Immigration to Ireland - policies, challenges, and solutions *Read OP before posting*

It should be given out very sparingly.

The government are more than happy to show they're refusal rates for asylum/subsidiary protection as proof that they're just not letting anyone in.

And then grant leave to remain status at such a high rate that practically all get to remain anyway.

And even the people that don't get this can continue to live here illegally until an amnesty comes along.

The government are benefiting from a complaint media that don't challenge them enough.

As seen by Denmark they're plenty of things that can be done to make a country less attractive to asylum seekers, rather than just putting your hands up an saying "we've international obligations" ad nauseum.

"I'm sure there are legitimate and illegitimate reasons for claiming asylum without documentation"

This is where we completely disagree, there's many arrivals coming here deliberately destroying their documentation on arrival from safe countries and your "I'm sure" it's a valid reason!! Its more the reason for our authorities unable to deport these guys because they destroyed their passport. This is most infuriating thing is bogus asylum claims and absolute joke of system where we're sending out a message for others to arrive doing the same thing!

Imagine for example, John from Morocco(safe-country) or Georgia(safe -country) got a plane to Paris, already in a safe traveling to France another safe country then proceeds to get a Ryanair plane to Dublin.

Oops my passports fell into the toilet crazy that, Mmmm could I calm asylum please?. It's pre-planned bogus asylum claims.

What you haven't shown is where that becomes a security issue?

So you're completely fine with arrivals presenting absolutely no information about themselves. The majority of these people I'd guess imo are fine but a huge drain on our taxes costing us billions but as in security but not everyone, again why destroy your passport you used to board the plane if you're coming into the country of refugee.

Where IP arrivals somehow need a level of 'background check' or 'vetting' that people arriving with visas don't receive.

People with visas have passports/ documentation, jobs/college place, their own accommodation and financial support!

"IP" or "Asylum seekers" arrivals are deliberately destroying their passports/ documentation coming from safe countries. The Dept of Justice even acknowledge this

"I can see no other explanation for these calls for 'vetting' other than it's extremely ill-informed or intended as scaremongering. But feel free to offer a better explanation if you can."

Unbelievable arrogance "extremely ill-informed or intended as scaremongering" - I never again said in my previous few comments about vetting but more we need some information with anyone coming into our community either with any sort of screening systems available from EMEA partners why again are these people destroying their passports? All or the majority of those arriving are watching how to guides(which are online, take a look if you like) on TicTok, YT, X on how to scam into Ireland, destroying their passports or ID upon arrival is 1 of these steps...

Immigration is needed but controlled and a complete over-halt over the current system, last month we've the most asylum seekers arriving here in around 20 years because of our poor controls via the boarder. Denmark, Belgium and other EU countries have closed up shop and have a complete cope-on process & procedures with deporting people back to the safe countries they're arriving from.

Extreme ill informed or intended scaremongering, made me laugh.

"Nineteen airlines flying into Ireland have been contacted by the Department of Justice about allowing international protection applicants on to aircraft without proper documentation" https://www.irishtimes.com/transport/2023/02/03/airlines-told-to-do-more-to-stop-people-arriving-without-documentation/

"Figures released by the Department to Newstalk on Friday show there were more than 5,000 applicants for international protection between January and November last year who entered the State with either false or no documentation."

5000 applicants for IP arrived with false or no documentation within 11 months, but am sure your answer in your previous reply "I'm sure there are legitimate and illegitimate reasons for claiming asylum without documentation" , sure!!

Yes I know people are making bogus asylum claims, that's what I meant by 'illegitimate reasons for claiming asylum without documentation'.

I thought that was clear, but apologies if it wasn't.

What you haven't shown, again, is where somebody arriving as an IP, with or without documentation, is more of a risk that somebody with a visa?

As far as I can see, if I wanted to arrive in Ireland as a criminal or a terrorist, it would actually be easier to do so with a visa or work-permit, than by seeking asylum.

If you want to make an argument about the economic impact of IP, that's one thing, but where you're trying to conflate that with the need for 'vetting' and 'background checks', is where it looks very much to me that you just want to engage in scaremongering.

Yes they arrive with documentation.

But that documentation doesn't mean they are 'vetted' or have 'background checks' performed.

Arrive as IP and your biometric data is taken, will be recorded, and can be checked to prevent serious crime and terrorism. You'll also be subject to quite rigorous recorded interviews, checking for any inconsistencies or falsehoods in your life story.

Like I said, make your argument about bogus asylum cases if you like, but turning that into a security issue is nonsense.

And increasing the population artificially is going to do what???

Make it worse

Proof of this of course?

No one has done that.

1.5 million Irish born live overseas. Approx 1 million foreign born live in Ireland. There has been no artificial increase in population

What people from the UK and EU don't have documents like passport and or any ID, they do!!!

If they posed any kind of security threat I'd imagine we've be informed by Interpol or any security service like police MI6 etc...

People arriving without documents or any source of ID, they are maliciously destroying their own documents and claiming bogus asylum.

If they posed any kind of security threat, we have no information on whom they really are or where they're really from. Again as I pointed out nearly the majority of IP seekers imo are fine but are using bogus claims without any sort of ID or fake ID's to gain access here.

How is this scaremongering? it's what is actually happening here! Trying to compare apples and pears here saying that anyone from the EU have no documentation like a passport traveling around clutching at straws here.

Am open to help and do our part helping real refugee and or asylum seekers with proper controls like Belgium and Denmark have start doing the past while or so.

Do you think Belgium, Denmark and other EU countries that are enforcing their boarder asking people for ID and deporting those who don't have ID as scaremongers too?

But if we reduce capacity don't we reduce said capacity faster than if the building didn't burn down?

If memory serves at least one of these buildings was meant for our homeless so refugees and asylum seekers, to use the proper terms, are unaffected by it

Probably explained by the large number children, particularly the one's fleeing Ukraine, still in school

I posted about this in December, but for reference see pg 51 of this document;

Most EU member states cross check IPA data against VIS and SIS databases, Ireland does not, for immigration purposes. We opted out. We run checks only after a crime has been committed.

So other countries are running background checks but some here would have you believe we can’t, because ‘racist’. We can, but we don’t.

Well aware those checks won’t flag someone whose criminality/missing person alert is not recorded on an existing database, and are useless if false information is supplied with no documentation for verification - but it’s an obvious and basic first step for security.

We’ve most definitely been gaslit about ‘rigorous process’. I believe it’s linked in peoples’ minds to the lengthy process of application - a drawn out, poorly administrated process does not equal ‘rigorous’.

"In the year prior to April 2016, 82,346 persons arrived to live in Ireland, of which 72,419 were aged 15 or over. Just over 34 per cent (24,768) of this group were Irish nationals and 47,651 were non-Irish nationals. Among the Irish group the labour force participation rate was 76.8 per cent while among non-Irish it was almost 10 percentage points lower at 67.4 per cent."

Queue the next point in the pro no-caps-immigration crowd to say that Irish employers are racist and as a society we have a racist outlook.

Thanks but the Vis and sis databases don't equate to a 'vetting' system.

They won't give a picture of someone's background from when they lived outside the EU, apart from the most serious cases which would be with Interpol.

Does Ireland have an alternative system for checking Ipa's with Interpol?

Further it seems that the same process applies regardless of Ipa's arriving with or without a passport?

After that it still doesn't seem to me that there's a greater security risk based on applying as an IPA or with a visa, given that visa applicants don't face an interview process.

Do you think we're doing a good job of meeting the housing needs of people born in Ireland otherwise?

You are parroting the government line which has been taken apart many times.

The fingerprints are taken, but journalists have found that no actual checks are carried out - in fact no requests to check against EU databases were made AT ALL in a recent year.

But the bigger point is these checks will not tell us if these people are criminals in their home countries of Algeria, Somalia etc. These are countries with barely functioning electricity grids, never mind robust crime databases that we can easily cross reference. This is government misinformation so please don't come out with this line again.