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Gript-A source of misinformation. **Read OP before posting**

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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,562 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    If you're trying to suggest I'm some sort of far right firebrand or something you couldn't be more wrong! The (very) few posts I make or like on Twitter are tediously work related, and because of this I don't follow any political content on there (Gript included), primarily as 'liberal' folks have a tendency to dox people for this. Facebook? Hardly post on there - mostly niche hobby stuff. Telegram and all that nonsense? Wouldn't know where to start, and wouldn't be bothered if I did!



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,562 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    Where did I say Gript was centrist? It's openly right leaning, by their own admission. And while the Times may have some economic right content, painting it overall as "centre right" given its stance on social issues is lunacy IMHO - but I suspect we won't agree on that one, and that's fine.



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,419 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    I don't agree.

    STEM isn't 'evidence based'. It's Rules based. Yes there is a validation element in STEM, where people want to see the measurements or methodology, but Maths doesn't look for 'evidence' , it applies rules in a structured way to solve problems in a repeatable organised way.

    Humanities use a different set of skills as the subject matter is often less structured, more disordered and contextual.

    We need both ways of thinking. What we really need the most now, is critical thinking skills. These are not STEM skills, they're Humanities skills.

    In logic, an argument can be fully consistent and valid even if all of its premises are factually incorrect. We need to be able to distinguish what makes a good source of information, and critically assess each part of it and compare it with other sources and the context of the information to be able to begin to form a view

    And we still need to know that our view is a partial and obscured perspective at all times.

    We need both STEM and social sciences to balance out the benefits and shortfalls of each way of thinking



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,419 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    You said the Irish Times is 'hard left'

    It's nowhere near hard left



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,492 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    No interest the right/left stuff

    The media dose not have the influence those here seem to think it does, people are pre disposed to look for opinions that confirm there own opinion, then they look at the other side just to have a bit of a rant

    Kinda reminds me years ago when the Mail had a very anti Irish bias I worked with someone who would buy the Mail just to get outraged.

    The other interesting point is the belief that some posters have they can see what's really going on everyone else is fooled.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,363 ✭✭✭Silentcorner


    You clearly don't.

    What I have noticed is that we are living in very intolerant times, people are afraid to express normal opinions in everyday places. It's like the 1950s again. Indeed, this very forum is exhibiting a touch of this intolerance, so much so, this post will probably be deleted.

    And those who are the most intolerant often present themselves as "open minded", "progressive" "empathetic", for instance the #bekind pitchfork mob.

    It's more like an infestation of intellectual narcissism and vulgar virtuousness/self righteousness and petite-minded people who in times previous would be the ones sitting in the front of the church! Comedians have been saying this for some time now, when a culture loses it's ability to laugh at itself it is heading to a dark place.

    Post edited by Silentcorner on


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,419 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    So you think the old Catholic Conservative media elites of the 50s to the 90s counted as 'open minded'?


    If I don't know what 'open minded' means, then please define it for me



  • Registered Users Posts: 185 ✭✭drop table Users


    One can draw a direct line from Fox News to Breitbart to Alex Jones to Trump to 6th of January

    If we allow fascism a wedge in then our own republic could meet its January 6th



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,038 ✭✭✭Doc07


    I accept there sis a lot of ‘seeking to be offended’ type nonsense on social media etc but I genuinely don’t know anyone afraid to express a normal opinion in public in real life.

    Ricky Gervais has two specials on Netflix that are some of the most watched and highest rated, one was even released as a special on Christmas Day and I watched it with the in laws. He is discussing all and sundry and no fear of cancelling just getting richer and more successful so I don’t think we are quite back in the ‘50s just yet



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,175 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout



    The Examiner and Irish Times are certainly not "hard left".

    "The Ditch" is hard left. That's a glorified blog but so is Gript. They both peddle in outrage - they just cater for different ends of the spectrum.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,965 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    I've been reading the Irish Times for years and it's news to me (pardon the pun) that it's hard left.

    And as for The Examiner being hard left I'm amazed that anyone could think it's hard left.

    I always thought you had to go to The Socialist Worker or The Morning Star for a hit of that stuff.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    And there it is! The non-publication/non-person reaction to publications that threaten the "accepted" view. The Ditch uncovered the dubious activities of some ministers and politicians. It even had at least one resign. Not sure if Gript has broken a story that led to a ministerial resignation yet.

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,709 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    Gript hasn't engaged in any investigative journalism. At most they placed a random member of the public in danger due to his nationality.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    Merely having a third level education does not mean that one understands the media or how a publication is assembled. There's a great clip from "Yes, Minister" that accurately describes the UK print media.

    The Irish print media is similar but has a smaller number of publications. The Irish Times seems to want to be the Irish version of the Gruaniad but it still has aspects of both the Telegraph and the Daily Mail. It is a much smaller market than that of the UK but this results in a kind of mainstreaming of opinion so that the IT, Indo and Examiner all begin to resemble each other. (The IT owns the IT and the Examiner.) Publications like Gript and On The Ditch become a threat to the consensus journalism and shared opinons far out of scale to their reach. (People who have different opinions often criticise them without ever having read any of their articles.) Previously, it would have cost a lot of money to set up and run a print publication but those costs don't generally apply to online publishing. This makes publications like Gript and On The Ditch far more agile. Both are free to read whereas the online versions of the print newspapers generally require a subscription.

    Publications like the IT and the Indo are surrendering the high ground without a shot being fired. Online readers will gravitate to what they can access for free and ignore the stuff behind the paywalls. When the Irish Times screwed up its first paywall strategy twenty years ago, it gave away the online news market to RTE and the Indo. This is why the Indo has adopted a softer paywall approach. Gript may not be suited to a completely paywalled operation but its market is one of the most precisely targeted ones in Ireland. And some people here still don't understand that.

    Regards...jmcc

    Post edited by jmcc on


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    That's a rather novel interpretation of how Mathematics functions. How do you think that the "rules" are derived and from what data? Are they like that laughable "97% of scientists agree" rubbish used to convince gullible people and Doomsday cultists looking for a new secular religion in which to believe?

    Critical thinking is the bedrock of STEM. You are probably wondering what connection STEM has to Gript. How do you think its audience is profiled and targeted? Other publications don't seem to be quite as targeted.

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,492 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    you could be correct, something called the Irish Light was put in the door yesterday it's scary that anyone would publish and distribute a 'newspaper' like that in Ireland.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16 DisgustedTunbridgeWells


    Whats wrong with reading a wide variety of publications and then forming your own opinion ? I read some Gript articles but also IT , Indo, Guardian and the Telegraph and others. It does not follow that I agree with all the opinions being presented....many published articles are opinion pieces and not necessarily my opinion but that is ok and even more beneficial as it makes me think and debate. Many people these days do not want to hear anything that does not align with their world view and seek to shut down debate by being rude and resorting to juvenile insults.



  • Registered Users Posts: 185 ✭✭drop table Users


    BBC have a podcast on the the Light in UK

    Highly recommended listen as to how these publications pull people down the rabbit hole and then turn their minds to mush to be used by far right

    I wonder who is funding this publication in Ireland now



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc



    It works because people will read free publications. Before Covid, a lot of the freesheets used to have a far greater share of the market than the paid-for local or regional newspapers. Online publication suits Gript because it doesn't have to pay extra for those who don't read it. With print, the number of copies printed and not sold is important in that they still have printing and distribution costs. Online publishing also changes the size of the audience compared to the geographical limitations of print. A publication like Gript would probably not be commercially viable or have the same reach in print.

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 41,062 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Gemma ODoherty is associated with the Irish version.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,492 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    I can't see why the mainstream media don't take him on Id say an interviewer of the caliber of Jeremy Paxman would fillet him nicely, at the same time he is entitled to his political views and that is very important in free democratic society.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,492 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    I still think they have to have mush for brains in the first place, they were waiting to be pulled down the rabbit hole.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,363 ✭✭✭Silentcorner


    No, I think media elites in this country see themselves as open minded, informed and well educated. They did decades ago, and still do today. When in reality they were/are nothing but pro establishment hacks...they were decades ago and they still are today.

    An open minded person is very tolerant of the views of others as they do not define themselves as left/right/catholic even though they may be one or all of those, something seriously lacking in today's environment....one view is all that is allowed on a growing number of vital issues that affect us all daily.

    Gript no so long ago did an interview with an Irish Climate Scientist who articulated a view that was in direct contrast to that of our Government!!!! Imagine that!!!!



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,492 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    I am confused now is the Life Institute the same as the Iona institute?



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    Apart from Sarah McInerney, David McCullough and Ivan Yates there are very few in the Irish media who would be capable of anything near a Paxman style interview of McGuirk.

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,492 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    Yeah David McCullough would do it, deadpan stare and is very forensic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    Have you listened to Sarah McInerney's interview of Eoghan Harris? That's the kind of interview style that might not work out well for McGuirk.

    McGuirk has a PR background so he is well able for most interviews and the old trick of putting him on a competely biased panel. I think that the Tonight Show did that a while ago and he demolished the interviewer and the panelists. He's smarter than most of the people that the Irish media uses for its panels and that allows him to get his points across easily. In that respect, he is dangerous to an unwary interviewer who underestimates him because he typically defeats the interviewer and the panelists in detail (essentially taking them out one by one). It is a very effective PR tactic and that's why a one to one interview with a competent interviewer would be better.

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,584 ✭✭✭✭For Forks Sake


    The last time he was let on RTE he cost us (taxpayers) €20,000 because of his inability to stick to the even basic truths, don't think he'll be invited back anytime soon.




  • Registered Users Posts: 11,584 ✭✭✭✭For Forks Sake




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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,709 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    McGuirk ain't the genius you think he is. If he was, he would be maintaining actual editorial standards on Gript. Instead they're a flailing mess. Also he's been a pr guy for Declan Ganley who basically uses him as a pawn for his flavor of the month topic.



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