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The new recycling system

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    #902
    bren2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,529 ✭✭✭bren2001


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597696#Comment_121597696

    You evidentially don’t understand the term “completely dismantled”.

    youre spreading misinformation.

    I am just arguing the way you do.



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    #903
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,748 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597692#Comment_121597692

    You are being obtuse now.

    Today, recycling bottles and cans is easy for everyone. In the new system, we're making recycling bottles and cans more difficult.

    There are some on here suggesting that having to keep all the bottles and cans in perfect condition, then bring them to a shop and feed them into a machine one by one to get a printed piece of paper, which you then take to the till to cash out or use against a purchase is just as easy as crushing them and tossing them all into your green bin in your garden, which is then conveniently lifted from outside your house every week or two.

    The mind boggles.

    Of course, you can still throw them in your green bin, however we have decided that people who recycle their bottles and cans in the most convenient way via the green bin will be financially punished for doing so, even though environmentally there is no difference whatsoever.



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    #904
    Red Silurian
    Registered Users Posts: 9,041 ✭✭✭Red Silurian


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597688#Comment_121597688

    When the argument is completely lost pull on the pedantic pants.



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    #905
    Red Silurian
    Registered Users Posts: 9,041 ✭✭✭Red Silurian


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597721#Comment_121597721

    No difference environmentally? Is the increased amount of recycling (60%-90%) not a huge environmental difference?



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    #906
    kabakuyu
    Registered Users Posts: 1,275 ✭✭✭kabakuyu


    Is this scheme not part of the whole Green party circular economy plan, we have just cut money to Ukrainians refugees but now their allowance can be supplemented by collecting cans.



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    #907
    Red Silurian
    Registered Users Posts: 9,041 ✭✭✭Red Silurian


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597795#Comment_121597795

    Yes their allowance has been cut by €193.20 per week, this can be made up by recycling between 773 and 1,288 bottles and cans that we don't want to claim a deposit back on every week... Good luck to them if that's their plan haha!



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    #908
    greasepalm
    Registered Users Posts: 5,318 ✭✭✭greasepalm


    Perfect can ,as when i drink them they get dented and thrown in a bin will more dents happen , yes as gone very weak now.

    I did like squashing cans down for recycling.



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    #909
    Red Silurian
    Registered Users Posts: 9,041 ✭✭✭Red Silurian


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597809#Comment_121597809

    Think I'll be moving from cans to plastic bottles personally speaking because of less chance of damaging them



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    #910
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,748 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597793#Comment_121597793

    Read it again.

    A bottle going in the green bin vs a bottle going in a machine, environmentally it makes no difference whatsoever. The people who already recycle, we are making it more difficult for them to do so for no benefit to them or the environment.

    I could continue to put all my bottles and cans in the green bin and environmentally that is absolutely perfect, but I'll be financially punished for doing so.

    For those who don't recycle well, the assumption is these people who can't be bothered to put bottles and cans in a green bin will be bothered to store them in perfect condition then bring them back to a shop to feed them into a machine to get a voucher that they can then queue up to redeem.



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    #911
    Qrt
    Registered Users Posts: 1,638 ✭✭✭Qrt


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597026#Comment_121597026

    I live in a tiny two bed mid terrace in a Celtic tiger estate. Others will manage.



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    #912
    Red Silurian
    Registered Users Posts: 9,041 ✭✭✭Red Silurian


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597834#Comment_121597834

    So you agree that the increased amount of recycling that will result from this scheme is a benefit to the environment?



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    #913
    bren2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,529 ✭✭✭bren2001


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597721#Comment_121597721

    The original statement was that the system has been completely dismantled.

    That’s incorrect. Boggles is spreading misinformation. This is what Boggles does, be obtuse. I wouldn’t reply to anyone else on the thread in this manner.



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    #914
    kippy
    Registered Users Posts: 18,566 ✭✭✭✭kippy



    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597793#Comment_121597793

    100 percent off all aluminium cans and plastic bottles that come into my house are put into the recycle bin already. Now I am going to be punished for doing this in two ways:

    1. I will pay more for cans and bottles.
    2. The cost of my bin collections will go up.

    That's a farce and a kick in the face to people who have been doing the right thing for years. Instead of assisting those that don't do the right thing - who may never do it, they are gone the opposite way.


    Why is 100 percent getting done this way? Because it's convenient for me to do it, I have kids that come home from school that double check it is getting done, I think its the right thing to do and I have some kind of sense.

    I've come up with plenty alternative/additional options that make far more sense than this scheme on every level, yet, as others have said, we have gone straight to this scheme. It's almost as if the local councils and officials don't really want to make things more convenient for people.



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    #915
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 34,651 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121586516#Comment_121586516

    The bonus is the bin companies will then get your deposit

    No. They won't. Anything that goes into the green bin gets flattened, it has to in order to last two weeks. Anyway they're pretty unlikely to employ people to pick out cans/bottles which look OK enough to go through a machine, then go off to a retailer with a truckload of them...

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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    #916
    creedp
    Registered Users Posts: 5,715 ✭✭✭creedp


    Its interesting that when I bring plastic bottles to the local bring centre Im supppsed to remove the caps and place in a seperate container yet apparently its advised to leave the cap on when feeding bottle into RVM. Why the different approach I wonder?



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    #917
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 40,003 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    They are bringing in a scheme which will cost an absolute fortune to cure a problem they don't know exists.

    Virtually everyone on here which is a decent sample size has said they have near perfect rates of offering cans and bottles for recycling.

    The main reason for this is convenience. They have just removed that one main factor.

    With the best will in the world people will not be able to maintain their current high rates of correct waste disposal.

    If I go to one of these machines with 50 items and 2 are rejected, I'm not taking those 2 to another shop for manual processing.

    Those 2 items are going in the nearest bin to me, which in all likely hood will be a general waste bin.

    Absolute looney tunes to dismantle the system that actually works for this convoluted expense mess.



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    #918
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,748 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597946#Comment_121597946

    You're still missing the point.

    Firstly, we have no idea that this will increase recycling. We're just hoping. As I said, we are hoping that people who are too lazy to use a green bin will be motivated enough to go through the much more cumbersome process we are introducing when it comes to recycling.

    But even if we leave that aside. I, and anyone else who recycles effectively today, can continue to throw things in our green bin rather than bring them back to the shop. This is absolutely perfect environmentally, it's excellent. Yet, for doing so, these people will be financially punished.

    They aren't being punished because they are hurting the environment (because they aren't), they are being punished because they are not using the inconvenient method. This is a major flaw in this system. Think about it for a second, you will be financially punished for recycling. It's stupid.

    Throwing bottles and cans in the green bin is great! It's exactly what we want. It's easy, it requires no effort. It is absolutely bizarre that in an effort to improve recycling we have decided that we need to stop people doing something that's very convenient and very efficient, in the hope that some other people who can't be bothered with the convenient method will suddenly be motivated to follow the inconvenient method.



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    #919
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,748 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598173#Comment_121598173

    I believe it's because bottles with the caps on are harder to damage, and so it's to avoid them being inundated with complaints when people are refused their money back because their bottle has a dent in it.



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    #920
    L1011
    Registered Users Posts: 68,644 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598173#Comment_121598173

    All advice these days is to leave caps on, indeed a growing number of plastic bottles detain the lid to the neck now. Coca Cola Bottlers here don't, but their UK and EU mainland equivalents do so I imagine that's coming soon.



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    #921
    L1011
    Registered Users Posts: 68,644 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598431#Comment_121598431

    They're bringing in a scheme the EU will require us to do within a few years unless we have 90% recycling rates.

    All my bottles and cans *at home* go to a recycling bin but all the ones I have out and about go to street bins - from where, if they get recycled at all, they end up dirty and damaged and less easy to actually recycle. When somewhere that has a scheme, I put them in my backpack. My recycling rate is going to go up, from actually pretty damn low for PET bottles to near 100%.

    Also, drink cans contaminate the rest of recycling as unless you wash and then leave to drip dry for days, they are never going to be completely empty.

    this is being brought in because it works, even if it inconveniences people - but people are massively overstating the inconvenience



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    #922
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,748 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598450#Comment_121598450

    If you think people who are happy to throw plastic bottles in general waste are going to carry the empty bottle around with them until they can get somewhere to bring it back you are delusional.

    That aside, it is clearly a massive inconvenience compared to the current system. It is genuinely hard to understand how anyone could possibly not see this.



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    #923
    L1011
    Registered Users Posts: 68,644 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598459#Comment_121598459

    Have you ever been to a country that has a scheme?

    They absolutely are.

    Delusional is what I'd say people repeatedly insisting that they're going to defy this / burn their other recycling in protest etc are. Completely and utterly bonkers, but yet they keep saying it as if it will change anything.



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    #924
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 40,003 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598450#Comment_121598450

    That's not the experience of the Dutch who have had this scheme for 2 years.

    They have 25,000 of these machines, we will have less than 10% of that and the data from there so far is conclusive, the on the go bottles are going into the nearest bin they come across. Not these machines.

    I don't think it's very surprising at all to be honest.

    I'm not going to litter, but I ain't walking a kilometre for a 10-15 cent voucher.



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    #925
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 40,003 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598464#Comment_121598464

     burn their other recycling in protest

    Who is going to do that?



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    #926
    bren2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,529 ✭✭✭bren2001


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598509#Comment_121598509

    Do you have a source to back up your claim that the data is inconclusive?

    Deposits were introduced on small plastic bottles in July 2021 and in the first year of operation around 80% were handed in for recycling.



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    #927
    L1011
    Registered Users Posts: 68,644 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598509#Comment_121598509

    The Dutch system has been introduced gradually and chaotically. Even then I don't think the stats actually confirm what you're claiming.

    Also, you just bring them home and put them in the pile you have at home for next time you do a large drop - nobody, ever, goes looking to get the refund on a single.



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    #928
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 40,003 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598532#Comment_121598532

    It's not my opinion.

    I haven't been to Holland in years.

    I linked to it earlier, below.

    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121485587#Comment_121485587

    28,000 collection points, not 25,000.

    Also, you just bring them home and put them in the pile you have at home for next time you do a large drop - nobody, ever, goes looking to get the refund on a single.

    But that is idealistic flim flam that won't translate to real life in the main.

    See the above real life example.



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    #929
    bren2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,529 ✭✭✭bren2001


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598554#Comment_121598554

    Where’s the inconclusive data you claimed? Or is that another opinion presented as a fact?

    You’ve also selectively quoted from that article. 68% being the figure of all plastic bottles were returned for deposit last year. You chose to omit this.

    Why would you limit it to just small bottles? The EU target isn’t for only small plastic bottles, is it? It’s all plastic bottles.



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    #930
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 40,003 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598578#Comment_121598578

    Where’s the inconclusive data you claimed?

    Huh?

    You completely missed the point of the article, but that's okay.



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    #931
    bren2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,529 ✭✭✭bren2001


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598587#Comment_121598587

    You can’t back up your claims it seems. Yet again.

    Why did you selectively quote from the article and omit the true figure of 68%?



This discussion has been closed.
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