Hamas strike on Israel - Threadbans in op - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

Is Israels "right" to "destroy Hamas" more or less valid than Hamas "right" to "destroy the IDF" on October 7th?

Proportionally, you wouldn't have had to go back far in time prior to October 7th for the cumulative killings and crimes by the IDF to exceed what Hamas did on that day.

The obvious conclusion is that when a person is supporting one as valid, and not the other, then there is obviously some underlying bias there - regardless of how they want to conceal it.

And they (Hamas) could also salvage some of their own (which have a much higher failure rate than Isreal's) which failed to make it to Israel, but no matter which bombs / missiles are being "repurposed", it's an incredibly risky business.

Is anyone here a citizen of or in an economic cooperation with or in strategic partnership with Iran?

Condemning Iran is patently assumed surely. Chill.

Even if Israel utterly glassed Gaza, Hamas still exists in Qatar, so this guff about Israel having the right to finish the job etc. is meaningless bluster. Hamas won’t be destroyed if Gaza is. So this is not an apt reason not to ceasefire against women and children and half naked hostages waving white flags.

The problem for Hamas is that hostages were being taken in Gaza and also in the west bank in larger numbers and faster than they were being released by Israel. The fact that a large number of women and children have been kidnapped from Gaza and have simply disappeared is staggering. Parents have had babies taken away and are simply gone. How can you negotiate with that

Israel wasn't sealed either on Oct 7th it seems. Someone was asleep at the wheel. And the fact that they had been treating Palestinians like **** for so many years and expected no consequences just shows their arrogance. You reap what you sow and after the atrocities of the IDF it will probably happen again because of the new recruits that either Hamas or whatever new element appears after this will have at their disposal. Rinse and repeat until Israel learns how to treat people.

The experts are part of what is known as the Special Procedures of the Human Rights Council. Special Procedures, the largest body of independent experts in the UN human rights system, is the general name of the Council’s independent fact-finding and monitoring mechanisms. Special Procedures mandate-holders are independent human rights experts appointed by the Human Rights Council to address either specific country situations or thematic issues in all parts of the world. Special Procedures experts work on a voluntary basis; they are not UN staff and do not receive a salary for their work. They are independent of any government or organisation and serve in their individual capacity.

they are all telling lies is it? To what end would they decide to do that? I think on the balance of probability I might decide to listen to what they have to say rather than your feeling that they are making it up

They didn’t have proof then either?

“Reasonable grounds to believe” is not “proof” either so check your bias.

Israel have completed the first step in the process of carving Gaza up. A road has been built across the territory that divides it in two.

Eventually Gaza will go from complete Palestinian control to looking like the West Bank, major population centres will be cut off from each other, movement restricted, walls, trenches, security check points constructed.

The Hamas invasion of Israel has inflicted a catastrophe on Gaza.

Hamas military strength is widely acknowledged at being in the region of 40k fighters.

I understand the mechanics of the situation very well. But as to it being repetitive, I'm not so sure. Definitely the wish to do it will be there, and of course this is known by Israel, and is expected, and so their attitude seems to be " Sure you will try again, but before you do a repeat, know the price that you will pay. And so now they will make it as high as they possibly can as a deterrent, and this is what we are seeing now.

I thought we have moved away from the "you're all a bunch of anti-Semites" low effort posts but I guess we are not.

So it seems that some of the hostage families have received proof that the hostages are still alive so that does suggest that Hamas is still in control which is depressing. hard to know if it is achievable that Israel can bomb Hamas out of Gaza so I suspect the killing of civilians will continue for a few more months.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/families-of-several-dozen-hostages-reportedly-receive-proof-their-loved-ones-are-alive/

That starting to sound like zionish propaganda and soundbytes jm. Veering in the direction of "UNRWA runs Hamas" territory. How many times can they spend this cash? Presumably if they pay people to build the tunnels, the money is spent. If they wanted to keep it in their pockets, it would seem more logical not to build tunnels or buy rockets. If you want to talk about people profiting off misery, the real money is in massacring Palestinians to steal their property. Nearly three quarters of a million Israelis living in illegally occupied West Bank. Eyes firmly placed on plans to establish similar in Gaza. There's no difference between them and the Russians trying to seize land and property in Crimea or greater Ukraine. Except that the Russians appear to be less murderous against the Ukrainians afterwards and try to assimilate them (even if forcibly).

You are a military man - I could post a video I saw on youtube of IDF soldiers high-fiving each other and laughing as one of them regaled a story of how he had just shot dead an elderly Palestinian man lying face down on the floor of his house, trying to hold his arms up. The video showed the encounter (with the victim blurred). After they finished congratulating the murderer, they went back in and put a load more rounds into the body for the craic. How could someone support that? It's on youtube, but I'd probably get banned for posting it here as there appears to be a bit of a bias against the Palestinians.

Is this the cash that Israel brought to Hamas in suitcases?

Most aid to Gaza is not cash. It's physical aid.

You can see that being airdropped into Gaza atm, it's food and water, not dollar bills!