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Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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    #31532
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121877564#Comment_121877564

    I'd agree that we didn't rotate enough earlier in the tournament. It's exactly the same way England ran out of steam in RWC 2019. I do think that extra 1-2% in big games can come from rest even if players seem like they can go almost 80 on GPS figures.

    As for the QF itself, only the lack of a viable loosehead replacement (Kilcoyne came in on 75) and a trusted outhalf (zero minutes for Crowley) made us go late into the game without subs. Overall we used the rest our bench earlier than NZ with only JOB for Hansen being forced.

    I'm not sure if the lack of a viable backup LH can be laid at Farrell's door. The rest of them were either injured or a big step down. Loosehead is still a challenge. Similarly, Farrell spent most of the preceeding years trying to develop Carberry, Ross Byrne, Harry Byrne, while looking at Frawley, and possibly having Burns and Carty in camp. Crowley was a late development and maybe didn't quite have the time he needed rather than the game minutes he needed. I'm not sure what else he could have done for either spot.

    We need to give minutes to younger players but only if their club and training camp contributions deserve it. The problem is further down the food chain in some cases.

    Edit: for the record, I'd have had Crowley on somewhere around 70 to stress NZ a different way. Sexton was out on his feet.



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    #31533
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 24,313 ✭✭✭✭phog


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121877605#Comment_121877605


    Edit: for the record, I'd have had Crowley on somewhere around 70 to stress NZ a different way. Sexton was out on his feet.

    I've huge regard for Farrell but I really do question how he got this so wrong.

    He must have decided before kick off that no matter how wrecked Sexton was, Crowley wasn't getting game time. If that's true then I'd love to know what conversation he had with Crowley prior to that game. He knew Sexton was gone after the RWC and that Crowley would be his starter for the 6Ns, it's odd that he froze him out of that game.

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike at


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    #31534
    leakyboots
    Registered Users Posts: 5,988 ✭✭✭leakyboots


    Plus Crowley had knocked over winning drop goal v Leinster in high stakes game, kicked conversions from the corner in the URC final. It was very clear last year he's made of strong stuff. Sexton should have been hooked the second his legs were gone towards the end of that game, he was just shovelling the ball on for a finish.



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    #31535
    Piskin
    Registered Users Posts: 423 ✭✭Piskin


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121877516#Comment_121877516
    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121877516#Comment_121877516

    Exactly...last WC was our best ever team and we **** the bed again when under pressure.



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    #31536
    pickarooney
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,454 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121877471#Comment_121877471

    NOTIONS!



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    #31537
    Seadin
    Registered Users Posts: 1,543 ✭✭✭Seadin


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121877905#Comment_121877905

    REALITY!



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    #31538
    Shehal
    Registered Users Posts: 2,704 ✭✭✭Shehal


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121877853#Comment_121877853

    They didnt **** the bed, stop talking nonsense.



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    #31539
    crusd
    Registered Users Posts: 1,237 ✭✭✭crusd


    I think what some people here seem to forget is that other teams are allowed to play well.

    England put in their best performance since the '19 Semi Final and win by a point, at home, with a last minute drop goal and the sky is falling.

    Evenly matched New Zealand and Ireland teams trade blow for and one team comes out on top by a single score and Ireland choked



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    #31540
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,883 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    If people are going to insist on bringing up the world cup after every game for the next 4 years it is going to get pretty bloody tedious.

    It was a poor enough performance and England played out of their skin. Ireland have been on the opposite side of games like this so many times, pulling out a performance against a highly favoured opponent, that you think it might give people some pause before laying into the team left, right and centre.



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    #31541
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    I think the Irish media and fans have to take this one on the chin. We got totally ahead of ourselves. England regularly give us problems even in the last couple of years when we've been at the top of our game. It was 10-9 last season after an hour despite England having been a man down since before half time. It was 16-15 the previous season after 65 minutes despite England being a man down for the entire game. We won both games in the final quarter due to them running out of steam which was in no small part due to being a man down.

    At the weekend, they had a vocal crowd, a point to prove and a full team on the field. Any off day for us (and we tend to have them against England) was going to put us in trouble. When 6 or 7 of our guys had their weakest performance of the tournament combined with several key errors/poor execution at big moments, it was unlikely to be our day. The genuinely most surprising thing on the day was the fact that England needed a last minute kick to win it. It's not often you see George Ford 1/4 from the tee including one very straightforward kick he missed in the first half.

    England are well able to raise their game and seem to know how to play against us effectively. Some people are seeing this as a huge shock....this is an England team that absolutely destroyed Argentina in the RWC through their physical dominance and then went toe to toe with SA and were minutes from beating them in a RWC semi final. We were rightly favourties but this was always going to happen at some point.

    Post edited by Buer on


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    #31542
    Shehal
    Registered Users Posts: 2,704 ✭✭✭Shehal


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121878076#Comment_121878076

    Those people better hope Ireland get another lopsided draw in 2027 as otherwise this narrative about choking in QF's will soon be over and they'll need something new to whinge about.



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    #31543
    Shehal
    Registered Users Posts: 2,704 ✭✭✭Shehal


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121878153#Comment_121878153

    Oh look another fella who hasn't been seen on a rugby forum since the RWC QF!



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    #31544
    Clo-Clo
    Registered Users Posts: 5,299 ✭✭✭Clo-Clo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121877516#Comment_121877516

    The last team went into the WC looking to win it.

    I don't think any of the team went into the WC with the goal of losing in the QF, maybe some of the early teams when Ireland wasn't as strong felt a QF was an achievement but not for the last few years. The team go in to win now and that's the right attitude

    The irish players win QF at clubs rugby etc and for loads of different reasons of the years have lost at QF stage. All been discussed in detail. So not sure what mindset you are talking about?

    I enjoy watching sport, it's a way to relax from the stress's of the World. Im not going to sit around and only get excited every 4 years and then spend the next 4 years complaining about the WC. We lost, that's sport.

    It was on one of the podcast but they mentioned about Scotland, so Scotland got to a semi final and have won nothing since. Their clubs have a Pro14 or Rabo or whatever it was called to their name, would Irish rugby swap all of those years of success for a semi? I certainly wouldn't



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    #31545
    Clo-Clo
    Registered Users Posts: 5,299 ✭✭✭Clo-Clo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121877463#Comment_121877463

    They also nearly beat South Africa a couple of months ago

    Similar to when Farrell took over in 2020 they are trying to implement a new system and the two week window from the Scotland match to the Ireland match gave them loads of time to work on the new system. If you watched the game they clearly have improved massively in those two week.

    England was always going to get better as the tournament progressed and they had more time with the new coach's like Jones. This has been called out since the start of the tournament and a lot of people who know a lot more about rugby said this could happen, especially in Twickers.



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    #31546
    OldRio
    Registered Users Posts: 6,055 ✭✭✭OldRio


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121878084#Comment_121878084

    'We' ?????



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    #31547
    ingo1984
    Registered Users Posts: 330 ✭✭ingo1984


    Conan should start at 8 instead of Doris. Have a look at Doris's stats from Saturday and tell me he deserves to start vs Scotland.



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    #31548
    sliabh 1956
    Registered Users Posts: 406 ✭✭sliabh 1956


    Just listened to Quinny on OTB he called out most of the pack but when he came POM he went very quite what a coward refusing to admit that Peter was very poor.



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    #31549
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,883 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121878475#Comment_121878475

    You mean the stats showing he had the most metres gained in the forwards, most passes, most tackles and one of only two clean breaks by the whole team? He deserves to start against Scotland.

    He was mediocre really on Saturday, but if we dropped everyone who had one mediocre game we would be in trouble - for starters we would be changing about 11 of the starting 15 going into Scotland.



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    #31550
    ingo1984
    Registered Users Posts: 330 ✭✭ingo1984


    But complacency needs to be ironed out. No harm starting Conan, bealham, Henderson. Just freshen things up and keep lads on their toes. It's debilitating for the fringe players knowing that regardless of how well of poor the starting 15 play there is zero repercussions. No matter how hard or well you do in training, you won't get a start unless there's an injury. Creates a bad culture and team environment.



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    #31551
    Dubinusa
    Registered Users Posts: 8,557 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    The goal for this week is to win. Beat the Scots and the tourney is ours. Put the loss in the rear view and step up next week.



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    #31552
    Clo-Clo
    Registered Users Posts: 5,299 ✭✭✭Clo-Clo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121878810#Comment_121878810

    When have players not been rotated into the team?

    Ireland have lost how many games over the last 2 years so how did you come up with "regardless of how well or poor the starting 15 play there is zero repercussions"?

    This nugget is spun out all the time and it's based on something which happened in 2007.



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    #31553
    Clo-Clo
    Registered Users Posts: 5,299 ✭✭✭Clo-Clo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121878674#Comment_121878674

    Quinny will always shy away from calling out Munster players, he is still heavily linked in with the province and will call out a good performance and not a bad one.

    Not sure why you would call him a "coward"?



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    #31554
    nerd69
    Registered Users Posts: 10,091 ✭✭✭✭nerd69


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121878867#Comment_121878867

    And 2019.


    We dont rotate players in thats why we had to bring so many injuries to the world cup



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    #31555
    Clo-Clo
    Registered Users Posts: 5,299 ✭✭✭Clo-Clo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121878897#Comment_121878897

    We took Joey who was injured from recollection and that was it, Henshaw picked up an injury at the WC training, similar to last year

    PLayers got rotated in the group games and the issue was teams had worked Ireland game plan out, not the players. I don't remember anyone, apart from maybe Conway who was pushing to jump into the team. When Carty was given his chance at 10 it didn't really work out for him



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    #31556
    Dubinusa
    Registered Users Posts: 8,557 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    I'm hopeful that faz rearranges the furniture a little this week. Maybe start Hendo and Baird . Ringer to the bench with HB.



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    #31557
    sliabh 1956
    Registered Users Posts: 406 ✭✭sliabh 1956


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121878879#Comment_121878879

    Off all the Forwards that played on Saturday He was the least effective And if he is going to be just a Munster "fan boy" maybe he should not be asked to give his opinions as a supposed annalist on a Radio show. Why not just call it as it is.



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    #31558
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 10,437 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    A frustrating loss, but perhaps it can prove beneficial in the long run. An end to the 6-2 shite, and bring into focus that a few lads need to be moved on from after the tournament.

    We'll smash Scotland next weekend, then build to a cracking tour in SA.



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    #31559
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,883 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121878924#Comment_121878924

    I can not see any way in which they drop the captain for the final game.



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