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Sexism in Ireland

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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,021 ✭✭✭Lewis_Benson


    Sorry to hear that.

    Would it be very often it happens?



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,500 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    The 'normal men' for want of a better word, far outweigh the others to be fair, and younger Irish men do then to be much more comfortable with woman.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,827 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,787 ✭✭✭Pauliedragon


    OP your comments are coming across as generalising about Irish men and it's not fair to do that. I have had plenty of female friends/colleagues and aquantiances over the years and I have never been inappropriate with any of them. Neither have my male friends. Do you think there might be a reason why my female friend who has lived in both Ireland and the UK feels safer here? Anything bad experiences you've been through I feel bad for you. But the stories I hear from people who have lived in both countries say the UK is much worse for sexism.



  • Registered Users Posts: 299 ✭✭awanderer


    I am French and I can assure you that having a mistress is no more accepted in France than it is in Ireland. I even remember a plumber in a town I lived in, who had to move away after cheating on the mother of his children. She threw him out, he moved with his mistress and people would never call him for a job after that. Mistresses were never accepted in France except in courts in the past (but then it was the same all over the world) and in some very small intellectual/artistic/political, mainly Parisian, circles it seems.

    It is so frustrating to hear/read that same silly and baseless assertion repeated over and over again.


    Beside that, I fully agree about Ireland being sexist but I believe it is based in the place that the country gave to women historically, including in its constitution.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,827 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    It is quite common, not just in Ireland for ladies to revel in, and enjoy the benefits of their relatively privileged position in their 20's and maybe into their early 30's. Thereafter, they don't like that system as they are replaced by a younger cohort (who are then reaping the concentrated benefits). There is a double fall really - from an "artificially" elevated position to one that is "artificially" lowered.


    And when they are in their younger years, they often "reward" the men who display the behaviour and traits you now don't like. From your post, you do appear to be mixing in some strange company though


    People just have to accept life and get on with things. It doesn't happen to everyone of course but there are sizeable chunk for whom it appears to be a bit of a shock when reality lands.



  • Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭chacha11


    I'm not sure why I'm being questioned on who I'm hanging around with, when I said that ive been sexually harassed by men while I was simply walking on the street in Ireland.

    Cna I choose what men are walking on the street with me?

    I also didn't say I've only been sexually harassed at meetup groups.

    I saw bad sexual behaviour when I was in college in Ireland. I saw men chanting and laughing "any hole's a goal" at a young age.

    Since then I've been sexually harassed at book clubs, acting groups, music bands in ireland. Loads of different social settings in Ireland.men have been inappropriate How does it make any sense for you or anyone to say to me "choose better who you hang around with" eh no. And it's happened to lots of women I know too. Ive had loads of chats with my female friends about this.

    Sadly we now tell each other which places to avoid, which places are not safe. So we won't get sexually harassed there



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,962 ✭✭✭nachouser


    It's a wind-up thread. Either that or the OP overheard a couple of lads talking about how they might best go about raping someone and they didn't bother to inform that someone.



  • Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭chacha11


    You say women are privileged in their early twenties. You are again valuing women by their sexual worth alone. Women don't see themselves like that.

    Twenties are a nice time and is a fun time

    But most women have better careers and more money in their thirties . So thirties is a great time too.



  • Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭chacha11


    It is only some men who think this.

    I have only some heard men say this about women. They say that women are worth nothing when they get older. Which is obviously a horrible thing to say.

    What I have heard from women themselves , is that their lives get better and better as they get older. That why really enjoy life into their forties fifties and sixties. My aunt just got marrie door the first time at age 56 and her and her husband are so sweet and in love



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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,827 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    Well they are privileged compared to women in their 40's. No point saying otherwise. A lot of life is just easier for a good-looking 25 year old. And I'd say the majority who are in that position don't mind it when they are 25.



  • Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭chacha11


    Ah typos. That should say

    It is only some men who think this.

    I have only some heard men say this about women. They say that women are worth nothing when they get older. Which is obviously a horrible thing to say.

    What I have heard from women themselves , is that their lives get better and better as they get older. That they really enjoy life into their forties, fifties and sixties. My aunt just got married for the first time at age 56 and her and her husband are so sweet and in love



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,787 ✭✭✭Pauliedragon


    Well said nachouser. This is a complete wind up or paranoia that's on a completely different level. My guess is the former.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,827 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    Nobody said your life couldn't get better. But your focus will be different to your 20s. And that isn't necessarily a bad thing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭chacha11


    Can you read?

    Go back and read my comment.

    Do you See where it says "I reported this conversation about sexual assault to the group leader". Nothing was done

    Good man.



  • Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭chacha11


    Ah the textbook "calling the woman crazy to diminish her" comment. You're so predictable pauliedragon.



  • Registered Users Posts: 109 ✭✭HamSarris


    I would struggle to think of any outwardly sexist comments or behaviours I witnessed in recent years. In fact, I would now say that most men have an instinctive anxiety about saying anything that could be construed as sexist and risk getting hauled up before HR. There will be a lot fewer marriages in the coming years because the guy was too afraid to ask his future wife out for a drink.

    I can only think of two explanations for the OP’s experience. 

    1. The OP works or socialises in contexts where the 5% or so of sexist men in Ireland are more prevalent – e.g., alcoholics, drug users, low IQs, criminals etc. who don’t have much to lose by making a sexist comment, working in a nightclub around drunk men, working with tradies where banter (aimed at all sexes and races) is part of the entertainment of the day.  
    2. The OP has had past difficult experiences with men which causes their brain to be overly sensitive to anything that could be perceived as sexist - a comment about online dating is perceived as a creepy, comment about sex; a harmless compliment by an ugly guy is perceived as harassment; constructive criticism by a manager is perceived as putting women down. One problem with such a mindset and attitude is that it can actually elicit sexist behaviours from men. For example, women who treat all men as creeps aren't going to get the most respectful behaviours in return.  

    So I'm sorry OP if you've been unfortunate enough to keep encountering sexist men but the suggestion that Ireland is some sexist cesspool compared to the UK or continential Europe holds no objective weight.



  • Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭chacha11


    You're just really saying a woman's life is easier at 25 than at 40 because she looks better I guess

    But the woman doesn't just think about her looks does she. She thinks about money and how comfortable she is in life. Im early thirties. I feel that life is much much easier for me now than when I was early twenties. In early twenties you are in a lower paid job. In your thirties you've worked your way up to a good job and you have a lot more money. I'm early thirties and I find life is much easier for me now than when I was in my early twenties. I have more money. I've a much better car. Life is easier in every way financially. I can't speak for every woman though. Maybe some found their twenties easier



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,787 ✭✭✭Pauliedragon


    If you can quote me where I said you were crazy please?



  • Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭chacha11


    I really don't know how to argue with someone who didn't even basically read what I wrote.

    You said "i didn't bother to inform someone " about the rape talk.

    When I clearly wrote in my post


    "I informed the group leader about the conversation, and nothing was done".



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,787 ✭✭✭Pauliedragon


    Are you going to apologise for accusing me of calling you crazy because I didn't.



  • Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭chacha11


    Seriously. Your exact words were "the OP has paranoia on a different level".

    Lovely



  • Registered Users Posts: 299 ✭✭awanderer


    I agree with the fact that racism is much more obvious and a much bigger issue at the moment and I am sure it is much easier to be a woman than Traveller or a black man in Ireland. However, there is rarely a day when I don't get annoyed by the everyday, insidious, sexism. It is not hate, just men being condescending without even meaning to be. And even much worse: women behaving as if men were above them (also without realising they do so). I have been living in Ireland for over 2 decades and it still shocks me.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,880 ✭✭✭YellowLead




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,962 ✭✭✭nachouser


    "In fact I left one social group that I went to in Ireland, because I overheard two of the men talking about another woman that was in the grouo. They were joking that he should get her very drunk and then bring her back to his house and remember if she says no, it means yes.

    I couldn't stomach being around those guys and I left that social group. I did report that conversation to the group leader. I don't think anything was done"

    But, according to you, you didn't bother to give the heads up to the woman who was casually being discussed and, apparently overheard by you, as a rape target. Yeah, good luck.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,827 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    That's fine. I didn't say life couldn't get better - I already made that explicit.


    For what anecdotes are worth, I remember a female friend of mine who was a complete stunner in her 20's. I would see randomers acting what I would have described as sexist and objectifying towards her. But she loved that at the time. I'm sure the constant attention was very flattering. She appeared to have a a very soft spot for what she described as "a rogue". And it wasn't just in bars or nightclubs - it would be going into a shop or garage or something in the middle of the day. She was subject to it constantly. But it always put a smile on her face. Nearly any fella from early 20's to mid 40's or even older who met her would try to chat her up.

    A bit after she hit her 30's she completely turned around and began to detest that sort of culture. She now thinks what the "same" lads do today is disgusting. I say "same" as in the same age and mentality and actions as the ones she basically used to encourage, albeit indirectly. I do feel sorry for her in some ways. Although she says she doesn't mind. She obviously realises what was going on in those days and that most of those interactions were meaningless but I'd have to imagine it would still be difficult.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,787 ✭✭✭Pauliedragon


    There's a big difference between paronoia and crazy. Paranoia is by defanition means unjustified suspicion and mistrust. In my opinion your comments about Irish men are unjustified.Crazy is defined as being wild or aggressive. I never suggested you were wild or aggresive. I never once suggested you were crazy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭chacha11


    What am awful diminishing post

    Again you've written the very strange argument which has been said on here before of "it's ops fault for choosing bad men to hang around with."

    When the simple fact is that women experience sexual harrrasment and abuse in many places that they go to in life. Women have reported sexual harassment in colleges, walking down the street in daytime, walking in parks. It is nothing to do with what men women choose to hang around with. And you know it.

    You said I hang around with men who are alcoholics/drug users /low iq. I have never met an alcoholic or a drug addict . I don't know any.

    If you read the thread I have said many times now that the sexual harrrasment I have experiences has been in normal situations and by "well educated" men.

    At colleges. In meetup groups. In book clubs. In choirs.

    I don't know why you think "well educated " men with good jobs don't sexually harass people. Look at the doctors that have been in trouble for sexually abusing women



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,238 ✭✭✭✭Furze99




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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,572 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35




This discussion has been closed.
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