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Room to Improve (v2)

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,436 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    Yes I am a member of Engineers Ireland. I would expect if approached by professional body that the government would facilitate that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,386 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    If the info is there for all architects, why did Bannon need a briefing.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,386 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    It's not a tender but the Department still has an obligation to act fairly with all stakeholders. We all know that other architects wouldn't have got the meeting with the Minister's advisors.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,482 ✭✭✭✭elperello




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,698 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,698 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Me too.

    Politics using TV to get their message our is pretty much the norm across the world.



  • Registered Users Posts: 544 ✭✭✭Niall_76


    The thread seems to be going around in circles the last few pages.. apart from one strange tangent that may have been posted in error?

    I wonder what the next episode will throw up.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 374 ✭✭lmk123


    The majority of it is the most stupid pointless rubbish you’d ever see. Constant repetition presented as fact.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,386 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    So you reckon that any architect who rang up the Department with a query was invited in for a high level meeting? I've got a bridge to sell you, mate.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,337 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    What message did the Minister or his advisor get out? Information on the grants is widely available on government websites and from councils. When ordinary members of the public ask the council can they knock down half or most of a house to get the Refurbishment grant for Vacant and Derelict houses, they are told the house has to be vacant and derelict and even then, they must keep most of the structure: otherwise it would be a new build and that is not what the Refurbishment grant for Vacant and Derelict houses was set up for. For "enviromental reasons as well" (his exact words) , sez the man in the council.

    So the message from the politician, who used tv to get out the message, is you are a special case if you have a private meeting with the minister or his advisor?

    Extremely few other people around the country have got the grant and in some areas average waiting time for a pre-planning meeting with the council is 141 days....that is just to speak to someone in the council, not the minister's advisor.

    Thank God what goes on here in Ireland is not the norm across the world, show me another country with the 99k grants farce on what Bannon's design team called "essentially a New-Build" (their exact words) on Room to Improve last weekend.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,698 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    If you think that a few people stamping their feet about grants is gonna change how access works around the world, (not just here), you really should not be left alone with the telly remote.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,698 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Extremely few other people around the country have got the grant and in some areas average waiting time for a pre-planning meeting with the council is 141 days....that is just to speak to someone in the council, not the minister's advisor.

    This is for the politics or CA forum.

    But go on, what data have you got on the grants dispersal or is this someone who you met in the pub told you this?

    The 'message' seems obvious to me anyway - look what you can do with government grants.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,337 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    The 'message' seems obvious to most people - " look what you can do with government grants " if you have the right connections.

    You are right, its not what you know, it is who you know. Even if your property is genuinely vacant and much more derelict than that bungalow sold for 303k the previous year.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,698 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    The insinuation/allegation you are making is: Bannon and RTE had a meeting with the Dept., the Dept then got on to Tipperary CoCo and told them and their officials to hand out 100,000 to a couple who did not qualify for it.

    Then RTE Bannon and the Dept told the media about this 'meeting' then RTE broadcast a programme where the corruption was SO evident MOST people spotted it.

    That about it?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,482 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    No I don't.

    Not in the market for a bridge ATM but I built a few.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,337 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    No. We do not know what happened at the private meeting between Bannon/Irwin and the ministers's advisor. We do know that elsewhere in the country the local council was asked about the grant / to clarify the grant and the reply was that for the "Refurbishment grant for Vacant and Derelict houses" half or most of the house could NOT be demolished for the grant. "That is not what the grant was for", "for environmental reasons also" etc.

    Also the house had to be genuinely vacant and derelict.

    Bannon's team on Room to Improve called it "essentially a New-Build". Their words, not mine.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,391 ✭✭✭✭Furze99




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,698 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Seems to me Furze that after a week there seems to be only one group 'dying' - the conspiracy theorists. No traction at all from what I can see and I am long enough in the tooth to know how these things normally work.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,391 ✭✭✭✭Furze99


    Might be useful to others. There's at least two Facebook groups worth looking at

    Irish Cottage and Farm Building Restoration - admin by a lime company in the business, based in Cork.

    Derelict/vacant house restoration Ireland - admin is a chap in the business in Donegal I think.

    Lots of repetitive queries and varying advice on both but well worth sifting through.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,698 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    No. We do not know what happened at the private meeting between Bannon/Irwin and the ministers's advisor.

    Yes we do know.

    Speaking at the RTÉ campus today, Bannon detailed that he and Irwin were briefed on “what the grants were all about”.

    A spokesperson for the department told The Journal a briefing on the “mechanics of the scheme” was provided in the meeting.

    If you think something else happened that is an allegation and a theory. Some would say...a conspiracy theory

    We do know that elsewhere in the country the local council was asked about the grant / to clarify the grant and the reply was that for the "Refurbishment grant for Vacant and Derelict houses" half or most of the house could NOT be demolished for the grant. 

    How do we know this?

    And how does it impinge on other cases? Each case is different/.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,337 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    Bannon and his Q.S. should not have needed to request with the Misinster's adviser just to find out “what the grants were all about”.

    They were already building professionals, working in the field for many years and it was already their job to know “what the grants were all about”.

    Do not treat the rest of us like fools.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,698 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    So you are alleging that something else happened at this meeting.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,337 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    No, I said we do not know what went on or all that was discussed at the meeting. No transcripts on notes or anything were produced afaik. Others have said there needs to be a freedom of information request or something.

    You said of the meeting with the Ministers's adviser "Bannon detailed that he and Irwin were briefed on “what the grants were all about”."

    I replied : Bannon and his Q.S. should not have needed to request with the Misinster's adviser just to find out “what the grants were all about”.

    They were already building professionals, working in the field for many years and it was already their job to know “what the grants were all about”.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,698 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    We do know because both Bannon and the dept have said what it was about.

    If you don't accept that explanation then you are alleging that something else went on at the meeting.

    At least be honest about what you are saying as another poster was.


    What Bannon and his QS should know or not know is immaterial tbh.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,337 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    What Bannon and his QS should know is very material. They should have known about the grants before that requested meeting, as they were already well seasoned and experienced professionals in the field. If they did not know about of or about the property grants then, it would not say much about them. Of course they already knew about the grants. They should not have needed a private meeting with a Minister's advisor just to find out “what the grants were all about”, as is claimed. If I or anyone else asked to find out what the grants were all about, I'd be told to look at the government website or ask the local council. I'd say they talked about other things too. Maybe even the weather.;)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 374 ✭✭lmk123


    Could Francie and Francis start a separate tread (or just private message) where ye can just go over and back all day long repeating everything to each other constantly and leave the rest of us out of it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,337 ✭✭✭Francis McM


    Grand, I will not post about last Sunday's house in Cashel on this thread again. I think everything has been said about that anyway.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,698 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I admire people who can admit they are not expert or have a full grasp of the detail.

    As said previously, Bannon's status and show was beneficial to a Dept wanting to get the existence of grants (which have not, by your own admission been taken up as they should) out there.

    Promoting the grants and demonstrating what can be done with them (an advertised feature of this season) was the focus of the series. So being on top of the detail was beneficial to RTE and Bannon. Believing that you could get two grants (First Time Buyers and Vacancy) could easily have been cut out of the show but Bannon does seem to have little problem with showing the mistakes he makes and the fact that he is fallible like us all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,759 ✭✭✭Trampas


    Bannon never does a how about this and it’s tens of thousands under budget. He’s always pushing the budget. Money saved on grants is just spent and not you’ve got some money back. Never see him saying let’s go to IKEA for a kitchen or something else



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,675 ✭✭✭Field east


    Francis, your third paragraph, I cannot believe it. If the presentation’s’ main/major focus was the highlighting of grants available, well he made a right ‘dog’s dinner’ of it and the whole thing was very misleading re the derilect not lived in for two years element

    . And being falable in he dealing with the core elements of the prog - mainly budget, grants available and grant conditions to be met. Come on. Are these not very much part of the bread and butter of his trade and in relation to the nature of the prog he is presenting? Do’nt tell me that RTE has, indirectly, another Ryan Tubridy type on it ‘s books



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