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Gript-A source of misinformation. **Read OP before posting**

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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,841 ✭✭✭TomTomTim


     it’s simply a fact that a few disenchanted liberals are unable to cope with the reality which they created. That doesn’t make them either right wing or conservative, or even libertarian, it just makes them a contrarian, begrudging crank

    The arrogance, even though it's expected, is still somehow shocking. So those on the left, who've held similar principals for years, are now "contrarian cranks" for daring to have an issue with how the left has evolved, or devolved, in the last ten years or so. As usual, it's not the problem of the "left", it's the problem of those who don't blindly follow their every command.

    “The man who lies to himself can be more easily offended than anyone else. You know it is sometimes very pleasant to take offense, isn't it? A man may know that nobody has insulted him, but that he has invented the insult for himself, has lied and exaggerated to make it picturesque, has caught at a word and made a mountain out of a molehill--he knows that himself, yet he will be the first to take offense, and will revel in his resentment till he feels great pleasure in it.”- ― Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov




  • Registered Users Posts: 23,753 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack



    Well they were always contrarian cranks, it’s just that nobody took much notice of them then either, because they were still on the left whereas those on the right and conservatives have no interest whatsoever in their nonsense. They’re still on the left when they claim an affinity with the working class, whereas in the normal course of events they wouldn’t look twice at them.

    McGuirk knows this, but I imagine he’s more interested in making money than politics, because he failed at that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,551 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    McGuirk wiped the floor with Alison O Connor on VM1

    I think he is invited on to try and discredit him but it backfires on them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,186 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    So it looks like Gript has made the Irish Refugee Council (IRC) take their lies off their website.

    Oh yes they lied by claiming that all these lovely lads with no passports had their fingerprints checked against criminal databases, sepcifically those of Interpol and Europol.

    When in reality as stated by Dept of Justice nothing of the like was happening.

    Oh and chief trough swiller Nick Henderson of the IRC also lied to the public when claiming

    "When somebody applies for asylum in Ireland, they would either do so at the airport or at the International Protection Office in Dublin,” he said.

    “There commences a very rigorous process which would begin with a person’s fingerprints being taken, and those fingerprints go on to a European Union-wide database called Eurodac.

    “That is for two reasons – one, to check if they’ve claimed asylum elsewhere and two, to check if they are on any criminal databases”.

    Eurodac is not and never has been a criminal database according to our Dept of Justice.

    It must be galling to all the ones in the mainstream media, the political party lackies and NGO trough snorters around here to see the voice of right wing Ireland catching out one of the insiders for lying to the public.

    I am not allowed discuss …



  • Registered Users Posts: 37 Senior




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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,637 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    Was a total attack on him, but he defended himself well

    he said himself on X that "Who knew that reporting factual stories about government spending on immigration was in fact dangerous dog-whistling"

    I swear to god... The conceitedness of those in power knows no bounds.

    You don't need to know what we're doing on where, and if someone tells you what we're doing, well they're clearly just trying to stir up sh!t and are right wing Nazis.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,841 ✭✭✭TomTomTim


    "Dog whistling" as an attack is as low as you get, as it essentially allows you to call anyone a racist, without actually having to prove your point. You can't expect anything else from these type though, as the truth doesn't matter, silencing and slandering your enemies is all that matters.

    “The man who lies to himself can be more easily offended than anyone else. You know it is sometimes very pleasant to take offense, isn't it? A man may know that nobody has insulted him, but that he has invented the insult for himself, has lied and exaggerated to make it picturesque, has caught at a word and made a mountain out of a molehill--he knows that himself, yet he will be the first to take offense, and will revel in his resentment till he feels great pleasure in it.”- ― Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov




  • Registered Users Posts: 7,685 ✭✭✭whippet


    McGurik and Co are trying to ride high on the wave of an opinion poll - but the reality is that they are trying to insinuate that everyone who is concerned about the gov's policy on immigration agrees with the opinion pieces of Gript and their views.

    You can be critical of the government's policy and record on immigration and also be critical of Gript's commentary on the subject. This poll does not validate Gript's blogs (they aren't a news outlet - just a group of bloggers in my opinion)



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc




  • Registered Users Posts: 7,685 ✭✭✭whippet


    there is nothing in there that says they need to be a news outlet

    Anyway - in their short history they have already fallen foul to press council rules and have been pulled up on it.

    So - yep - I stand over my opinion of them being just glorified bloggers



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  • Registered Users Posts: 23,753 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack



    I don’t agree that it allows the person using it to call anyone a racist, notwithstanding the obvious point that would be dog whistling in itself given as you say they don’t have to prove the point. It’s an apt description of Gript’s output:

    In politics, a dog whistle is the use of coded or suggestive language in political messaging to garner support from a particular group without provoking opposition. The concept is named after ultrasonic dog whistles, which are audible to dogs but not humans. Dog whistles use language that appears normal to the majority but communicates specific things to intended audiences. They are generally used to convey messages on issues likely to provoke controversy without attracting negative attention.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_whistle_(politics)

    Which would explain jmayo’s earlier declaration that Gript is “the voice of the right”.

    All I thought reading that was “if you say so” 🤨

    They’re not the voice of the right, but what would be the point in arguing it? FF and FG aren’t just the voice of the right, they’re the voice of Conservatives, and they’re the political parties in power, whereas McGuirk and Gript? Literally not even at the races, let alone the voice of anyone 😒



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    So what makes Gript different to something like The Journal (or the Gruaniad) when it comes to getting readers to contribute or subscribe? Why shouldn't there be a diverse set of opinions in the media?

    Regards...jmcc

    Post edited by jmcc on


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,685 ✭✭✭whippet


    absolutely there should be a diverse set of opinions everywhere in society - but with that comes the freedom to call out and be critical of those opinions. Gript supporters think that any criticism of them is some deep state conspiracy - when in fact it is just people expressing their right to express an opinion. The very fact that McGurik is a regular on the likes of TV3 shows that they are given the freedom to express their opinion - they just don't like when people don't agree with them



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    I think that you've got it backwards. Disagreeing with Gript confirms to them that they may be correct in what they are doing. The more that the Far Left and the Left disagree with Gript, the more attention it gives Gript. The criticism from the Far Left and Left actually helps Gript and gives it a profile it otherwise would not attain. McGuirk is a regular because he's good entertainment. He is well able to handle the unbalanced panels. Gript and those who write for it expect that people will disagree with them. And they do.

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,685 ✭✭✭whippet




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,841 ✭✭✭TomTomTim


    Nonsense. Many people want them to not exist at all, and that's the issue that many of us have.

    “The man who lies to himself can be more easily offended than anyone else. You know it is sometimes very pleasant to take offense, isn't it? A man may know that nobody has insulted him, but that he has invented the insult for himself, has lied and exaggerated to make it picturesque, has caught at a word and made a mountain out of a molehill--he knows that himself, yet he will be the first to take offense, and will revel in his resentment till he feels great pleasure in it.”- ― Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,841 ✭✭✭TomTomTim


    Stuff like this is "dog whistling" to some



    Even though it's completely valid, reasonable, and should be expected from every journalist. Can any of you supposed supporters of "journalism" honestly say that most Irish "journalists" would even dare ask such a question?

    “The man who lies to himself can be more easily offended than anyone else. You know it is sometimes very pleasant to take offense, isn't it? A man may know that nobody has insulted him, but that he has invented the insult for himself, has lied and exaggerated to make it picturesque, has caught at a word and made a mountain out of a molehill--he knows that himself, yet he will be the first to take offense, and will revel in his resentment till he feels great pleasure in it.”- ― Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,875 ✭✭✭Augme


    Have gript accused the fella found with a toy gun of going on a mass shooting rampage yet?



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,685 ✭✭✭whippet


    Just like many Gript 'readers' would want the government to disappear or the International Protection Applicants ... such is life.

    the fact remains that McGurik and Gript exist and have ample airtime ... and anyone has the right to be critical of their message



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,841 ✭✭✭TomTomTim


    Who is opposing your right? As is always the way, you pretend the other side have a position that they don't, and force them to argue against it.

    “The man who lies to himself can be more easily offended than anyone else. You know it is sometimes very pleasant to take offense, isn't it? A man may know that nobody has insulted him, but that he has invented the insult for himself, has lied and exaggerated to make it picturesque, has caught at a word and made a mountain out of a molehill--he knows that himself, yet he will be the first to take offense, and will revel in his resentment till he feels great pleasure in it.”- ― Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov




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  • Registered Users Posts: 23,753 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack



    I’m not sure why you’re asking me why shouldn’t there be a diverse set of opinions in the media when I’ve never said anything on that subject. There are plenty diverse sets of opinions in Irish media already, you’ve given examples - TheJournal, and the many, many tabloid publications. But as for what makes Gript different to TheJournal? Well apart from TheJournal monthly subscription being half the price of Gript, Gript hasn’t anything like the reach of TheJournal.

    At the risk of rooting their horn, but like I said, Gript isn’t even at the races, it’s not even a whisper. Dog whistle seems an even more appropriate description seeing as it’s inaudible to humans:

    https://www.thejournal.ie/reuters-institute-digital-news-report-ireland-6092059-Jun2023/



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc



    So government-approved "diverse" opinions are OK? The Journal is very much an Irish version of the Huffington Post model. It isn't really a news organisation as much as the anti-Gript catering to the ideologically opposite market to Gript. Gript's targeting is much more effective. It doesn't use AI algorithms though. Do you think that Gript should not exist?

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,753 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack



    I don’t care whether Gript does or doesn’t exist, it’s an inconsequential media presence in the grand landscape of Irish media, as demonstrated by the figures in the article in my previous post.

    I don’t imagine either that Government has any editorial control over TheJournal, perhaps you have some greater insight? TheJournal isn’t in any case an example of diverse opinions, though it does a fairly decent job of debunking Gript’s claims, when it can be bothered:


    https://www.thejournal.ie/gript/news/



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    For someone unconcerned about whether Gript exists or not, you are spending an awful lot of time criticising it.

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,753 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack



    Imagine how much time I might spend criticising Gript if I thought it had any relevance in the Irish media landscape! 😁



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    And it would have exactly the same effect on Gript. :)

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,753 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack



    I don’t think it would jm, it’s free advertising for them as it is. You’ve made the point yourself earlier that’s how their business model works -

    The criticism from the Far Left and Left actually helps Gript and gives it a profile it otherwise would not attain.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    Yep but the next challenge for Gript is to go "mainstream". It is on one of the lower rungs of that ladder. It is already starting with the media appearances and its Social Media game is way better, in terms of interaction, than some other publications. Never mind that stuff about "Far Right" and "disinformation". What Gript is doing is combined arms warfare while the mainstream media is still in the Stone Age.

    The mainstream media is still stuck in the typical "one to many" model of publishing. Gript is pursuing an almost "few to many" model that creates a feedback loop with its readership so that it can produce better targeted content. While the mainstream media bleats about "studies" on the "Far Right" and disinformation eco-systems, the danger is that they haven't much of a clue about how Gript and similar publications work in terms of targeting and effectiveness. (Read Chis Wylie's "Mindf*ck" book about the Cambridge Analytica scandal for a better insight.)

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,965 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko




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  • Registered Users Posts: 23,753 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack



     It is on one of the lower rungs of that ladder.


    I admire your optimism jm, but they’re not even ON the ladder. They peaked too soon IMO by believing in their own hype - much like GB News which still remains a non-entity in the UK media landscape. They introduced a subscription model before they’d even gained a foothold on the first rung of the ladder, and I don’t think their content, as attractive as it is to the people attracted by the algorithm, it’s considerably more difficult to convince those people to part with their hard-earned cash to have their opinions parroted back to them when there are a plethora of free platforms on which they can exercise their right to freedom of expression without having to pay for the privilege.



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