Hamas strike on Israel - Threadbans in op - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

“Collateral damage” nonsense.

You're trying to make it sound as if Israel is taking out Hamas soldiers and a few innocents are being killed when in reality it’s the exact opposite, Israel are murdering civilian men, women and children and if a Hamas soldier is killed in the strikes then it’s a stroke of luck.

I don't really understand why you think it matters so much: there is evidence that at least some of these rapes and murders and kidnappings happened - don't you agree?

So that being the case, and KNOWING that the Israel-Gaza situation is so polarised that we've seen that there will always be people who will NEVER believe "their" side did anything wrong, no matter what the evidence, then what difference does it make if there is "only" eye-witness and forensic evidence for "a few" of these events?

It's not as though collecting evidence for 75% of them would have convinced those who will never be convinced anyway - is it?

So what's your point, exactly? Judaism, like Islam, is not comfortable with a delay before burial, nor with autopsies at all - and many people who do not really practise their religion still want the religious ritual of burial, certainly in my experience of many Irish non-practising Catholics. It's hardly surprising that in the immediate hours after such a catastrophe, autopsies were not people's first thought.

I don't imagine even the most cynical of them expected to be disbelieved to that extent, TBF.

Since South Africa has been mentioned as accusing Israel of "Genocide" I have to wonder why a corrupt and incompetent government in charge of a crime-ridden hellhole with very little electricity that can't even keep traffic lights on its roads, has such an interest in a conflict 6000 kilometres away. (For reference, the distance between Church Square in Pretoria and the Great Mosque in Khan Yunis is 6,381.28km

Why are South Africans Stealing Traffic Lights? (youtube.com)

I would have thought that the corrupt and incompetent government of South Africa would have priorities closer to home, but I guess crapping on Israel (and the 7+ million Jews who call it home) is more important. Hmm ...

There are other possibilities. One is that a person could look at the state of South Africa and conclude that their government is not a moral authority on anything. Another is that dunking on Israel might be a good way to distract from their own legendary failures at home.

But even assuming for the sake of argument that this is not connected to wider far-Left hostility to Israel - which is long standing as the people who chant "From the River to the Sea" can tell you - I still have to wonder why the corrupt and incompetent government of South Africa isn't more concerned about its own sky high murder rate which is the third highest in the world, or the daily rolling blackouts and rampant cable theft, all of threatens to turn SA into even more of a failed state than it is now.

I guess it's a hallmark of being a corrupt and incompetent government in charge of a failing hellhole that your main priority is to take a politically expedient side in a quarrel 6000 km away.

I think that most cases in the ICC are initiated by a third country to whatever conflict they are dealing with. Maybe you should start a thread on how corrupt SA is and how far away from Gaza it is located.

But it will interested to see where this case goes. I see an Irish lawyer is working as external counsel for the SA team, and she has previously with allegations of Serbian atrocities in Croatia.

True though it does upset the Israelis and their die hard supporters here which can be seen in how they post about SA.

Because there is a legal responsibility for signatories to the Geneva convention to prevent genocide.

Out of interest, what's the distance between Washington and Tel Aviv?

But it's not a "quarrel" is it? SA believe it is genocide by Israel on the Palestinians.

And they are legally obliged to do what they are doing.

I'd imagine the Israeli murder rate over the last three months puts the SA murder rate in the ha'penny place.

It is a quarrel. Israel wants to continue existing and protect it civilians from Hamas, Hezbollah and their foreign sponsors, and the other side wants the Jews dead and Israel wiped off the map. But it's still funny how the ANC of South Africa does not have the same problem with Russia and Vladimir Putin ...

And it's quite interesting that you compare the Israeli "murder" rate with South Africa considering that South Africa isn't at war.

Firstly, I think it's a little bit suspect that the ANC which had no problem rolling out the red carpet for actual genocidal dictators like Vladimir Putin, has such a problem with a tiny democracy 6000km away that's been locked in an existential struggle for 75 years. I would have thought stopping their own country from imploding under the weight of their own incompetence, corruption and malevolence would have been higher priorities.

And I'm dubious about Israel getting a fair trial considering how much of the world is against them.

So we have reached the point where the argument is being made that the majority world is against Israel, but that doesnt suggest Israel is in the wrong just the majority of wolrd is wrong. All independent thought has gone out the window now.

Extreme levels of animus towards Israel are long standing and pre-date the 7th of October. And you have to fault the ANC for having such a problem with Israel when they were more than happy to roll out the red carpet for Vladimir Putin. That would seem to be a double-standard, no?