?

Also a slightly more banal point but, will Metrolink be the final name for the line? Or will it be changed much like Crossrail. Just wondering is the existing Metrolink livery going to be used or is it going to become TFI Rail or something.

KrisW1001 · 29-12-2023 4:33pm

My guess is "Metro" or "Meitreo". I actually prefer the Irish version for the coincidence that it happens to end in "treo", which means "direction of travel" or "way".

tinytobe · 29-12-2023 4:37pm

Wouldn't it be faster to build a LUAS to the airport and / or also connect the DART to the airport? Possibly cheaper and more options to take, and quicker implemented?

orangerhyme · 29-12-2023 4:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547500#Comment_121547500

The Airport is just one stop on the Metro.

There's multiple benefits to the Metro line, only one of which is the airport connection.

Based on Dublin's population size and density and also growth projections, we should really have 2 Metro lines already.

We're way behind.

We should've built one line in the Celtic Tiger years and the 2nd line should be under construction now and we should be planning a circle line to begin construction.

Instead we've people like McDowell even questioning the viability of the first line.

CatInABox · 29-12-2023 4:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547500#Comment_121547500

Sure. You wouldn't like the service that you'd get from it though. The capacity for the Luas wouldn't be enough to serve both the airport and all the stations in between, so it'd effectively be a waste of money. On the Dart, the northern line is already at capacity, in order to add an Airport route, you'd be reducing services north of Clongriffin, services which are already at capacity. In order to fix that capacity issue, you're looking at a project that'll cost billions and take years.

Note that these projects won't do anything for Swords, but biggest town in Ireland without a train service.

These proposals have been looked at in depth, and found very wanting in comparison to Metrolink.

Consonata · 29-12-2023 5:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547500#Comment_121547500

This has been discussed a couple times here. The core reasoning behind why neither of those options were pursued and Metrolink was selected are in the Fingal/North Dublin Transport Strategy Report. I have attached said report and the salient points on both of those options.

LR3 is the Luas extension as you mentioned. C1 is the DART spur. LR7 is what Metrolink is. As you can see above, LR7 has a 1.56 CBA ratio, whereas C1 has 0.43.

Fingal_North_Dublin_Transport_Study_Final_June_2015.pdf

prunudo · 29-12-2023 5:08pm

I really wish NTA, Tii, Rpa or whatever they call themselves these days were far more procative in their pr spin for Metrolink. It would put to bed these 'Luas to the airport' posts that appear every few weeks.

Again, its not helped by the likes of McDowell or McCarthy getting free reign in the media to spout their opinions.

tinytobe · 29-12-2023 5:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547528#Comment_121547528

I don't know. I wouldn't extend the existing LUAS line, but completely build another one? Also the frequency of trains on the DART is not that high, it would surprise me if not more trains can't be run.

But then again, I am no expert. And then there is always a reason for finding excuses and saying no.

I just don't see the Metrolink as a tube / underground to be running before 2030. It'll be more likely 2035, and that is if we're all lucky.

That's a long wait, having to rely on number 16 bus or those airport coaches via the port tunnel.

A train connection to the Airport, that should have been done, way sooner, during the Celtic Tiger years, at the latest.

Consonata · 29-12-2023 5:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547587#Comment_121547587

You will be waiting far longer for a luas or DART spur. ML is going through the railway order process, whereas a Luas extension would need to go back to the drawing board. As things stand, we could have shovels in ground before the end of 2024 optimistically. I challenge you to find a project who could begin as quickly as that.

prunudo · 29-12-2023 5:13pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547587#Comment_121547587

If you scrapped everything that has been achieved so far by Metrolink in the morning and started again with a Luas to airport plan you'd still be looking at 2035+ before it was completed.

Its just a no, a big fat NO, and the idea needs to be put to bed.

tinytobe · 29-12-2023 5:15pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547595#Comment_121547595

If you're correct, you're correct. It's just that a rail connection to the airport is a much needed piece of infrastructure in Dublin.

orangerhyme · 29-12-2023 5:26pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547606#Comment_121547606

It is needed but buses are fine until the Metro. 30 minutes by bus ain't bad.

The Metrolink is hopefully just the start of a full network with Dart+, more Luas lines, Bus connects etc.

By the time the first Metro line is up and running, our population will be over 6 million.

Dublin County will have grown another 200,000 maybe.

Assuming our economy remains stable during this time, the Metro isn't even that expensive and we should start planning the next line immediately.

Copenhagen is a similar city to us and has built 4 lines since 2002. That's the benchmark really.

Sam Russell · 29-12-2023 5:28pm

McDowell and McCarthy both favour buses or coaches to serve the airport.

Anyone who has used either knows that the bus/coach just getting out of the airport take ten/fifteen or more minutes. The Metrolink will be at the Mater by then. Add in the capacity, and the passengers might still be queueing for a seat on the bus before the Metro has arrived at OCS.

Car is a great alternative to Metrolink as well. Parking is currently at a premium with DAA advising users to book places well ahead.

I wonder if seats will have to be reserved on the Metrolink in the same way - or will it just be a turn up and go service like all metros?

orangerhyme · 29-12-2023 5:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547653#Comment_121547653

Not a hope you'll need to book seats.

It'll have a very high capacity.

I think it's interesting to imagine what affect it'll have on Ballymun.

I'm guessing once it starts construction, you'll see an explosion of apartment building there.

Living 15 minutes from town would be so attractive to people. Also so close to the Airport and DCU.

Completely transformative for Ballymun which has barely a cafe or pub for locals. I think the SuperValu just closed.

CatInABox · 29-12-2023 6:25pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547587#Comment_121547587

The cost of a brand new line would mean billions in cost as well, and you'd have all the same problems with the Luas, namely on street running. They looked at where future Luas lines were viable, and I think there was only one or two other routes that were suitable, neither of which went anywhere near the airport.

As others have said, it'd take a lot of time to design, consult on, get legal and planning permission, etc.

Consonata · 29-12-2023 6:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547677#Comment_121547677

Definitely forsee a property bubble in both Swords and Ballymun. Swords will be 35 min from OCS, as opposed to an hour 15 by current public transport. I know where I would want to be buying my house right now... (though realistically, TII should be buying up land near the station and riding that bubble created by the line, much like the Japanese did with their railways)

orangerhyme · 29-12-2023 6:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547804#Comment_121547804

I think once it gets through planning next year, you'll see an immediate impact in terms of house prices, developments etc.

No offense to anyone from Ballymun but it's not a desirable place to live but that could change quickly. Likewise Northwood.

If you look at Ballymun and Northwood on Google maps, it's a black hole in terms of pubs, cafes, restaurants, shops, supermarkets. That will all change in a few years.

I think it doesn't have a pub and only recently did a cafe open. It doesn't have a proper supermarket either, only a Lidl.

I don't think it has a sit down restaurant.

But 1000s of young professionals moving to the area would change all that quickly.

jd · 29-12-2023 7:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121547886#Comment_121547886

Eastern side of Northwood has 2 restaurants, one just outside the entrance of the estate. It also has a hotel, and the locals use it to an extent to meet for a drink/food. It does need a decent pub, though.

orangerhyme · 29-12-2023 7:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121548012#Comment_121548012

Which restaurant do you mean?

It's still a huge black hole. The whole area.

It can change quickly though. Loads of apartments going up in Santry at the moment also.

Whatevers built at the old shopping centre site will be vital as that's where the Metro station will be and is the "town centre" really.

Hopefully it will be a supermarket and retail and pub/cafes/restaurants and then loads of apartments on top.

Dublin - Metrolink (Swords to Charlemont only)

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