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Ian Bailey RIP - threadbans in OP

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,527 ✭✭✭tobefrank321


    Right, so you have no suspect, you are not willing to speculate, but you will have a go at anyone who speculates if Bailey should be a suspect or not.

    Not a very positive contribution.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,481 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Come back with them goal posts.

    Prime Suspect.

    There is absolutely no evidence of a sexual motive in this killing.

    So she was killed for pleasure or profit.

    That was the starting point of this case and remains it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,827 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    If Bailey is the wrong answer, then it is a positive contribution.

    Even if you don't have the right answer to a question, eliminating wrong ones is 'positive' in that sense.

    Bailey should have been investigated by the Guards at the outset, the problem was the tunnel vision they engaged in, and when it got to the shenanigans with Marie Farrell that's when someone should have had the sense to shout stop and take a step back.

    I think the active focus post the DPP rejection should not have been on Bailey but elsewhere and on forensic advancements (which may point back to Bailey or elsewhere). In that sense I don't think he should have been an 'active' suspect at that point. If he is your only suspect, you need to keep looking.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,527 ✭✭✭tobefrank321


    This post is such nonsense its barely worth replying to. I outlined why I thought Bailey should be a suspect in reasonable detail, and you're still not happy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,527 ✭✭✭tobefrank321


    I said rejection. Once again putting words in people's mouths.

    Bailey was alleged to have blacked out and attacked his first wife, it was mentioned in one of his court cases - go find it if you could be bothered, although I know you're not.

    He blacked out when attacking Thomas.

    Its entirely possible he blacked out attacking Du Plantier also.

    So no sexual motive, just blind violence that he was known for.

    I couldn't be bothered reading or replying to any more of your comments, so say hello to ignore.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,585 ✭✭✭baldbear


    He spoke to a friend in the 2nd person saying. He took a fancy to her. Went up to the house drunk to tell her he was a poet thinking she would be lured in..when she laughed in his face he got angry went for her. She ran . He followed and killed her.

    I honestly think he did do it. If there wasn't a delay in the pathologist getting there and if gardai were on the ball at the scene instead of trampling all over the murder scene he would have been convicted.

    He made a few drunken admissions,burned his clothes afterwords (turkey blood of course)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,827 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Went up to the house after 3am to do this? And why would Sophie open the door to him? And why would he think she would at that hour?

    I find it difficult to credit. If it had happened earlier in the night, and say Bailey on his way home from the pub wandered by even at 10pm maybe.

    It seems like it wouldn't have been the first rebuff Bailey got, yet no record of any violent reaction to them in the past.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,452 ✭✭✭lee_baby_simms


    It doesn’t seem plausible that he blacked out and then decided to leave the house at 2am and walk for at least an hour in the freezing dark and was still blacked out when the attack occurred.

    The walk could have taken 2 hours if Bailey was as drunk as hypothesised.

    Equally the notion that he called to the door at 3am in an attempt to woo her with his crap poetry isn’t credible either without there being a history of such behaviour.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,527 ✭✭✭tobefrank321


    In terms of blacked out, he was able to beat up Thomas, yet wasn't able to remember it. I would say a blind rage possibly came over him.

    There was some form there with blacking out.

    And on that note, I'm going to leave it at that with this thread, as I've little more to contribute apart from what I already said.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,481 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    So he tried to form a new consensual sexual relationship using poetry when he was blacked out miles away in the middle of a winters night?

    Okay.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,452 ✭✭✭lee_baby_simms


    This is obviously just conjecture but I think an aspect of the case that points away from Bailey was the nature of the murder itself.

    I don’t want to go into the details again but it was a sustained, frenzied attack. Whoever did something like this is likely to possess some serious personality disorders.

    A murder this brutal doesn’t feel like it was prompted by her closing her door on someone like Bailey. I feel like it was someone who knew her, someone who she was perhaps previously in a relationship with that she had ended and this person had a deep sense of infatuation and rejection combined with an extreme anger disorder.

    We’ll never know but it feels more likely than anything linking Bailey to it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,899 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    "It’s 20 years since your husband died. What does the anniversary mean to you?

    My husband was more than my husband, he was my whole life. I had a very difficult childhood and life, and he became.my best friend, my family, and my mentor. To lose him was the worst thing in my life."

    Melita Toscan du Plantier

    Cui Bono.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,604 ✭✭✭Oscar_Madison


    “Conjecture” is all we have so no need to apologise for it- there is no one person here on this thread who “has the answer” but many forcefully believe they do- maybe they did it😀

    I posted earlier around the nature of the injuries - with the body of knowledge on murders throughout the world that police forces have access to , there’s almost certainly clues there - not definitive by any means, but certainly indicators of the reasons why this person was murdered in the manner that they were.

    Questions such as why kill vs seriously assault?

    Why the use of weapons (brick etc) as opposed to hands?

    Why the nature of the head and facial injuries?

    I’ve no idea the answers to any of those questions but I’ve no doubt there is a body of knowledge out there that could very possibly help. I’d say the FBI and the like would certainly have a view - they mentioned at the start of this investigation that they were starting afresh - well for me, the true beginning is to start with exploring the injuries incurred.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 87,297 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1


    Will his erotic fiction books diaries poetry etc., be published, could his sister do this through solicitor Frank Buttimer

    I know a few who bought paintings now thinking a rise in value

    I await his biopic with Brian Cox or Ciaran Hinds as Ian



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,452 ✭✭✭lee_baby_simms


    I once saw him out at the market in Skibbereen. In the car park. He was selling wooden dildos amongst other things. Seriously.

    Definitely a niche market.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 87,297 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,827 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    I had thought Ciaran Hinds or Patrick Bergin, depending on budget... but time has moved on. Ian Bailey was 40 or so at the time of the murder, died at 68. Lived 28 years under the shadow of guilt.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,061 ✭✭✭Genghis


    One thing I think about a bit is the sheer volume of information we (as observers from a distance both in time and space) have on Bailey.

    We are intensely familiar with his character, his oddities, his flaws. Compared to any other suspect we know a lot more about him, and we are used to associating him with the crime. Podcasts, documentaries, books and 27 years of media coverage, he has gained a notoriety few do. Much of this driven by him, no doubt.

    For example, I am sure like 99% of people I am very familiar with Ian, but would not know any of the placenames, or even the street names and shops in Schull.

    Can this familiarity with one suspect lead to bias either in his favour, or against him? Or from time to time even mean that you switch from one to the other?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,836 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    "Why the use of weapons (brick etc) as opposed to hands?"

    Did the killer lay hands on her at all I wonder? If someone of Bailey's build were to grapple with Sophie - a good foot shorter than him and slightly built - it wouldn't last long. I've often thought that Sophie may have been the initial attacker and the intruder either a slight male, maybe young or a female, then retaliated. Jim Sheridan, for his forthcoming film had some American pathologist look at the pathology reports and he reckoned Sophie may have been asphyxiated. How he could tell from reports I don't know, but I believe Sophie was stamped on around the chest and neck and had a broken thorax.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,452 ✭✭✭lee_baby_simms


    A biopic would have to take an OJ style approach of ‘If he did it..this is what he would have done.’

    Alfred Molina as Bailey.




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,899 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    Blood spots in the eyes indicate choking. Petechiae I think it's called.

    But her neck bone (can't remember what it's called) wasn't broken.

    So it looks like an attempt at choking.

    I think choking someone to death takes longer than one expects.

    It takes 10 to 20 seconds to choke someone unconcious, but it takes a few minutes, maybe 3 or 4, to choke someone to death.

    So maybe she was choked unconcious.

    There was folds in the front of her pyjamas with no blood drops but other blood drops were circular, so it looks like she was bent over. Maybe she was unconcious at this point.



  • Registered Users Posts: 196 ✭✭OrangeBadger


    Rural Cork in the 90s, I'm sure the guards weren't biased against 6'2 pompous English man....sure they loved his poetry



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,570 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    "Bailey was alleged to have blacked out and attacked his first wife"

    This is the problem with much of the 'evidence' against Bailey - it's either complete fiction or wildly misinterpreted. His ex wife was quite clear that Bailey never laid a finger on her - and she hates his guts! Yet this is the kind of nonsense that's spun.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,365 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    The thing is a person who is blackout drunk is more likely to leave DNA or something else behind. But they found nothing. In relation to other suspects, the Gardai fixated on him to the point there was no other suspects. That was a criticism by the dpp.

    Post edited by eightieschewbaccy on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,604 ✭✭✭Oscar_Madison


    It could absolutely lead to unconscious bias - certainly when the documentaries came out on Netflix etc it was pretty much a national pastime talking about them for many. The levels of engagement are very similar to any reality series on TV- so yeah, people will “take sides” , “defend” their adopted favourite “character” as well as “change sides” if new information comes to light etc etc - it’s actually quite macabre but I guess it’s what we humans have a propensity to do .

    If this case is ever “solved”, there’ll be a couple of days of frantic activity when people have their final say- then the thread will go dead- and similar to the end of the film, The Truman Show , people will go looking for their next reality fix



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,083 ✭✭✭tibruit


    Marie Farrell recanted her testimony in 2015 and she was laughed out of court and Bailey lost his case. The French were mostly right with how they dealt with Farrells nonsense. Her sightings of Bailey outside her shop on the Saturday and again on the Airhill Road the following morning is broadly corroborated by other witnesses. Bailey was seen across the street from Sophie that Saturday and he was on the Airhill Road early the following morning.

    Whether she was out and about and spotted Bailey at Kealfada on the night of the murder is another matter. I tend not to believe her. She still seems to be maintaining now that she saw the same man on all three occasions. But the fact is, Bailey was out and about on the same night in the dark and not much further away from Sophies laneway in the other direction. He acknowledges this himself. Says he went down to the studio in the dark and returned to the house at 11 am.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,314 ✭✭✭JVince


    ONE unsubstantiated media report based on hearsay by an unnamed person.

    The report was published once and over 20 years ago. No-one, not even a rag like the daily mail have ever brought it up in the past 20 years.

    I think you can safely assume it was bs.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,604 ✭✭✭Oscar_Madison


    This Nick Foster guy is some piece of work - such a trashy article masquerading ax “journalism” - yes I know it’s a red top but even they have standards- this reads like a child saying “nah nah, neh nah nah”




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,827 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Some context - it was alleged in one of his court cases.

    Was that the court case that Bailey won because the newspapers could present no evidence to support their allegations that Bailey had been violent to his first wife?

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭BagofWeed


    It's a doable walk, wouldn't even be 50 mins to do, 3.90 Km from the studio.



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