Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings and threadbans - updated 11/5/24*

The answer to your first paragraph is simple - only thoes that we could realistically and sustainably manage without impact to services/supports already in place. Maybe that number then was 30,000... maybe it was 3,000... but the bottom line is the numbers we HAVE accepted are completely beyond whatever that number was, and again we ALREADY "do our part" through foreign aid. We are giving away over 2 billion in ODA:

We already do more than enough to support those in need elsewhere. It's easy to dismiss when sums of billions are being thrown around, but 2 billion is a LOT of money to be sending out for a country with our domestic challenges.

I sympathise with Ukraine's situation but I feel no obligation or responsibility for it, not do I feel that their needs should come before our own. The problems between them and Russia are going back a lot longer than 2 years and it won't be solved by Ireland no matter how much money we throw at it, or how many people we take in. That's up to them and the solution will ultimately be a negotiated settlement (whatever that looks like) as neither side is winning the war.

On the housing points, I addressed those earlier - no, it won't solve the issues overnight but it will allow renewed focus on them (possibly also why the current Government are happy to let the focus remain on AS and migrants), and the billions that are being spent supporting refugees can be used to assist with this coupled with the need for competent leadership. As I've said before though, FG in Government are even more destructive long term than FF. They squandered the mandate and opportunity to reform how this country works in 2011, and they (through Noonan and NAMA) have allowed huge amounts of property and debt owed to the taxpayer to be sold off for relative buttons to investment funds who are now renting it back to individuals and the State for ridiculous amounts. We're essentially paying twice in the latter case.

We don't have inifinite resources... spending money on one thing means taking money from something else, or taxing the population more for the shortfall. The current Government is doing all 3 simultaneously yet the people losing out or paying more are seeing no return for it. Worse, they're seeing new arrivals getting things they aren't entitled to, or being excused from requirements they have to comply with (eg: the NCT), but they are also seeing it when they try to make a GP appointment, or increased pressure for school places, etc.

Supporting others should not be at the expense (literal and at societal level) of those who are already here and who have far more entitlement to expect support from their Government. For years/decades we have been told how "X can't be fixed overnight" or "Y isn't possible" - yet that's exactly what's happened in many cases to accomodate complete strangers to our land and not only are we told to accept this, but also that our needs are less important as a consequence - is it any surprise that people are angry and resentful? No it's not exclusively the fault of refugees (unless they are in fact economic migrants trying to bypass those requirements as a lot are), but the Government have allowed them to become the focal point for many of these issues all the same.

Ultimately we have our own problems to solve and that's where our focus needs to be. Maybe when we get our own house in (relative) order can we look at doing "more" than we are already doing (as per my first point), but until then we need to put our needs first.

A threshold of "only those that we could realistically and sustainably manage without impact to services/supports already in place" is pretty idealistic though. 6 million people fleeing a country in Eastern Europe is just not something that is likely to be manageable to that kind of standard.

It's also worth pointing out here, if we are having a migration vs resources weigh-up here, that over 1.5 million Irish-born people are living abroad — a figure whose sudden total return would (applying the same logic you are using) place incredible pressure on existing services and hugely increase housing demand. So we are also using migration as a pressure release valve too, and aren't only being the sufferers of it.

Doing our part with foreign aid is all well and good, but it doesn't make the reality of refugees go away. The big challenge for Europe now is how we address the geopolitical challenge we are presented with — Africa to our immediate south, the unstable Middle East not all that far, and openly hostile Russia / Belarus to our East who understand that they can hurt us with refugee crises. This isn't going to be solved by any Ireland First policy — it will require collaboration to strengthen EU external borders and work with neighbouring origin countries to incentivise them to help us in dealing with this problem.

Gobshytes Gullible Paddys

Why should I? Whats the relevance here beyond you trying to derail?

What I vote for is my business and not for this thread.

A relative of mine visits me regularly and regales me with the latest on geopolitics from many obscure corners of the world....and the solutions to these hotspots ..all courtesy of the experts on RTE/BBC/ etc that seem to mesmerise her. There's an almost violent pushback if I suggest there may be greater complexities at play. When we were kids in the school play yard I remember kids would always shout "It must be true...I saw it on de telly..na na de na na".

If you work 4 days a week, you lose your Job Seekers benefit and generally all ancillary supports. Infact, if you are going to be working any days at all, you have to report and check with the Department to see if you can keep any benefit.

We should do an asylum barge.

Keeps the AS safe from the war and persecution they are fleeing.

Creates an efficient provision of services to them.

Keeps them out of our housing and labour market.

Reduces risk of them leaving provision and disappearing among human traffickers.

You never know, he might train to be a GP in prison….

Less than 8% of those asylum seekers who have transfers actually transferred.

The number of Nigerians have increased here given that even if they have claimed asylum in the UK they cannot be returned . Ireland returns fewer than those in the EU than it accepts back for asylum .

https://gript.ie/dublin-iii-regulations/?ct=t(EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_5_17_2022_13_19_COPY_01)

Yes i imagine we could have like 4 of them, and maybe a another barge dedicated to exercise, language classes and little offices where the NGO's can rent for their swindles.

Could make it go Green to get some buy-in from you know who.

What about camps? They could live and work there. They'd be like work camps. Then, for successful asylum seekers we could have a special area where they are allowed live and we could get them to wear a symbol or something that wiuld make them recognisable, that way people would know they've had their asylum application accepted.

Sure why wouldn’t they come here, seeing as they get a reduced prison sentence for not speaking English. From the article:

”Judge Nolan said the headline sentence was in the region of eight to nine years, “by reason of the violence involved”, having taken into account the maximum penalty available to the court was 10 years.

Judge Nolan said Bah’s plea of guilty was “late” but “valuable”. He took into account that Bah was an African national who speaks French and as such, would have difficulty in prison because he has little English.

He jailed Bah for six years.”

Living here at least 3.5 years, as the attack took place in Sep 2020 (it’s not stated how long he was here at that stage), and still can’t speak English. I guess there’s no incentive to learn.

Also, this is the second time here in recent weeks someone has posted a link where the judge has handed down a reduced sentence for the guilty party as they don’t speak English, as they would have a hard time in prison. You’d wonder are they being coached by their legal team to claim to not speak the language?

Well they could work the barge - there'd be a lot of cleaning and stuff to be done. Your idea about a probation period has merit too.

the judge in question is the problem.

This guy, or some other representative, was on Newstalk this morning.

Said that estimated loss to the country this year due to reduction in tourism accommodation will be in the realm of 1.1bn euro.