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Ian Bailey RIP - threadbans in OP

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  • Registered Users Posts: 30,620 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    It could point different ways. It can just point to someone who hates women or people. Serial killers \ psychopaths will inflict violence far beyond that necessary to kill in an act of de-personalisation. I'm aware of cases of random hitchhikers being killed, stranger on stranger violence, that is on a level above even that which was inflicted on Sophie. I wouldn't assume it must indicate a personal connection, though a personal hatred can be behind such violence also.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,077 ✭✭✭tibruit


    It`s clear, based on available testimony quoted by the DPP, that the marks on his hands were minimal before the murder and very obvious afterwards. Multiple people who were in his company the night before the noticed nothing and only three who met him in the following days failed to notice scratches. It is also obvious that there was no cut on his forehead at all until after the murder.



  • Registered Users Posts: 156 ✭✭Zola1000


    Furthermore couldn't it still be where he had gloves and coat and was protected from any significant scratches...



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,077 ✭✭✭tibruit


    "Serial/Psychopaths will inflict violence far beyond that necessary to kill in an act of de-personalisation."

    Sophies murder was certainly overkill. With serial killers and psychopaths in mind then it is worth mentioning that a page from Bailey`s diary was shown in Murder At The Cottage. It begins...."If I could kill someone now, I would." He then considers that he might compile a list of those that he wished to kill.



  • Registered Users Posts: 156 ✭✭Zola1000


    This maybe true but seriously the worst part of all this is also relying on sketch drawings of his hands as well. I read that from some police officers sketching them. Like how purely stupid to not even take photographs of some sort for evidence. Eitherway again the evidence is not there and was good time later and too much discussion on scratches and ultimately those who saw them others didn't leaves evidence diluted.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭FishOnABike


    Other than the Lyons house, approx. 50 meters past Sophie's house, and Richardson's approx 100 meters away but unoccupied, the next nearest neighbours were more than a kilometer away and set back from the road. If the Lyons heard nothing it's not likely anyone over twenty times further away would have seen or heard anything.

    I wouldn't infer anything from there being no reports of anyone seeing or hearing anything.

    Similarly I wouldn't infer anything from when someone reported hearing dogs barking. If dogs barked when they heard something over 1km away the country would never be quiet.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,527 ✭✭✭tobefrank321


    You would imagine if it was a burglar who arrived in a car or parked up somewhere in a car, they would have been tempted to put the body in the car and dispose of it somewhere.

    I really don't think there was a car involved in this, there's been no evidence of one anywhere. For me its someone who came on foot and left on foot.

    Regards disturbed burglars if they knew the area and did a bit of research they'd have known it was a holiday home and would be empty for most of the year, so no risk of bumping into the owner.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,527 ✭✭✭tobefrank321


    That sounds suspiciously like intent to me. Who writes these things in their journals?



  • Registered Users Posts: 156 ✭✭Zola1000


    Like it's so annoying nearly every aspect of this case.

    These are remaining points I have , some might not be relevant but its all I know

    - We need new significant statement or substantial piece of DNA evidence kept from previously maybe but I likely and for this to go under scope of enhanced DNA equipment in hope of yielding something new. If it doesn't then all we have is newly put together report for DPP.

    -A reason the french government are not opening up their own case and look at potential of their own french citizens who resided in the area. This should be conducted especially if new DPP report doesn't reveal anything.

    The french court case on bailey cannot be viewed as being valid and with suspect now passed they have to be open to new angle under some law.

    -our own threads are probing questions but it still seems highly unlikely the guardai have not scrutinized these options and theories so ultimately we are left with someone or anyone who knows something who has or hasnt come forward previously and not only that but something they can prove to police



  • Registered Users Posts: 50 ✭✭Milominderbender


    I'm amazed no one seems to have posted the director of public prosecutions report. If you think Bailey is guilty it is this document you must argue against and why you think you know better than the DPP.

    I only read it myself a couple days ago. I was expecting it to merely lament the lack of admissable evidence against Bailey and have a few choice words against the Garda's bungled investigation. It not only does that but it sounds as if the DPP is convinced of Ian Bailey's innocence. What an appalling injustice. RIP

    * I'm a new poster so I cannot post a link to it. I'd recommend anyone with an interest in the to read it. It's only 44 pages long so shouldn't take up to much of your time.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,077 ✭✭✭tibruit


    A very disturbed individual with murder on his mind. I don`t have a screen grab but I made a note that it`s Episode 3 of Murder at the Cottage about 40 minutes in.



  • Registered Users Posts: 156 ✭✭Zola1000


    It's very good read and your totally correct like the facts are not sufficient and information isn't sufficient to bring to a trail. The reliance on anything new or existing evidence going under enhanced DNA is the only hope to bring the bailey part closer to scenario or not..and if not then we are left with only the french bringing another angle to investigation if we can't yield anything else.

    It's disrespectful to our system to take our file and say we have enough evidence to convict this person but our side doesn't have that evidence. It should then rest with France to open up file on suspects they find



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭FishOnABike


    There is nothing to be gained by the French courts by reopening a closed case. They have a conviction. Reopening the case would be an admission that they were wrong.



  • Registered Users Posts: 70 ✭✭TruthorBust


    Anyone else think her son is a pain in the hole?



  • Registered Users Posts: 30,620 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Against briar thorns? Unlikely unless you were in biking type gear. And there was no reports of any such damage on his coat.

    If anything, gloves would protest against light scratching and not briar thorns coming through.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users Posts: 30,620 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    I agree with your points about the case and the report, but on a point of order, I have posted the link to it multiple times and I think someone else did also. But no worries, it is a fast moving thread.

    This is the version I have. If you have a longer one, PM me the URL \ document and I can post to thread.

    https://syndicatedanarchy.wordpress.com/2014/09/30/30/

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users Posts: 30,620 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    "I could have killed him."

    Never heard that phrase before?

    This is a stretch.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,904 ✭✭✭hoodie6029


    As horrific as it sounds, the disturbed burglar or peeping Tom hypothesis is as good an explanation as anything else.

    Pinning it on Bailey feeds our innate need for an understandable story.

    As with the Aisling Murphy murder, the rumour that the killer had beef with her over reporting his kids to child and family agency was completely without foundation but it circulated for weeks after the killing. They were complete strangers to each other.

    It is less horrific to people when there is some reason, no matter the merit. The only slight difference here with the murder of Sophie is that the perpetrator may not have set out to kill anyone but resorted to murder to get away.

    Given the region and era and time of year, it was most likely a local killer. IMO, it wasn’t Bailey.

    This is water. Inspiring speech by David Foster Wallace https://youtu.be/DCbGM4mqEVw?si=GS5uDvegp6Er1EOG



  • Registered Users Posts: 156 ✭✭Zola1000


    Yes I know what your saying. But it now leaves an opportunity lost. The french don't get to extradite bailey and now he's deceased so family won't get confirmation. So why then are family still pushing for conviction when our file is at maximum level of possible options and they are then pushing for our DPP to now possible suggest bailey is guilty..based on what new evidence if any...it is going to be some U-turn by DPP considering the first report. That's why if guardai returns file and it's just new version of bailey one...the dpp won't U-turn. Then nobody has opened up outside of Ireland /country angle ..that's why french should stick to bringing something to table..but I know It won't happen but then..we have no options left..



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,599 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    It's human nature to attach a narrative to a horrific crime.

    It's how we make sense of things.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 156 ✭✭Zola1000


    Ok. I more meant even if some types of normal ployester types gloves they would lessen scratches to offer some protection but agree again it's unlikely. Alternatively would it have been possible to evade larger briars or some of briars by way of stance of standing on road. That I guess is still pure speculation and we don't have any proof of gloves



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,599 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    He suffered an unimaginable tragedy and trauma whilst still a child.

    He was very close to his mother. It was just the two of them really.

    I do think he's too fixated on Ian Bailey as the killer though. I don't see why he's so certain.



  • Registered Users Posts: 802 ✭✭✭Juran


    I read in the irish times (paywall) that yhey are NOW looking through a video of a festival which took place in the early 90's in the local.area to see if Bailey can be seen talking with Sophie .. as he claimed he never met the lady. Why are they only doing this now ?

    I'm no trained detective or investigator, but the more I read about the investigation, and the lack of retaining evidence, recording evidence or any data via photos or samples, etc.. it just beggers belief.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,599 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    That's my reasoning.

    She also had a phone next to her bed so she could've called 999 if she was scared.

    Also the lights were off in the house. I think this means she left quickly.

    She put her boots on with no socks also. The boots were laced up but maybe she was able to slip them on quickly. They had an elasticated opening.

    I think there was an intruder. Possibly someone with a key.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,208 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    You may be right but the killer(s) may have come back to check the house afterwards and turn off the lights destroy evidence?



  • Registered Users Posts: 156 ✭✭Zola1000


    This is worrying for sure have this theory. Where someone knew the house had key ..I note earlier poster here indicating how did they know of cinder block in pump house or had knowledge of pump house or had access. This is strange theories. Can one say that these are all maybe in guards file...but then if they don't carry weight ..they don't make it into dpp file..



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,599 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    If we assume the smudge on the backdoor is from the killer, then they most likely came back after killing her.

    They would only come back for something very important like incriminating evidence. Perhaps a key they left in the backdoor.

    I don't think turning off the lights is enough of a reason.

    It's a fair walk from the gate to the backdoor.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,077 ✭✭✭tibruit


    It`s "If I could kill someone now I would."

    It`s in his diary. Murder at the Cottage, Episode 3, 40 minutes in. He considers creating a list of potential victims.



  • Registered Users Posts: 156 ✭✭Zola1000


    Also are we saying it didn't all immediately happen on road...because there was unknown blood on front door...did intruder go back check things..



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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,865 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Sure hasn't he and the French authorities been spoonfed a load of crap from AGS about how Bailey was the man who did it, etc. Why woiuldn't they think it was Bailey?



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