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Croatians attacked in Dublin, one man dead - read OP before posting

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭Vote4Squirrels


    100% - the same "community activists" now making hay from this poor man's death would be the same ones turning up to court to defend the scumbags who did it.

    And the one who used this man's death to push for an end to protests about unfettered "protection" applicants taking over towns, with no thought to the facilities there, hang your head in shame.

    This man is EXACTLY why immigration, with proper mechanisms and limits is needed, he came here to work and support himself - we need tens of thousands more like him. May he rest in peace.



  • Registered Users Posts: 759 ✭✭✭Slightly Kwackers


    Racism isn't a problem, it's stupidity and the resulting inferiority or sense of deprivation.

    That is worldwide alas. The number of times I saw things hitting the news in the UK about a useless good for nothing usually with a long record of court appearances causing death or serious injury to what quite often appeared to be a "model citizen" was unbelievable. Unless the victim was well known, a long haired attractive female, was a foreign national or had something to boost him or her into the public eye, it would simply not be reported.

    One should be thankful to the "foreigners" I suppose, without them as bait the thugs would have to select people from opposing football or tiddlywinks teams. :-(



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭MegamanBoo


    From what we know about the case it's pretty much a textbook example of a racist killing, no need to steer it anywhere.

    To the best of my knowledge this type of killing is very much a new low for Ireland.

    Not only has it not received much attention, people are even very transparently trying to deflect away from the racist aspect.

    I'm aware of racist verbal abuse etc being fairly common in Ireland for a long time now, but this crime and the reaction to it clearly point to things having gotten a lot worse in the last year or two.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,002 ✭✭✭ToweringPerformance


    Exactly. People are attacked for being different, scum only look to attack anyone who isn't scum like them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,113 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    It's almost like you are trying to justify a racist killing

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 817 ✭✭✭scottser


    It's a staggeringly senseless murder, not least because they killed a foreigner for not speaking a foreign language.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,945 ✭✭✭growleaves


    You're not helping yourself with this kind of dishonesty.

    The poster just disagreed about the motive of the murder, and you say he is trying justify a violent killing.

    You'd be well into defamation territory if the poster were under a real name eg Mr James Smith.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,238 ✭✭✭Cordell


    It's almost like you care more about racism than murder.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,113 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    It says a lot that you try to downplay, deflect and deny the racist part of this death.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,524 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    of course people are going to focus on the racist/xenophobic aspect of the murder when, according to one of the victims, the poor man was beaten to death for being foreign and not speaking english. if it was gang related or a drunk fight that went too far we'd have seen it all before but this is pretty shocking. i mean ffs.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,027 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    what exactly do you mean here

    If you know the answer, can you enlighten me?

    Are you going to the vigil yourself?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,238 ✭✭✭Cordell


    the poor man was beaten to death for being foreign and not speaking english

    …by one or more thugs who no doubt have a long list of criminal convictions and yet they were free. That's the root cause for this murder, not racism.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,079 ✭✭✭circadian


    So the fact that their motives were clearly driven by racist, xenphobic views is not the root cause?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,238 ✭✭✭Cordell




  • Registered Users Posts: 172 ✭✭laketreeroger




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  • Registered Users Posts: 513 ✭✭✭Rugbyf565


    What is it about the current generation of kids from the likes of Clondalkin/Tallaght/Crumlin/Finglas/Darndale/Blanch/Ballyfermot/Inner-city that’s made them so vicious/violent/hostile to complete strangers. They also don’t give a **** about the consequences of their actions. The stats back this up too—Dublin has the highest rate of reoffending, with 55% of those released from prison reoffending within three years. Additionally, Violent crime in Dublin increased by 6% in 2020. Why is there so much anger bubbling under the surface? It’s like a lot of them are consumed by a quasi-rage & power-omnipotence.



  • Registered Users Posts: 638 ✭✭✭Baba Yaga


    i think its because theres no consquences at all for their actions,even if whoever did this is caught it will be more or less a slap on the wrist,be a good lad and try not to do it again…


    "They gave me an impossible task,one which they said I wouldnt return from...."

    ps wheres my free,fancy rte flip-flops...?

    pps wheres my wheres my rte macaroons,kevin?

    "You are him…the one they call the "Baba Yaga"…



  • Registered Users Posts: 513 ✭✭✭Rugbyf565


    The thing that really shocks me is that they travel in packs into areas of Dublin or the city centre where they don’t live in order to actively seek out victims. In the US it’s a case of ‘don’t venture into X area’, you’ll be grand if you avoid certain areas as the criminals only stay within those areas and they’ll leave people alone when they’re outside their home area. But over here in Dublin it seems the young criminals are actively looking for trouble and for targets to set their sights on and will travel 30 minutes to do it. They hop on public transport and run a muck.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,027 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    Its a way for the good people of Clondalkin to show their empathy, support and solidarity to the family of Josip.

    Will you be going your goodself?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,113 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    You're really trying your best to deny racism here. Shameful.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • Registered Users Posts: 172 ✭✭laketreeroger


    it’s a great idea! I won’t be going unfortunately. I’m surprised there is no protests about the violence though. What nationality are the perpetrators? Surely the residents should be demanding some extra garda presence.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,027 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    Dublin is bad, but I dont think its just Dublin.

    It's everywhere in the Country - Cork, Limerick, Dundalk, Drogheda, Kildare, Longford, Galway, Sligo, in fact everywhere.

    There is no consequences for their actions, they think they are above the law.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,027 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    A protest can be done in many ways.

    I'm sure Josips friends and family will appreciate the support shown by the local community though.

    Did it say anything about the nationality of the perpetrators as yet? I did not believe they were caught yet?



  • Registered Users Posts: 172 ✭✭laketreeroger


    I’m not sure what you are asking me to be honest. A vigil is a great idea. I’ve said that a few times.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,027 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    Well you said "we all know the answer as to why there is no protests in Clondalkin"

    I don't know the answer and and clearly you do, so I am asking you what it is?



  • Registered Users Posts: 172 ✭✭laketreeroger


    oh you don’t know what I alluded to? Why all the vigil talk??



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,489 ✭✭✭AllForIt


    Can anyone give an example of a case where a non-national was murdered by a Irish native with no prevous convictions, of hitherto good standing, employed or has prospects, who murdered a non-national for no reason other than racism?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,164 ✭✭✭Musicrules


    This kind of attack will become more common with the growing anti immigrant movement. Some foreign nationals are facing abuse anyway but physical attacks will continually grow because of the growth in support for the far right. I've said this in another thread but it's not just violent scumbags emerging with anti immigrant sentiment. More and more Irish people are coming out and feeling more comfortable announcing their racism. They've got the impression that it's somehow ok now.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,187 ✭✭✭lmao10


    Ironically, you think these same lads who have this type of negative opinion on Eastern Europeans in Ireland are your allies. Just make sure you don't speak in your native language in certain areas due to the indigenous Irish scumbags. If they hear you, you could be killed like the Croatian lad. Don't even let them hear you speaking English with an accent.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,187 ✭✭✭lmao10




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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,841 ✭✭✭TomTomTim


    It's such a shame then, that pro immigration posters/people ignored every warning that they were given for the last ten years about this inevitable conclusion. The "far right" got their steam because of the recklessness of the other side.

    “The man who lies to himself can be more easily offended than anyone else. You know it is sometimes very pleasant to take offense, isn't it? A man may know that nobody has insulted him, but that he has invented the insult for himself, has lied and exaggerated to make it picturesque, has caught at a word and made a mountain out of a molehill--he knows that himself, yet he will be the first to take offense, and will revel in his resentment till he feels great pleasure in it.”- ― Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,027 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    I’m asking you what you “alluded” to?

    You said there was no protests and we all know why and I said there was a vigil.

    But you said you know why there are no protests. I don’t know why that is, so it’s a perfectly reasonable question.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,228 ✭✭✭mikeybhoy


    Death penalty needs to reinstated for the most heinous crimes



  • Registered Users Posts: 172 ✭✭laketreeroger


    because good sir in my opinion the anti immigrant crowd protesters are predominantly made up of racists. I don’t think they give a flying **** about law and order in Ireland.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,504 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    That's some messed up logic. Victim blaming really.

    Akin to: "We told those woman for years that they shouldn't have worn those short skirts. This horrible rape was inevitable"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,524 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    people were warned that Croatians working and contributing would be beaten to death?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,113 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Deleted

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,027 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    yes I think the same but there are anti immigration protests and racists in all areas,

    There was an anti immigration protest in Clondalkin before- crowd came from Cork to stir it up.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,164 ✭✭✭Musicrules


    What do you mean? It was inevitable that foreign nationals would be attacked and some killed?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 172 ✭✭laketreeroger


    sorry apologies my thoughts were never anything against Clondalkin.



  • Registered Users Posts: 513 ✭✭✭Rugbyf565


    Would love to see us take inspiration from the Dutch/German/Polish police, get a few tall lads in SWAT vests for the Gardai carrying machine guns walking around the streets. A bit of tough looking police presence is all I ask for. Knock up a few of the scrotes the odd time if they step out of line. When I was in Berlin, Krakow and The Hague before this was way. You can have freedom but you don’t step out of line, the police take absolutely no **** over there- they show up in full riot gear when there’s resident complaints about youths.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 389 ✭✭highpitcheric


    Just a thought, came to me earlier.

    What if they catch the scumbags and one of them, the one guilty of this crime, is a serial offender ... whos already been given an easy ride by a certain well known overly leniant judge. And was thus around to commit this murder. When he should have been behind bars.

    There must be a citywide protest at that point if so.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 389 ✭✭highpitcheric


    I grabbed one of the little shytes by the scruff of the neck one day, theyd been damaging my property. Had been warned off, spoke back.

    There were tears. 5 mins later his early 20s sister is doing her best jeremy kyle guest act at my door.

    Local kids gathered around ... calling me a rapist.

    I had been watching tele.

    Then glares from the local ma's the next day when I got home.

    Shtbag parents. Everywhere. Raising a generation of immune little scumbags.



  • Registered Users Posts: 164 ✭✭Wezz


    I'm a white Englishman and I have been subjected to comments, my girlfriend is a black South African and works in the health system, she has been called every racist name under the sun, spat at, had things thrown at her….easy to say its scumbags being scumbags but its never directed at her white colleagues, always her. These people will probably be inclined to go for anyone but if you stand out for the wrong reasons you are an easier target.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,410 ✭✭✭Potatoeman


    “Strok and his friend got involved in a commotion near a stop on Tower Road, Clondalkin around 9.45pm. Afterwards, they boarded a bus heading towards Bawnogue.”

    What exactly happened beforehand? It’s all very vague.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,164 ✭✭✭Musicrules


    It's really sad. And then some keep making excuses for it. Racism needs to be called out. It's gaining pace and it's going to be horrible for foreign nationals like yourself and your girlfriend. Britain has been going that way for years. Racism is a massive issue. Unfortunately, we're going the same way. Little England.



  • Registered Users Posts: 453 ✭✭BagofWeed


    Countless foreigners also assaulted in the same period. I experienced being mistaken for a foreigner and the hatred, jealousy and gossiping was an eye opener.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,233 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    A child from those broods would be disowned if he hadn't become known to Gardai before he turned 10.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭MegamanBoo


    Actually the friend who was also attacked gives an account in the Croatian newspaper linked in the journal article.

    Followed them with a car and attacked them from behind

    The friend said that he and Josip were like brothers. They hadn't seen each other for a long time, so they agreed to meet in Dublin, where they wanted to spend Easter, because they couldn't get tickets to Croatia. After hanging out in Dublin, Druzinec invited Štrok (in the photo) to his house in Clondalkin. But before that, they stopped to buy something to eat and a couple of beers, "so that they can hang out at home and have a good talk".

    When they left the store, says Druzinec, the two friends were talking in Croatian. "I have to say, they started throwing insults at these idiots, because I can't call them people. They shouted at us 'You speak English, you are in Ireland, you are not at home, you have no respect for our country. This is Ireland...' and things like that," recounts the attacked boy.

    At that, Druzinec told Štrok to get out of the way, "because he knows how things work in Dublin". They boarded the bus and headed towards the apartment, but they were unaware that someone was following them in a car. While they were walking towards the apartment, about fifteen minutes away, the guys who were throwing things at them in front of the store attacked them from behind.

    They attacked him with a hard object

    The friend says that the attack was unexpected, because they neither saw nor heard it. "They hit me first with something, I don't know if it was a bar or a bat, I asked the police the details they saw on the video, which they allegedly have. Basically, I fell when they started on Josip. After some time, I managed to get up and wanted to help him, but they started beating me again, even harder," recounts Druzinec, who says that's all he remembers

    He does not know how long he lay on the floor, nor who called the ambulance and the police, nor how long it took for them to arrive. "I know that I woke up in the hospital, they were sewing my head, arcade, during the night there were police officers in the room with me, I think two. They took my clothes, which is clear to me, for the DNA of the attacker, they also took my cell phone and did not give it back for three days so I could call someone. I was alone, and I couldn't do anything," concludes Druzinec.

    The police drove him from one place to another all day

    He spent the next day with the Irish Guards, in clothes that were not his own, unwashed from the blood on his face. They drove him by car from one station to another, and Druzinec told them that he did not remember anything, except what he had already told them. Druzinec thinks that the police were trying to connect him and his friend Štrok with some gang or drug dealers, and both of them, according to Druzinec, had nothing to do with such things. "We are ordinary boys from Zagorje who here and there like to drink beer, wine or gemišt, and we were never interested in drugs," adds Druzinec.

    The police confiscated his mobile phone, so they could easily check his contacts, he says. He told the police that he did not have any debts for which anyone could attack him, and they also questioned him about the house he entered three days before the attack, which was found by his employer.

    "I was only there on Wednesday afternoon, Friday night and Saturday morning. I moved my things in, and Thursday and Friday I worked in Cork, a few hours away from Dublin. My colleague and I slept in a hotel in Cork. I don't know any neighbors around my new house, I just arrived. "I have no idea if something happened in that house before that," says Druzinec.

    Translated from Croatian but his account is pretty clear that they were just two lads minding their own business.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 87,871 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1


    The scum need to be put in prison for life, not this 8 to 15 years with parole good behaviour, life should mean life

    The justice system needs over hauling and to be tough

    Any assault even by a minor needs tougher punishment



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