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"It's what you do next that counts"

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    A little update

    I've pulled the plug on Valencia, I tried my best to maintain fitness with a bit of cycling but at this stage I feel I've just missed too much at a crucial time.

    I thought I'd be more disappointed than I am, in fact I'm experiencing relief. I was already downgrading my finishing time and questioning the quality of the work I'd done.

    The money I would have spent on the hotel has now gone on a flywheel smart trainer. I guess that's the big positive to come from this.

    I've never really enjoyed cycling, found it boring. This time round though I've had some sound advice from cyclists and it's made all the difference. I'll certainly be using it as part of my training going forward.

    On Friday evening I tested the toe with 3k ez in a stiff pair of shoes. This gave me the confidence to give parkrun a go.

    Circumstances meant that Father Collins was the best option and what a beautiful park it is, met Murph and one of his buddies beforehand. I was unsure if it was him at first, he appears to be looking younger.

    I gave it a good solid hard effort, puked on the line and although I got slower with every kilometer, I'm quite pleased with the 20'49. Not too bad after two weeks of no running.

    Target for the end of the year is to go sub 20.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    Followed up the 20'49 at Father Collins parkrun with 20'07 at Marlay parkrun.

    Delighted with this and hopefully sub 20 on December 23rd.

    The cycling is here to stay, definitely seeing the positives.

    The cold weather in Dublin over the weekend meant I availed of my flights to Valencia.

    Brought my shoes with the main intention

    of going to halfway before dnf'ing.

    I ran by lap heart rate, so again every mile split would be a surprise.

    With the compact start, I guessed mile 1 was around 9 minute miling but nope, beeped at 7'46, then 7'45 followed with a 7'37.

    Aerobically this felt incredibly easy, my legs on the other hand never really felt fresh and the hip flexors started to give out at the 10k mark. But the miles continued to beep between 7'25 and 7'40.

    Went through halfway at 1:40:20, not too far off last year's split. Stupid thoughts now entered my head, same again would be a fairly solid 3:20:40, so I continued on.

    The splits continued all the way to mile 20 but by now, it wasn't just the hop flexor screaming, my quads were falling apart.

    I purposely slowed on mile 21;to give them some relief but it wasn't helping.

    I ran all the way to mile 22.4 and without thinking, I just stopped and walked, a minute only, I decided this was the plan forward, run a mile, walk a minute. Still struggled but it worked and the mile splits weren't too shabby 8'20 to 9'15.

    I was fairly certain this would still give me a sub 3'30 so I attempted to video call my daughters, last year my brain didn't work and tech got the better of me, this year it was the best half mile of any marathon ever, I couldn't hear them but they could hear me but more importantly I could see them, smiling and laughing at me, amazing experience.

    Finish time 3:29:02.

    This marathon does not disappoint, my favourite by far. If the toe/nail thing didn't happen, I'm now fairly certain I would have PB'd. Aerobically I felt incredible, my fueling was spot on (yes I brought it, just incase I continued passed halfway). It was just a lack of running over the last 4/5 weeks, my legs didn't have the required conditioning for pounding 37,000 steps.

    For now, recover and head to Rotterdam with a new confidence



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,512 ✭✭✭✭Murph_D


    Eh, what?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    Yep :-) not my best idea. I reckon it took me about six weeks to feel normal again, resting heart rate stayed high and just a general fatigue.

    Things are going better now averaging 50 miles (80k) per week. Getting closer to sub 20 with a 20:06 on a very windy day at Marlay parkrun.

    Raced the Trim 10 miler in 70:47. Again very windy but some poor self control for the first four miles scuppered all chances of a sub 70. Happy with the overall effort though.

    Today marks 54 days in a row of no sweets, crisps, ice cream, biscuits, fizzy drinks, basically all the bad stuff I'm addicted to.

    I'm eating a lot more throughout the day and feel I'm getting better at prefueling and post recovery.

    I'm also on 42 days in a row of doing some kind of strength work, which is definitely not my favourite thing to do but its growing on me.

    This is all part of my own little 500 day project, aiming to run my best marathon in April 2025. Along the way I have Rotterdam this April, 10 weeks out and then back to Valencia in December.

    For the upcoming Rotterdam marathon I'm going to keep things simple and just stretch the long run out. I'm not overly concerned about the finish time and will continue to race parkruns.

    The only niggle I have, is the heel pain, which is now celebrating 2 full years as I picked it up at the Seville Marathon 2022. I've become much better at managing it though and don't see it holding me back.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 799 ✭✭✭marathon2022


    A 20 minute parkrun and a 70 minute 10 mile, your in great shape. Bodes well for the next few months



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    Feb 5th to 11th

    47 miles including a session on the Marlay parkrun hill at 5k effort, lactate testing and a 15 mile long run.

    Feb 12th to 18th

    A mental week that started with tooth pain, prescribed antibiotics and ponston on Monday.

    Root canal Wednesday morning, violently sick that same night, puking.

    Felt better on Friday, so thankfully was able to head over to Amsterdam with my middle daughter. Great weekend away which included a 19'35 parkrun and an 18 miler in the rain on Sunday.

    49 miles for the week. Fitness is building nicely. Rotterdam marathon in less than 8 weeks time.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    Feb 19th to 25th

    A little over 50 miles/80k over six runs.

    Mostly easy apart from two sessions.

    Wednesday included a 1k tempo at half marathon pace, just to warm up and stretch the legs out before 5*10 second max hill sprints off a 2 minute recovery.

    Followed this up with 4*450 meter efforts on the Marlay parkrun hill at 5k effort, jog back down recovery.

    Really happy with the days work. Felt fine on Thursday but fatigue had set I for Friday's easy run, as a result I took Saturday off. HRV also on the low side.

    Sunday's long run was 18 miles/29k with 2*4k 1k alternating every k, concentrating on power numbers from most recent lactate test.

    I was hoping for 3 sets but called it after 2, just working too hard and don't want to impact next week.

    Paces came in at 7'20 and 7'00 pace for the reps.

    Very pleased with the week, I know fitness is improving. Might reconsider the Wednesday session layout as it definitely contributed to my fatigue.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    Feb 26th to March 3rd

    Monday 6 miles easy, very tired legs

    Tuesday Root canal part two, zero running.

    Wednesday 4 miles easy, not in the humour, mouth, jaw and ear, all a little unsettled.

    Thursday 10 miles mostly easy.

    Friday early start, 6 miles in light snow, tooth still uncomfortable.

    Saturday 7 miles in sunny Portugal, on trails and along the sea, taking advantage of low tide. 30 second pick ups every kilometer.

    Sunday 15 miles (should have been 20), legs just dead but of course I insisted on giving the session a go, 1 mile on/off. Finally got some sense and pulled the plug after 4 reps. Few more labouring miles before deciding to head home, really don't want to ruin next week's training.

    It got quite warm and I actually lost 2kg on this run, despite bringing gels and 500mls of liquid.

    Total 48 miles/77k

    With only 6 weeks to Rotterdam, I really need to get some quality in but overall still happy as I've kept the ship sailing straight, despite tummy bug and two root canals.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    March 4th to 10th

    Had a decent week, albeit busy. I was hosting a training camp in East Algarve for the week.

    Lots of my running was super easy pace but I did get some quality in.

    One run was 8*80 meter hill sprints, not quite max, concentrating on form.

    Had a really good Fartlek session, it was short enough but showed me I can still run a little quick, The efforts were mostly comprised of alternating 20 secs at mile effort with 1 minute efforts at 5k pace, maybe slightly optimistic. Good fun though.

    Lots of elites run here and the cycle tracks are all marked with distance (most likely a coach and spray can).

    A particular section had 100 meters, so I ran 5 reps concentrating on knee drive, think it worked well, slow walk back recovery.

    Last day of camp was a solo 20 miles, beautiful weather and it got warm. I really felt the last 5 miles as it was a bit of a jump, previous long run was 15. It was made a little more difficult by wearing tracksuit bottoms and long sleeves, I couldn't bare the thought of being bitten one more time.

    61 miles for the week, just shy of a 100k.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    March 11th to March 18th (Monday)

    Monday - 4 miles super ez

    Tuesday - 6*5 minutes at 6'45 pace (10 mile Race Pace) off 90 seconds jog. Legs still stiff from Sunday's long run but I coped well.

    Wednesday - always a busy day and took an unscheduled rest day.

    Thursday - 9.5 miles easy.

    Friday - 9.5 miles easy and still feeling tired. Re-listened to a Craig Mottram interview and he mentioned that some of his best runs came from forced rest (niggles) and as a consequence had him well rested, so that was all I needed to hear to take Saturday off.

    Saturday - Rest

    Sunday - Tallaght 5k, I wanted to give this a proper lash and was giddy all morning for it. Met @Lazare beforehand, always nice to see a familiar face, hopefully he's on the mend. Then a quick chat with @Lambay island who seemed up for it, zero negativity or race nerves, just excitement, exactly the positivity you want before a big effort.

    I'd planned on sub 19'30 and banking a bit of time early, I don't do well on hills and I knew there was one around the 4k mark which would zap me.

    1st k - 3'45 and feeling good.

    3'41 - 3'41 still feeling good and thinking how great it would be to go sub 19 again, forever the optimist.

    3'49 - Young Tallaght woman beside me was getting plenty of cheers and just towards the end of km 3 she got a few steps on me.

    4'05 - sub 19 dream long forgotten, legs felt like led, mentally strong though and just kept going as the hill tried to dampen spirits.

    3'55 - so looking forward to running on the track, this kept me ploughing away, couldn't do the maths and had no idea what time I was on for.

    12 seconds extra, rallied for this but just fell short of catching the two Tallaght singlets in front.

    19'30 chip time, 100% effort, hit some heart rate numbers (chest strap) that I haven't seen in a while. Looking forward to pursuing faster 5k times over next few months.

    Monday - 20 mile long run, legs wrecked from the start, made the route up as I went. Glad when it was over, couch bound for the day.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭Lazare


    Great to see you too D, you ran a great race. Bang on what you predicted when we were chatting.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    Starting to have doubts over running Rotterdam marathon.

    I feel I'm getting into good shape and am excited by a spring and summer of 5k to 10k racing.

    After my recent long run, I pulled up quite lame, heel and back.

    It got me thinking about how much time I'm sacrificing by doing Rotterdam. It took me six weeks after Valencia to finally feel like myself again.

    If I run Rotterdam, I can see a slight PB but then again I have Valencia end of year which will be a full on assault.

    I've also got the Berlin half the week before Rotterdam, going over with a group, so I could potentially give this a rattle if not doing Rotterdam.

    Any thoughts welcome



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,591 ✭✭✭py


    The long undulating run on Monday didn't make sense to me after you raced the 5Km on Sunday. An easy few Km or a rest day would have been more appropriate, or else skipping the 5Km.

    We have both suffered with PF so I know the guessing game that you are going through right now. When I do a session or a long run, it is followed by a rest day or a very easy short run. If I race, it is followed by a rest day. The heel will have suffered with the back to back intensity of a race and then stress of a long run.

    A few easy days of very easy running will get the heel back on track for Rotterdam but imo ye can't mess around with the recovery of intense/long runs when dealing with PF.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    Thanks PY for taking the time to reply. Yes you're a million percent correct on a few counts.

    The 5k/ long run combo was not wise. I guess I've been telling myself I'm not marathon training and have been making it up to a degree.

    The previous long run also didn't go well but there's excuses for that too, so maybe my view of Rotterdam is a little blurred.

    The PF is certainly still a factor, I'm definitely managing it a hell of a lot better than previous years but the aftermath of Monday's long run had me dragging the foot along the floor, much better today after rest.

    The good news going forward is that I'm leaving one of my gigs which frees up an extra two days for my own running, which will hopefully help with continuing management of PF.

    How's yours going btw?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 799 ✭✭✭marathon2022


    If you are not injured do it, you never know what will happen between now and Valencia.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    Never thought of it from that perspective, definitely something to consider. Thanks for that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,512 ✭✭✭✭Murph_D


    Sorry to hear about the issues, but like py above I really can't believe you did a 20-mile LR (or any LR) the day after a 100% raced 5k. Just asking for trouble, and I'm sure it's something you would advise your athletes not to do.

    But given your history, I'm 100% sure you will travel to Rotterdam and race it! 😀

    Mind yourself in the meantime and best of luck either way.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,591 ✭✭✭py


    I think some reflection on why the previous long run was poor could be worthwhile. Understanding what aspects within your control had a positive/negative impact on why you felt it went poorly. Fuel, attire, fatigue, sleep, pace etc are all worthwhile reviewing. It needs to be an honest reflection without BSing yourself.

    My own PF is very manageable these days. It was fine yesterday when in my original reply and then today its at me today after a late evening run around. It will settle throughout the day and over night provided I get good sleep. The plated shoes have helped a lot but I am slowly trying to wean myself off them for easy runs. I'll continue to use them for speed sessions or long runs. I have been holding back on my easy runs a little. The fitness is there for me to up the pace. There is minimal benefit to me in doing this so I have decided to keep them easy to very easy so that I can continue to get out running. It can be tough at times keeping the ego in check but it has allowed me to keep running regularly.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    Thanks Murph, had a good laugh out loud there, you certainly do know my history and my wife would agree.

    I'm thinking I'll one more long run a go when feeling a little more fresh and then make a call.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    Good to hear you're managing it well.

    The long run two weeks ago, I definitely have excuses, I was running a camp with 22 runners, covered a 100k which is my highest weekly mileage in some time. I also wore too many layers (tracksuit bottoms) as I didn't want anymore bites, plus it was warm.

    The weekend gone was just a different kind of suffering. Maybe 5k race and long run is not the best move but I've actually done this plenty over last few years, including only a couple of weeks ago after the Amsterdam parkrun. It honestly never takes that much out of me, so I didn't think twice about doing it.

    But I was sore/lame, confidence took a hit.

    Just back from 8k and the body feels normal again (heel is doing its usual though). Maybe I was over reacting with initial post but I am going to stick to plan above, long run will be done Monday or Tuesday next week and fresh.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    March 18th to 24th

    Monday - Last weeks 20 miler, already discussed.

    Tuesday - Legs still tired so got on the bike for a spin to Jonny foxes and back by stepaside, about 75 minutes.

    Wednesday - Rest day but busy with athletics in primary school.

    Thursday - My last Thursday work run. Mixed emotions, a great group and I'll miss them but also looking forward to concentrating on my own running.

    Friday - 5 miles easy in the Boston 12s, not sure about them.

    Saturday - Marlay Parkrun 19'34, fun morning racing against a few from my training group. Legs still a bit heavy but didn't stop me leading for first 500m, I was wondering where the hell was everyone. Then about 6 runners went by me and I could relax a little more. It definitely wasn't a max effort like Tallaght 5k but not far off.

    Sunday - 10 miles with company, upto Bohernabreena reservoir and back.

    Almost certain I won't be doing Rotterdam marathon, I've actually put my number up for sale through their website.

    I'll race Berlin half instead the week before and then focus fully on getting my 5k down.

    Thanks for all the input on the matter.

    And 100 days of sweets, chocolate, jellies, biscuits, crisps, fizzy drinks etc and 90 days of some form of S&C every day.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    March 25th to 31st

    Monday - easy group 5k, followed by 4 miles easy an hour later. New shoes arrived and wanted to check them out. The zoom fly 5, like bricks, demoted immediately to walking shoes.

    Tuesday - highlight of the week 8*1k at 4'12 Kilometer pace off 60 secs standing recovery. Felt like I could have done this all day long.

    Wednesday - woke up with a scratchy throat. 7 miles easy with a few strides in the middle.

    Thursday - Scratchy throat was now a head cold. Debated whether or not to do planned session. Decided to give it a go but was prepared to stop if needed. 3 sets of 3*400 at goal 5k pace. 30 secs standing recovery between efforts and 3 minute walk between sets. Loved this session, stolen from Steve Magness, although he has 4*400. Felt solid and all reps were 86 to 88 secs. Changed into my old spikes for 3*200m off 200 walk to finish, 41, 36, 35. I've ordered a pair of dragon flys, looking forward to more sessions on the track but not in Irishtown, the track is in awful condition and I thought it had been resurfaced?

    Friday - Rest day, trying to shake this head cold.

    Saturday - planned on parkrun but having walked the course beforehand, decided I'd be stupid to run.

    Sunday - Wanted to do 5k at 4'15/6'50 pace and take a lactate reading, see if sub 90 in Berlin next week is a realistic target. Felt shlt on the warm up. Changed into alphaflys for Tempo effort and immediately felt better. Lots of distractions on the concert field, junior parkrun setup, other runners, and a bloody nose. Cleared my nose a little too aggressively and it wouldn't stop streaming. Averaged 4'08/6'39 and the lactate was 3.5 mmol, a little too high but given I was running faster than I should have, I think I'm a 7/2 shot for sub 90 but hopefully odds on for a PB 93'25.

    Nothing too crazy planned for this week, just to shake the head cold and feel fresh.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 799 ✭✭✭marathon2022


    Your in great shape, certainly short odds on a sub 90. Best of luck



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Wottle


    Berlin half 1:36:47 - not the race I was hoping for.

    Post edited by Wottle on


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