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Would you like to see the perpetrators of the recent arson attacks brought to justice?

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 174 ✭✭abozzz


    Again, the weak attempt to paint an explanation of current events as me being merely "friends with arsonists".

    Weak. Weak, all day.

    The reason, in case it slipped your attention, that I need to continually explain that I don't endorse arson in itself, is because there are many people who are simply looking for an excuse to condemn the effects of a problem, and would rather die than face the causative problem itself.

    Its not my fault there are such weak minded people looking to escape reality.

    But there are.


    Arson will continue as long as the underlying causes go "dodged". In much the same way as i dont "endorse" the sequential effects of gravity, it doesn't stop me from explaining gravity, or indeed that gravity needs me to exist.

    Gravity exists. The problem behind this situation exists.



  • Registered Users Posts: 893 ✭✭✭Emblematic


    While we need to reassess what we mean by "share of refugees", arson is not an acceptable form of protest.

    1. Yes, this is unacceptable and we need to take our share of refugees

    2. Yes, I support the protests but arson takes it too far

    3. No, I'd rather not see any arrests

    Rubbish poll linking a crime with a particular cause. Arson is unacceptable regardless of the cause.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,942 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    Why is there a poll asking if criminals burning down other people’s property should be brought to justice?

    Strange poll.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,098 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    Jeez.. That post I wrote last night didn't come out on the page the way I thought it did 🙈 apologies!

    What I meant was that while many in the community do NOT feel that the protestors represent their views it was well known that an arson attempt was being planned as you have said many were concerned.

    It was hoped that it would be restored to community use.. But sure it definitely won't be now will it?!

    @Furze99Very big difference between folks expressing a wish to curb immigration in a newspaper poll, and supporting arson, which is what you are implying in your posts?

    As a self expressed businessman yourself, how would you feel if some yoke took a fagary and burnt your property down just because they don't ' agree' with your use of it? Or the cut of your jib? Or your political persuasion?

    Thats the way these type of people would like society to be... for their use, their opinions, and law and other people's democratic rights be hanged, often literally.



  • Registered Users Posts: 82,486 ✭✭✭✭Overheal




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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,948 ✭✭✭Shoog


    As I have said before, I blame this current government for allowing this criminality to go unaddressed for half a decade on their watch. They will never be forgiven for allowing open acts of hate fueled criminality to take root and flourish. The sooner they are gone the better.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,092 ✭✭✭✭Furze99


    Eh.. I haven't supported arson. I understand some of the frustrations that might lead to it as I'm sure you do too. That's a very different matter.

    Wearing a business hat, I'm very aware that you're only as good as your last customer and that you treat your customers well. Now if only this government treated it's citizens like customers, we wouldn't have these problems, would we??

    And ultimately that is what we citizens are and we deliver our verdict in the ballot box rather than the checkout.



  • Registered Users Posts: 687 ✭✭✭Slightly Kwackers


    If you believe that to be the case and you do speak for the very silent it seems, majority, what have you done so far to address the situation?

    Sitting on the sidelines and prophesying doom and gloom is hardly much of an action.

    One Enoch Powell a well known racist bigot once made a famous speech that a lot of his ilk like to parrot.

    In fact if the racists google "rivers of blood" and get someone to read the rubbish to them it will prove very inspiring.

    So the instability never happened, Britain has even less space and 1968 was a long long time ago with populations and migrants expanding exponentially as humanity does.

    The brilliant thing about racism is it's a wonderful tool to manipulate the thinking challenged.

    I wonder why the people that don't seem to think democracy works don't try it some time?

    If you want to elect a full blown racist with the bedsheets and the pointy hat, I will applaud the free society that humours you. I would no more vote for someone riding on race issues than a MAGA cast off. They would have a very polarised aim and it would be nothing to do with race once the muppets were hooked.



  • Registered Users Posts: 277 ✭✭freebritney


    That is the "far right", in all it's glory. It's a joke, a bunch of lads with posters and a sprinkling of criminals. 62% of the population answered a binary question on same sex marriage and it was heralded as the whole country supporting it. If 66% of the population are unhappy with the effects of a law or convention then it's obviously unhappy with the law or convention. Your at it again trying to equate the vast majority of the people believing that there is currently too much immigration with extremist views like Irexit. Shame on you.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭Augme


    Jesus, so now polls that ask less than 1% of the population are now binding for the whole population. So much for democracy. Shame on you.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 174 ✭✭abozzz


    Historical precedent.


    It would be a long journey to find an Irish person who would call acts of arson against the English regime during famine as "unacceptable".

    And it will be the same for this situation in time.

    Do I like it or endorse it? No.

    But it's readily understood. Which is what is severely lacking in solving this situation, understanding and acceptance of the problem.



  • Registered Users Posts: 82,486 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    These are acts of arson against your own country though, not unelected plantation rulers.



  • Registered Users Posts: 277 ✭✭freebritney


    Who do you suggest secure the properties if you don't want the Gardai involved? The army, FBI, state militia, postmen?



  • Registered Users Posts: 174 ✭✭abozzz


    I point out that gravity exists as analogy to the problem of mass migration and its pushback in political vacuum resulting in the likes of arson

    You say that gravity existing is a weak argument.

    You couldn't make it up. It's easy to see how we've arrived at this point anyway!



  • Registered Users Posts: 82,486 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Secure it yourself, with security cameras, catch the perps in the act, arrest them, make an example of them, repeat as necessary.

    Won't be shocked to learn an arsonist is an off duty officer.



  • Registered Users Posts: 687 ✭✭✭Slightly Kwackers


    You may not have noticed but the migrants are being targeted because of race. Maybe you think it's the make of mobile phone.

    People that are easily stirred up by hate are more prone to bigotry, it links to intelligence.

    Powell the KKK and the arsonists have a common theme supported by the lesser able, violence and racism.



  • Registered Users Posts: 277 ✭✭freebritney


    Would you expect a different result if the question was on a ballot? It's amazing how poll results have no consequence when they give a result you don't agree with.



  • Registered Users Posts: 82,486 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    it's a boards poll, hardly a concrete polling methodology here, anyone could stack the poll with sockpuppet accounts etc.; it's not exactly a YouGov poll.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,560 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    That study isn't a justification for arson in the 21st century, there was a period in time where a duel was used to handle personal disputes. Doesn't mean it's still necessary to duel. There's a historical precedent for many things, you're just using it to justify something that is inherently dangerous. The people who are setting these fires are well aware that there's a risk to human life, so thankfully most are fine with jailing such people.



  • Registered Users Posts: 277 ✭✭freebritney


    So the Gardai are lighting the fires now? Who's going to arrest the Gardai if the Gardai are the ones lighting the fires? The postmen? I'm glad your on the case, there is clearly an insurection a foot.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 82,486 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    It's like arguing beheading women is an effective tactic for public change because it's doing wonders for the Taliban.



  • Registered Users Posts: 174 ✭✭abozzz


    Mass migration is, to the surprise of nobody, directly linked to capacity crises at play right now.

    The fact that the government has allowed this situation to spiral for years upon years is the actual action against the well being of Ireland. Simple as that.

    Now, you'll be so kind as to point out all the electoral and democratic means by which the Irish people could have had a say in mass migration before it got to this crisis point.

    Except you won't, because it hasn't existed.

    And into that political vacuum arrives violence at last. You could have set your watch to it in terms of predictability.

    But by all means continue to cry about the effects of actions, and continue to ignore why it exists in the first place. Its much easier, I know. Utterly ineffective, but easier.



  • Registered Users Posts: 82,486 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Setting fire to your fellow countrymen's personally run and operated property to spite the state, doesn't really accomplish anything.

    Now, you'll be so kind as to point out all the electoral and democratic means by which the Irish people could have had a say in mass migration before it got to this crisis point.

    Participate in your government, run for office, campaign for your politicians, get politically active.

    As someone justifying arson you don't seem the type to have played the long game, that is actually participating in your democratic processes throughout your whole life, not just flipping out finally when things didn't go the way you thought it would while you weren't participating or playing an active role. Maybe you did, but elections have consequences.



  • Registered Users Posts: 174 ✭✭abozzz


    As I said to the other poster, point out where the political choice has been for irish people on the topic of mass migration.

    Never mind 6 years ago, or 2 years ago, what about today?

    And that void of choice, versus the results of multiple capacity crises, precisely, is the origin of this violence.

    So it is in many ways very relatable to the precedents of the past. Extremely so.



  • Registered Users Posts: 82,486 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    "Never mind 6 years ago, or 2 years ago, what about today?"

    Sounds like you know the answer to your question but don't like the answer is 'you're too late, should have been participating the whole time'

    And some things are just out of our control, like Putin deciding Ukraine was his to take.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,948 ✭✭✭Shoog


    It is very little to do with your invented capacity crisis. The crisis in housing is directly caused by this and previous government failure to plan and building housing. Immigration is a side issue to this failure of governance - but it's the only part you want to consider.

    Your transparent.



  • Registered Users Posts: 687 ✭✭✭Slightly Kwackers


    Although coming here often it was for short periods, so some things changed without me really noticing.

    I recall in my early years going to mass in the pony and trap and being aware and accepting the power of the church and it's rigid approach to moral life in the country.

    Like most brought up as catholics it was not questioned by me, it just was.

    Some of the changes I still find a little odd and I wouldn't say I feel totally comfortable with, but what overshadows that is the way Ireland fast tracked to tolerance and understanding in so many areas, it seems almost like a step change occurred when I blinked some years ago.

    I think it's wonderful how the country could change so rapidly and open up to ideas that would have been taboo in my earlier years.

    Such a shame that there are people who want to use violence to throw the country back into intolerance.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,841 ✭✭✭TomTomTim


    I know, "anti racists" are our intellectual elite, the smartest people in every room. How would we not know? Sure ye tell us all the time.

    Where's the racial focus anyway? I've honestly not seen it, most of them seem to treat Ukrainians just as they do Africans, so I'm struggling woth where race comes into it.

    “The man who lies to himself can be more easily offended than anyone else. You know it is sometimes very pleasant to take offense, isn't it? A man may know that nobody has insulted him, but that he has invented the insult for himself, has lied and exaggerated to make it picturesque, has caught at a word and made a mountain out of a molehill--he knows that himself, yet he will be the first to take offense, and will revel in his resentment till he feels great pleasure in it.”- ― Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov




  • Registered Users Posts: 174 ✭✭abozzz


    It's hardly the brainstorm of the century to try and paint the loss of a building/s to some negative impact on irish people when...

    1) the buildings where only ever intended for migrant use.

    2) the continued precedent of converting more buildings ad infinitum for the sole purpose of migrants could only ever encourage the trend.


    Silly, silly argument. It was never going to be a benefit to irish people at best, and at worst it was maintaining the net negative effect of even less potential accommodation going forward.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 23,533 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    Along with your nonsense of justifying arson as inevitable your complaint over capacity crisis is equally hilarious.

    It does match the thinking of the moronic arsonists in that burning down accomodation will help with the accomodation crisis.

    Really are the dullards of the dregs tbf.



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