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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,945 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    Forgetting about their politics for a min., I just don't think it is in Ukraine's interest to try to run elections while the war continues. It would be some shít show, that is guaranteed.

    I suppose if this war carries on for a few more years (I hope not) they may eventually be forced to hold elections while at war/under invasion. At the moment they are probably better served (imo) putting them off, regardless of who in the country that favours/does not favour politically.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,850 ✭✭✭aidanodr


    You are correct in all of what you say @macraignil .. Re the 300k each, I am glad I am wrong, it was a question of sorts as on various media you hear different numbers. The general sad thing is too many are dying. No, I am not deliberately trying to inflate losses and some how sneakily side with Putin by spreading disinfo.

    I am fully on side of Ukraine. I am totally pee'd off that they are being held up by Trump and GOP fcking around re stopping this large support package which has huge implications for Ukraine let alone Europe and the world. I am also concerned that Ukraine will not be able to get more / enough troops.

    And also post Navalny death and Putins fake election I think we are entering a new phase and feel with all this carry on in USA/Trump + Europe maybe not being as urgent as they should perhaps be ( this on CNN earlier. A correspondent from Kiev, he said the general feeling from the Munich Security Conference is not as urgent as one might have expected.

    I still cannot get what is holding up supply of F16s to Ukraine to start evening up the score and longer range weapons so Ukraine can target deeper into Russia .. they should be allowed.

    Lets say this weekend for some reason .. looking forward I am very concerned for us all, listening to media over the weekend. I think this is going to get far worse before it gets better. Add Trump into the mix Jan 2025 :(



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,789 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    For the F16 it's training and support systems, we'll likely hear of their first usage after strikes have been made.



  • Registered Users Posts: 799 ✭✭✭jams100


    Hold elections where? What about the annexed regions? What about the regions where bombs are still going off? Where is the line drawn for an election? (Not saying it shouldn't happen but I think my priority would be on getting more materials when people are dying on front line everyday).



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,265 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde


    Ukraine should retreat, give up, and then test Nato's word, that they won't allow Russia to win. Ukraine can't win this alone, Nata as a whole needs to help



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,850 ✭✭✭aidanodr


    In the previous page here I said - I am totally pee'd off that they are being held up by Trump and GOP fcking around re stopping this large support package which has huge implications for Ukraine let alone Europe and the world.

    I cannot believe that .. even though he is not in office he alone is shaping the way this war against Ukraine is going. I have no doubt he alone now runs the GOP / Republican party .. what he says goes. He alone is stopping this US aid going to Ukraine. And then we have Trumps crazy invite to attack nato. This guy gets it and puts it exactly as I saw it:




  • Registered Users Posts: 233 ✭✭IdHidden


    The Guardian reports more injured Ukrainian POWs executed by the Russian.

    The shootings by Russian forces of six unarmed Ukrainian soldiers in the city of Avdiivka, and two at a village in the same region, after Russia claimed full control of the city.

    The videos on Telegram are gruesome. This type of savagery has to be counter productive, as it surely would make the Ukrainians fight harder.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,850 ✭✭✭aidanodr


    This is an absolute say it as it is from Gabrielius Landsbergis - Minister of Foreign Affairs, Member of Parliament of Lithuania

    Again like my last post - he puts into words how I feel also:

    https://twitter.com/GLandsbergis/status/1759271051177943311

    UNROLLED:

    During the Munich conference I was asked why I am so gloomy. Well, somebody has to tell it like it is, so here’s how it is: Things are not going well. 

    It is good practice to evaluate things honestly - with all their gloominess. And if we don't shock ourselves back into action it will get worse. In Ukraine, in the rest of Europe and possibly globally.

    Ukraine is starved of ammunition and forced to pull back, Europe is facing challenges which might test Article 5, and global instability emerges because autocrats are emboldened by Russia's action and our cautious response. This is not pessimism. This is fact. 

    Baseless optimism is a form of self-deception, it is demobilising us. How can we expect to convince the public to spend more on defence, take a stronger stance against Russia and support countries on the eastern flank if leaders won’t admit there is an urgent need? 

    And we need action right now, because tomorrow might be too late. We need a push, a jolt, a shock to wake us up. The war is not over, it's far from won, the enemy is very much alive and our European future is at stake. 

    I have no doubt that the West has the capacity to help Ukraine win this war. That is a fact. It is also clear that Russia’s industrial power is no match for the united West. But ... 

    We don't lack capacity, we lack the political will and urgency necessary to support Ukraine and maintain our collective security. Russia, on the other hand, has the will to destroy Ukraine and reestablish the Russian Empire. When will we start using our capacity to deter this? 

    Currently we are an open book to our adversary - clear red lines of non-engagement, disagreements over continuation of assistance and an optimistic blindness to increasing risks. We show no urgency in ramping up our readiness. 

    Strategically the goal should be to change Putin's calculations. Disrupt the field. I know it’s not easy, but it is better to admit mistakes and chart a new path forward, rather than to engage in empty self-congratulation.

    So yes, I am returning from Munich a bit gloomy. 



  • Registered Users Posts: 233 ✭✭IdHidden


    More than 100 Kremlin documents obtained by a European intelligence service and reviewed by The Washington Post, show that Russia ran a disinformation campaign to undermine the Ukrainian president Volodymyr Zelenskiy. The US publication said Kremlin instructions had “resulted in thousands of social media posts and hundreds of fabricated articles” that “tried to exploit what were then rumoured tensions” between Zelenskiy and his top army commander, Valerii Zaluzhnyi.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,850 ✭✭✭aidanodr




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,191 ✭✭✭rogber


    You're dodging the question because you've been caught out. Ukraine is a society moving towards debate and free speech. Klitschko is allowed his opinion, others may agree or not. You seem to fear this trend. I wonder why?

    I've also posted literally dozens of pro Navalny posts here, including since he died, while others in this thread shamefully couldn't find one good word to say about him. I think he's a resistance hero, even if he said some dumb things long ago.




  • Registered Users Posts: 8,208 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    Campaign to disable oil is continuing..




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,489 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,145 ✭✭✭deadduck


    Fingers crossed that sort of news isn’t too far away, even if it should have been sooner. Ukraine need every assistance the EU (and US/NATO) can muster. But particularly the EU, it needs to prove itself a military force as well as an economic one, especially so in the light of Trump’s recent commentary



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,689 ✭✭✭flutered


    it seems his face and chest are badly bruised, the prison people said this is common in heart attack victims



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,574 ✭✭✭jmreire


    Not quite, it was Ukraine's west looking that started the whole thing off.. while Putins puppet was in charge, no problem, but the 2014 Maidan protests changed all of that and eventually led to Putin's invasion of Ukraine.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,689 ✭✭✭flutered


    but biden can overide congress, like he done as regards isreal, send them the munitions which are awaiting disposal



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,883 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    Biden can bypass Congress if the US is selling arms to Ukraine. Munitions awaiting disposal may not be covered, likewise selling them for 99c each.

    Why they allowed the lend lease act to lapse without even being used once is baffling. I assumed that was the fallback plan if Congress didn't approve new funding. It still gave Ukraine munitions, but they would need to return or pay for them eventually (could be written off at a later date). Key point being Ukraine wouldn't be left short.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Europe has given up on defending itself or even bothering to try.


    European NATO state spending is a disgrace, it's not just Trump pointing out that, Zelensky must be driven half mad by the lack of effort and especially the lack of will.


    NATO at this stage is just America and the rest using American funds to mask their own disinterest in European security.


    Denmark has given far more military aid to Ukraine than France, Italy and Spain combined.


    France has one of the best armies in the world, Denmark is a country with a population similar to the state here.


    Russia want to eke out a kinda victory in Ukraine and Western Europe doesn't want to stop them enough.


    Even the slightest effort by European States would change that, that isn't going to happen at this stage though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    That's not going to happen, Trump can't force Europeans to take their own security seriously.


    If he pushes it, threatens to leave NATO, withdraw US troops from Europe, Western Europe will just continue as is and not bother with security. There is nothing that will change that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,883 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    ~$400 billion spent by European countries on defense isn't the definition of giving up or not bothering. Yes it's half that of the US, but the European countries don't have to service and maintain over 5000 nukes, 7 nuclear aircraft carriers, 14 ballistic missile subs etc... The European countries want to defend themselves, the US wants and has global reach, that comes with a cost.

    If Zelenskyy wanted European countries to abide by that 2% target (or the point your making, having European counties armed to the gills,, he wouldn't be getting European counties depleting their stocks to support Ukraine.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,049 ✭✭✭RGARDINR


    I don't know why America couldn't sell all their cluster Munitions to Ukraine that they themselves are banned from using, I think someone said they have 6 million in storage. Like that would of probably saved adviika from falling. Sell them even 1 dollar for 1 cluster artillery shell. Least it fills in the gaps and would help Ukraine considerably. It's just the delay if Ukraine do get the 60 billion in US aid. Where will the front lines be then? What will the state of some of Ukrainian forces be in that have had to fight without the necessary artillery etc? They have lost a lot of people who should not have died if they were given all they should of been given and will lose more by the time IF there given the aid they deserve. I honestly think Ukraine need to drop there mobilisation age and recruit younger ages, it's more if Ukraine don't get the 60 billion US say by the summer what way will their forces be by then. I just wonder is Ukraine just holding out for the 60 billion US aid so they don't need to mobilise the younger people which I can understand but if there not given it there going to have to. It's more if the aid is not given when would this call have to be made.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,883 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    The US isn't banned from using them as the US never signed up to the Convention on Cluster Munitions. The US do have a ban on selling cluster munitions with a dud rate higher than 1%, but I believe Biden can and did overrule that in the case for Ukraine.

    The issue is money, the shells maybe worthless to the US, which costs them money to store them or dispose of them, but Biden can't go selling them for under the book value. Ukraine doesn't have billions to buy them from the US. The Money Ukraine get from the EU would have restrictions. Pay the civil service, pensions etc.... The money the EU designated for military aid for Ukraine looks to have to remain in the EU. So no buying from the US etc...

    An EU country could back fill their artillery stock with US stock and send their own shells to Ukraine, however cluster shells are banned in all but, I think Poland. It's a fucked up situation. Give Ukraine the money and let Ukraine buy what it needs from what ever country it needs to buy from. This keeping the money within the EU is hampering Ukraine.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,049 ✭✭✭RGARDINR


    Ahhh thanks for clearing that up as I was wondering why they couldn't sell the Cluster Munitions to Ukraine on the cheap just to get rid of them and could of helped Ukraine considerably.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,166 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    "Some" dumb things "long ago"?

    I do not think for a second that to die in prison is normal thing but to present him as a martyr for democracy is questionable. And if you are firm believer of posibility that people can change and deserve second chance then we can talk about quite a lot of them who may be worthy of that thought. Change and second chance is not very popular over in the west. Any western politician with his baggage would be already cancelled and pretty much done because of what he said and believed not that "long ago".



This discussion has been closed.
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