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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,608 ✭✭✭Paddigol


    You really need to look up the meaning of strawmen argument. You've thrown out that claim a few times, completely out of context, where the only strawman argument being raised is by you. It's gaslighting of the highest order - "faux outrage" "making yourself feel superior". And on you go with more strawman arguments "The BBC and sky news do stuff...".

    Strawman argument:

    fallacy of refuting an argument different from the one actually under discussion

    distorts their opponent's argument by oversimplifying or exaggerating it



  • Registered Users Posts: 211 ✭✭highpitcheric


    Got to keep in mind when watching such videos that at least some part of russias forces is/was composed of putins rivals.

    Protestors and inmates. Among the inmates are psychos and other problematic individuals, sure, but also some of them will have resorted to criminality due to Russian society having its wealth vaccumed up the mafia pyramid which putin and his goons are sat atop. So indirect victims of putin in a sense.

    Political rivals, protestors and the coerced underclass no hopers. Are somewhere in those ranks dying. Cant be sure if youre watching one or not.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭rogber


    Quote one example of "pro Russian propaganda".



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭rogber


    There's a big difference between BBC or whoever showing pictures of war to emphasize how horrific it is and someone on boards with a hard-on screaming "look at this one lads, watch him get turned into jelly erm no i mean mince meat hahaha".

    The first serves an informative purpose, the second shows a pathological pleasure in demonizing another group and watching them suffer and a total absence of normal human sensitivity



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,768 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Thank God America did, thank God the Brits did early on.


    Europe is largely tapped out of weaponry to supply them and maintain their own largely threadbare armies.


    Ukraine should have said to America, thank you but we are innundated with weapons from European States.

    We should be 2 years in to a massive military armaments plan across Europe.


    The violence is still only starting on its latest cycle in the middle east and the arch of instability around Europe is growing.


    Russia will lose but it may win in that it holds what it has, its economy in tatters and only America left willing to project force against dictatorships and lunatics.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,738 ✭✭✭zv2


    There are a few caveats concerning these videos of killed Russians.

    1. It is a win for Ukraine and most people on this thread want Ukraine to win. Unfortunately that means killing lots of Russians. Dead Russians = winning. Sad but true.
    2. Russia's war crimes has stirred up great anger and even a desire for vengeance. There is a limit to what people will tolerate.

    None of this justifies jubilation at their deaths but one has to look at this in context. And the context is Russian brutality and mass murder. Murder that has been going on since Russia came into existence. People talk about the evil west and there is a case to answer here but the difference between the west and Russia is that the general populace in the west have not been poisoned by their leader's evil while many Russians have soaked up the cruelty of their leadership. On Russian national tv they openly talk about how they should be committing atrocities against their enemies and many Russians applaud it. They have become depraved by a century of depraved leadership. A lot more could be said about this but it shows why many people say a good Russian is a dead Russian. I'm speaking very loosely here but I can't cover every exception in one post. At any rate, I'm not justifying or condemning the posting of such videos.

    “Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.” — Voltaire



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭rogber


    You talked about a video recently of Russians being turned into paste then corrected yourself to say it was more like meat, or something similar to that. Practically creaming yourself with excitement and you were called out on it by other posters too. You know what I'm talking about, but I really don't have the patience to trawl back through your mountain of daily messages to find the exact wording



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,280 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    All of which is fine and don't disagree about the hardening of opinions when it comes to Russia's actions and how they're prosecuting or viewing this conflict ... the country seems a bit of a lost cause really .. but my very original consideration was about how we consume the thing.

    For the first time in human history, we can basically watch war & moments of death in real-time as pure "voyeurs" and as we conduct our daily lives, all thanks to the weirdly dissociative effect caused from watching drone footage and the like. Which probably enables the kind of glib "haha, look at 'em fly" crowing going on, regardless of Russia's provable barbarism. It's like something from Black Mirror that one checks one's emails, watches a bunch of soldiers die as they're thrown from their truck, then go back to work.

    God knows I grew up with plenty of pearl-clutching articles about how video games were corrupting our youth, the violence therein somehow a seed that'd cause the downfall of society. It never happened of course, but funny that a world of depravity can be consumed, in private, thanks to the connectivity of our smart phones, and there's less ... interrogation about how healthy that is for us.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,738 ✭✭✭zv2


    Yes, but isn't it more than voyeurism? My point is that there is a whole range of emotions here. This war has stirred up great outrage in people. When I see the Russians getting blasted like this I often wonder if they are the Orcs that cut genitals off with a boxcutter or some poor wretch who was just thrown into the war as cannon fodder. I can't tell so I'm conflicted about how I feel about it. But the more Russians commit war crimes the more people are inclined to see them as Orcs.

    But to address your main point - that such videos have a bad effect on the psyche and on society - I'm afraid you are right. Ultimately it is bad. The internet is every bit as bad for the world as television was. We'd be far better off if we had none of them.

    @pixelburp "God knows I grew up with plenty of pearl-clutching articles about how video games were corrupting our youth, the violence therein somehow a seed that'd cause the downfall of society. It never happened of course"

    But it has! Civilization has all but morally and spiritually collapsed. We still have transport, work and a tax system etc, but these are only the physical facade of civilization. Inwardly the world is becoming spiritually impoverished.

    “Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.” — Voltaire



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,815 ✭✭✭aidanodr


    We will never know the real horror in Mariupol, most of it has been / will be cleansed by Putin & Co :(

    Two years under the rubble. A large number of bodies were found in Mariupol.

    In the temporarily occupied Mariupol, Russians began demolishing the House of Communication, which has a unique mosaic "Conquerors of Space" on its wall. 

    The advisor to the mayor of Mariupol, Petro Andriushchenko, said that a large number of dead Ukrainian civilians were found under the rubble, their bodies in a terrible condition.  "For two years the bodies have been under the rubble... - he said.


    Post edited by aidanodr on


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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,557 ✭✭✭Hande hoche!


    Sweden is officially in NATO as of today. So will be curious as to whether we see some movement of the Grippen front. Would be an ideal candidate for the Ukrainians.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,153 ✭✭✭saabsaab




  • Registered Users Posts: 7,557 ✭✭✭Hande hoche!


    If they get the F16s by the Summer they will be doing well unfortunately.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,557 ✭✭✭Hande hoche!


    Interesting, theoretical vs practical implementation. Out of curiosity would you have an opinion on the other European canards i.e. Eurofighter or Rafale?



  • Registered Users Posts: 674 ✭✭✭I.am.Putins.raging.bile.duct




  • Registered Users Posts: 7,557 ✭✭✭Hande hoche!


    Thanks for the information. Would be a fitting end for the Mirage line if the Ukrainians were the last new operator.

    Go out doing what it was designed for, in battling Migs and Sukhois.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,280 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Fascinating little insight there: in a similar vein, how are these fighters WRT training? Like, presumably Ukrainian pilots will need upskilling on all those options - but what's the best balance of availability vs. training? Presumably the Mirage 2000 is easier to get to grips with than the hyper technological Eurofighter, right?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭rogber


    I never said anything remotely like that and never have. I can only assume you're confusing me with someone else. If not, quote where I said it



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭rogber


    As usual you change the topic when called out.

    Of course Russia is to blame for the war. Do I shed a tear over dead Russian soldiers? Not at all. But it takes a twisted mind to take gleeful pleasure in watching them die, especially when you're sitting in a country far removed from the conflict.

    But if that's how you get your kicks in life, you do you...



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,746 ✭✭✭sxt


    Zaluzhnyi was fired by Zelensky. He was the military commander of the Ukrainian army and was fired/removed from that position.How is that a conspiracy theory? :confused:



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭rogber


    I don't know, some might say being made ambassador to a country run by Tories is pretty strong punishment



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,153 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    Turkish Defence Minister İsmet Yılmaz confirmed that the Turkish F-16D was shot down by a Greek Mirage 2000 with an R.550 Magic II in 1996 after violating Greek airspace near Chios island



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,986 ✭✭✭✭Furze99


    Someone has to watch them die and bear witness to the crass stupidity of their state's leadership. It's possible that in the future Russian citizens will themselves see reels of clips like this and vow never again.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭rogber


    The crass stupidity and even more so cruelty of the Putin regime is extremely clear to anyone without watching videos of people being blown up. The whole point is that a certain poster takes sadistic pleasure in the videos and doesn't even pretend otherwise. Fair enough, his business, but let's not pretend it has anything to do with bearing historical witness



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,232 ✭✭✭EltonJohn69


    I do wonder when those dwindling reserves are used up could there be a sudden economic collapse in russia ?



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,630 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    Russia's invasion of Ukraine is a complete failure (Both Tactically and Strategically)

    They've failed to take Ukraine after 2 years, The NATO alliance now with Finland and Sweden onboards is stronger than ever before, Russia now shares a huge border with NATO, Russian losses in terms of equipment and personnel have been very heavy, The Russian economy is in decline, not to mention all the Wagner messing that went on last year. It's been an absolute disaster for Vladimir Putin, like it couldn't have gone worse than it has.

    I'm guessing the president will have an accident this year at some point. I genuinely believe this summer is the last roll of the dice for the Russian invasion. It is highly likely Europe will send more military aid to Ukraine in the event Donald Trump is elected and refuses to back them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,153 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    Unpredictable for sure..change is sudden in Russia. Report yesterday that a Russian bank went bankrupt..first of many?



This discussion has been closed.
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