The new recycling system

Yes, no dividends. But I am saying there are other incentives / disincentives

But they will have a plan, targets, etc and they will either end up with surpluses or deficits. Liabilities would be shared by members, surpluses would presumably reduce producer fees. So not without impact.

How well re-turn do could well determine everything from the scale of the staff Christmas party to how much they are allowed spend on marketing, to their influence on levies, to career opportunities beyond re-turn.

I will say this: they seem pretty paranoid about / focussed on deposit revenue, with their over-speccing, making sure deposits are collected even if they won't honour their return, and their complete avoidance of any investment capital or risk in setting up the scheme. I think there is some incentive / disincentive associated with their financial performance.

@elperello I agree with everything there.

What could be an impact of a poor launch is a slower trajectory, i.e. it may look like the targets may not be met in time. Say it's 2026 and we are tracking to 85% not 90% by 2029. This slower take up is resulting in 100m deposits retained by re-take p.a. or €20m "plan surplus".

What recourse then? Double deposits (make consumers pay more) and use the €20m banked revenue from slower take up on marketing this as 'good for us all'. Lower producer fees and / or increase retailer collection fees because of the higher deposit revenue re-take can't retain.

That would be one way a poor performance by re-turn could be overcome without any real world cost to re-turn, and have them achieve target. Good for producers (lower fees), good for retail (more fees), bad for consumers (but screw them, they should've played ball).

There should be an incentive to avoid this sort of scenario (maybe there is).

I have bought items.s with no r on them

I have been charged the deposit

The barcode checker is saying the items are invalid

This means that the cans will not work in the rvm

Am.i sussposed to bring the cand tk tbe shop I bought them.in to demand a refund?

It's all a bit confrontational

I'd assume that the database for the rvm is amthe same database for the machines

Which machines have the reject slots? None of the machines I've come across have one. They all just have the one hole where you stick it in and hope for the best.

i was walking to a local shop yesterday and noticed quite alot of cans every so often along the way (all damaged unfortunately) . And could'nt help but wonder to myself: "how does this new recycling scheme make the environment cleaner if no one is going to pick up the discarded cans/bottlers that are damaged?" and when i come to think of it, we're literally just hoping that the people who throw cans out of window, we're just blindly hoping they don't crush the cans before discarding, or even damaging the cans in the process of throwing it out the window.

The thing the CEO was saying about "someone else can pick them up and redeem them" really only applies if we are lucky enough for the can to be undamged, and if it lands on the grass.

The chances of cans being undamaged from people that discard them i feel are very little, and alot of people get into the habbit of squeezing the cans for some reason before throwing it aside.

Return are being really fussy with not accepting damaged cans.

how do you feel about all this? and do you feel re-turn should be willing to accept damaged cans as long as the logo is visible? if the answer is yes then i can imagine how the streets would actually be cleaner.

I was in a SuperValu yesterday, bank holiday Monday.

I checked the fridges selling 'on the gob' drinks and could see only one product (lucozade drink) with a deposit label. There were a few shelves empty or close to empty, so it looks to me like retailers are running down lines to zero before restocking line by line with new (as opposed to dual sticking).

I also noticed their RVM, located in the car park, was shuttered closed for some reason (no notice up as to why).

This is one of the issues I've said for a long time - whatever about the DRS - there simply aren't enough public recycle bins in this country - they would be used if they were. Accompany them with an education campaign and enforcement of litter laws and you've a greatly enhanced system that hasn't cost millions or annoyed those that recycle already.

Yip. Not only are people who pay a flat monthly fee for their blue / green getting robbed but they have to jump through hoops to minimize their losses. Completely backward and insulting scheme. All stick no carrot.

People can shout about the environment all they want. Its a kick in the teeth and now on top of all that the roll out is a confusing mess. Pathetic really.

I also noticed my local Lidl has a notice up saying take rejected items away with you - they do have a recycle bin passed the tills but you can’t access that without going shopping and checking out.

to clarify they have no recycle bin beside the RVM.

Chances are zero that clean segregated material will end up in landfill.

It has a commercial value and will be sold to part fund the Return scheme.

https://www.rte.ie/radio/radio1/clips/22322238/

They have no way to process the waste at that scale, particularly the plastic.

It will end up exported, burnt and landfilled just like what is happening now.

It costs more to recycle plastic than create new plastic.

Simple economics.

Presumably the public will just leave rejected containers there anyway. This is Lidl's baby too, they have their eyes on increasing their turnover, let them sort out any resulting mess with the quango. Maybe Mr.Foley himself will go around in the company car and pick it all up.