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Immigration to Ireland - policies, challenges, and solutions *Read OP before posting*

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  • Registered Users Posts: 172 ✭✭Honesty Policy


    14 years ago, I could have bought my deceased Granny's house in a south Dublin surburb at age 24 for 265k on a single teacher's income. My one big regret in my life is that I didn't buy that house. Not a hope I could buy that house today...500k+ now. +renovations cost at today's prices. Has my salary doubled? Not a chance.

    What has changed in that 14 years??? Seriously, too much and too fast.

    I'm not against helping genuine refugees nor beneficial immigration but I am against it on a mass, uncontrolled scale. We are seeing the impact of this now, 15-20 years later. The crunch has been here the last 5 years. Whether you want to admit that or not, is your choice but it's completely unsustainable. What a mess.



  • Registered Users Posts: 480 ✭✭getoutadodge




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,764 ✭✭✭ArthurDayne


    I just don't understand though how you are drawing these dots together. The housing crisis is a straight up consequence of poor supply planning for our both population growth and urbanisation. It also has a fair bit to do with Ireland's economic culture moving towards property ownership as an investment. The Irish government actively encouraged and facilitated the operation of vulture funds in the State, and indeed cuckoo funds that have driven up prices and frozen out first time buyers. Did refugees and migrants cause that?

    The government effectively stopped building social housing during the boom. Did refugees and migrants cause that?

    10,000 housing units were built in 2014 versus the 90,000 built in 2006. Did refugees and migrants cause that? Did they cause the collapse of house building during the recession? Did they cause Covid and the cessation of home building at that time? Are they responsible for the outbreak of the Ukraine war and the dramatic increase of costs that followed? Are they responsible for inflation and interest rates?

    No. But instead of pointing to the actual policy decisions and prevailing economic conditions that have led us here, you are simply playing the game of saying that somehow the lack of supply is caused by the demand — and specifically demand driven by migration? Pull the other one.



  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭redunited




  • Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,795 ✭✭✭Backstreet Moyes


    In regards building houses we had people with the skills to build them in the past.

    Now we train up a lot of tradesmen and they head off to Australia to build houses.

    We have an aging workforce for the building game and are exporting the people who should be taking over.

    We simply do not have the workforce to catch up with the current demand, never mind the 15,000 a year we will be supporting going forward as things stand.



  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭redunited


    Seems it still cant cope, so I doubt the health service benefits from mass uncontrolled immigration.



  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭redunited


    Importing a larger population inevitably strains resources and drives the perpetual need for more housing. It's akin to a pyramid scheme with an inevitable end. As demand increases, we see a domino effect - from resource shortages to inflated housing prices and urban sprawl. This cycle not only burdens infrastructure and the environment but also perpetuates a reliance on unsustainable growth. Without careful planning and consideration, the consequences are dire, leading to economic strain, environmental degradation, and social tensions."



  • Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    50% of our health service workers are immigrants.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,795 ✭✭✭Backstreet Moyes


    I am not old enough to know what hospitals were like before immigrants were such a high percentage of healthcare staff.

    Was it staffed with irish people and was it in such a crisis as it is today?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭redunited


    As our population expands, the healthcare sector requires more manpower, leading to a search for cost-effective labour, often sourced from immigrants. However, this reliance on cheaper immigrant labour raises ethical concerns. It's troubling that our citizens seek work abroad while we simultaneously recruit healthcare workers from underprivileged countries where their skills are desperately needed.



  • Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Indeed. Its much more complex than "mass immigration needs to stop" - glad people are starting to acknowledge that.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭redunited


    In the past, with a smaller population, our healthcare system managed to meet the needs of the people adequately. While there were occasional fluctuations due to workforce movements, appointments and services were generally accessible. While not necessarily world-class, the system functioned effectively.

    However, the current situation is starkly different. With a growing population, the demands on our healthcare system have surged. Instead of addressing these demands with sustainable solutions, we're resorting to hiring low-wage workers to cope. This approach has turned our healthcare system into a fragile house of cards, teetering on the brink of failure.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,168 ✭✭✭Red Silurian




  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭redunited


    Reducing immigration to a manageable flow will not only alleviate the strain on our healthcare system but also on all our social structures.



  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭redunited


    In times of desperation, individuals may resort to drastic measures, but mere name-calling or ignoring the issue does little to resolve underlying concerns. What our country truly requires is a critical question, perhaps posed through a national referendum. This question must delve into the heart of the matter: Is Ireland at its capacity, and what is the optimal number of immigrants required for our nation's needs?



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,040 ✭✭✭✭zell12


    Varadkar coming up on NT discussing why most voters think that the country is going in wrong direction



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,168 ✭✭✭Red Silurian


    Ireland is at capacity so the solution is burning down buildings that could be used to house refugees? Strange logic



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,777 ✭✭✭Sunny Disposition


    Immigration since the Nice Treaty has been way higher than anything in living memory, massively higher.

    Anyone who says that hasn't been the major factor in causing the housing crisis is lying. It's inconvenient, and it may seem quite rude to mention it, but unfortunately it is the truth.

    There's also the fact that immigration to Ireland is entirely unpredictable, which makes planning impossible. In 2000 no one knew so many people would have immigrated here by 2006. In 2006 no one knew that would go in the other direction for seven years. In 2013 no one knew there would be huge inward migration once more.

    Ireland is always going to have a massive issue with immigration unless policy changes.



  • Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    But you just said it yourself we live in a global system. If we reduce immigration, that doesn't necessarily impact emigration - so the 'solution" to reduce immigration would create even more pressure on our health services to staff them. It sounds like an easy solution but it's not.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Why but? Why dismiss the actions of 23 acts of arson to be ignored?

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭redunited


    The fear and apprehension surrounding uncontrolled immigration are valid concerns that stem from a perception of inadequate management of the situation. When individuals feel that their communities are being overwhelmed by an influx of immigrants without proper oversight or planning, desperation can lead to extreme actions such as destroying buildings to prevent further immigration into their areas. This response, while not condoned, underscores the deep-seated anxiety and frustration resulting from the mishandling of the immigration issue.



  • Registered Users Posts: 41,065 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭redunited


    Addressing one aspect does not preclude addressing the other; therefore, we must aim to reduce immigration to manageable levels while also implementing measures to retain our own healthcare professionals.



  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭redunited


    While no one supports such actions, what recourse do individuals have when their voices go unheard? When elected officials persist in disregarding the legitimate concerns of those they are elected to represent? These are often the catalyst for civil unrest, revolutions, and various forms of social decay.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,168 ✭✭✭Red Silurian


    This idea of torching buildings that fellow humans need to use for accommodation or possibly already have people in is not an act of fear, it's an act of intimidation and cowardice.

    Defending them suggests you might be one of them



  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭redunited


    You appear to overlook our history, where groups of individuals have resorted to drastic measures, such as taking over the GPO, to assert their political beliefs. This phenomenon is not unique to our country; it occurs globally when people feel marginalized and voiceless. While one may choose to deny it, the reality of such actions is a consistent feature in both our own and world history.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,910 ✭✭✭enricoh


    Tax take increased by 5% in the last year, while spending increased by 17%

    Our corporation tax advantage disappeared last month and Ireland's competitiveness slipping. Where are the billions coming from for the refugee industry from now on?

    Total gross voted expenditure in January was 17 per cent higher than the same month last year.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,614 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    These people are not attacking the forces of the state, but places of accommodation for defenceless and vulnerable people. There is nothing 'noble' about hating on refugees and asylum seekers.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,910 ✭✭✭enricoh


    Is there anything noble about turning Irish towns into versions of Swedish ones? Or is paddy getting all the nice refugees?



This discussion has been closed.
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