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Iran has come out of the shadows and attacked Israel directly. **Read OP before posting**

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭zerosquared




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,536 ✭✭✭brickster69


    A clear warning should Israel attack Iran again.

    “The earth is littered with the ruins of empires that believed they were eternal.”

    - Camille Paglia



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,922 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Ah missed this.

    The inference was that the US supports everything it's US supplied allies do militarily. Supply doesn't always mean automatic involvement or support (as mentioned US supplied nuclear weapons tech doesn't mean Israel can nuke whomever and the US supports it, likewise all military activities with allies). The US very openly said "yeah nope" to that Israeli strike on Iran, pretty obvious as they aren't keen on escalation. Now if it was a Trump admin, then maybe it could have been very different.



  • Registered Users Posts: 166 ✭✭engineerws


    I wonder is it because I was friends with an Iranian whose wife and himself were both elegant and sophisticated hosts that I cannot understand how anyone could support the child murderers of Israel over Iran.

    I knew Israeli's too and three were nice but none of those had served on the frontline when I knew them. I think the apartheid requirement they instituted has driven them barmy.

    I've no major problem with Iran, womens rights probably need to be improved but supporting the child murdering genocidal state of Israel over Iran.... that seems crazy and yet we have people here supporting Israel. Why?



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,025 ✭✭✭silliussoddius


    Definitely a misunderstood regime.

    https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/iran-sentences-rapper-toomaj-salehi-death-over-2022-23-unrest-lawyer-tells-paper-2024-04-24/



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  • Registered Users Posts: 166 ✭✭engineerws


    Fair point, seems like a shockingly cruel and arbitrary judgement, but still hardly a reason to hate them given Saudi does similar but is a great ally of the USA and certainly not a reason to prefer the child murderers in Israel.

    How anyone could prefer the Israeli child murderers is beyond me. Maybe they are people working in Israel companies or otherwise compromised. It makes no sense to me and even more crazy to see the UK/ EU backing Israel. It feels like the colonists and imperialists have to support horror to somehow assert what they see as their superiority.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,025 ✭✭✭silliussoddius


    No definitely shouldn't hate them for that, definitely no colonialism or imperialism in their history either.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,536 ✭✭✭brickster69


    Iran condemns US attempts to trample on free speech and right to protest.

    “The earth is littered with the ruins of empires that believed they were eternal.”

    - Camille Paglia



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,407 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    Same country which is executing it's youth that protested for change.

    All Eyes On Rafah



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,002 ✭✭✭ToweringPerformance




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  • Registered Users Posts: 17,922 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Indeed if this was Iran students would be taken to Evin prison and tortured (and some later hung) and those women would be attacked for not wearing headscarfs by the morality police.



  • Registered Users Posts: 34,825 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    Sounds like you know literally nothing about Iran. Have a read of this:

    https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2024/country-chapters/iran

    Executions

    Iran remains one of the world’s top practitioners of the death penalty, applying it to individuals convicted of crimes committed as children and under vague national security charges; occasionally, it is also used for non-violent offenses. Iranian law deems actions like “insulting the prophet,” “apostasy,” same-sex relations, adultery, alcohol consumption, and certain non-violent drug-related offenses to be punishable by death.

    Based on a report from the Iran Human Rights Organization, more than 700 executions took place in Iran during the period between January and November 2023. This marks a substantial increase compared to the same period in 2022. Among those executed, 238 were charged with “intentional murder,” and 390 with “drug-related offenses.”  Furthermore, 10 individuals received death sentences for political or security-related charges or blasphemy, and 1 person was sentenced to death on espionage charges.

    Judicial authorities drastically increased the use of vaguely defined national security charges that could carry the death penalty against protestors, including for allegedly injuring others and destroying public property. Following grossly unfair trials where many of defendants did not have access to the lawyer of their choice, authorities issued 25 death sentences in connection to the protests. As of September 20, authorities executed 7 people, and 11 cases were overturned by the supreme court.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,689 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    "Women's rights probably need to be improved"????

    Understatement of the year.

    https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2024/03/iran-institutional-discrimination-against-women-and-girls-enabled-human#:~:text=GENEVA%20(8%20March%202024)%20%E2%80%93,Finding%20Mission%20on%20the%20Islamic

    "The report to the Human Rights Council said violations and crimes under international law committed in the context of the “Woman, Life, Freedom” protests that began on 16 September 2022 include extra-judicial and unlawful killings and murder, unnecessary and disproportionate use of force, arbitrary deprivation of liberty, torture, rape, enforced disappearances, and gender persecution."

    Oh, and I am sure there is no problem being LGBTQ+ in Iran.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,523 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Their house thier rules

    America still executes prisoners and Assange is facing the death penalty there If he gets extradited, have you ever posted anything against the death penalty in the US?



  • Registered Users Posts: 34,825 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    I have actually and I am massively against it.

    Not sure what that has to do with human rights abuses in Iran? Are you pro them executing people for blasphemy? How about homosexuality?



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,523 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    No, i don't agree with them carrying out the death penalty for those crimes (its a crime in their country wether we agree with that or not) but I also don't agree with the death penalty for any crime.



  • Registered Users Posts: 34,825 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    Glad to hear it :)

    The problem with thinking like 'their house, their rules' is that it's absolves human rights abuses within a country.

    This is wrong. You should be able to (and people should actively) criticise any country committing human rights abuses. Be it Israel or Iran. (or in this case, both!)

    Iran shouldn't get a free pass on such criticisms because they happen to be anti Israel. I'm getting a bit of 'Iran, a great bunch of lads' from some people in this thread (particularly that person I responded to)

    If 'their house, their rules' is okay enough for Iran to be allowed to continue what they do without criticism, then it was okay enough for Apartheid South Africa and any other despot nation doing horrible things to their own civilians in their 'house' too. Which is obviously wrong.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,689 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    And if it is their house, their rules, who decides the extent of their house?

    Is Gaza part of Israel or Ukraine part of Greater Russia, in which case, their house, their rules, no problem?

    It seems to me that there are really some blind spots when it comes to the Middle East.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭zerosquared


    Remind us how rapists and spies are dealt with in let’s say Iran



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,025 ✭✭✭silliussoddius


    Sur that's fine, Iran isn't that bad of a place. Unless you live there of course, which is something the mealy mouthed will never do.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 25,523 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Heavily armed American "police" attacking kids today for holding peaceful protests against Israel.

    Clamping down on peaceful protest, beating/arresting students, threats of having them expelled for simply protesting how are they any better than Iran?

    I'm not condoning Irans actions (would love to see the regime removed and the people freed from that life) but its hypocritical for western countries to condemn them for their actions and then to clamp down on peaceful protest.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,523 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    They're killed

    Remind me again what penalty Julian Assange faces if extradited to the US?



  • Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭Iscreamkone


    There is nothing positive to be said about the Iranian leadership. I regard them as an enemy of our way of life. I have no sympathy when they get a slap or two.



  • Registered Users Posts: 34,825 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    Why do you keep assuming I'm pro the US way of doing things? That's the second time now you've replied to me and made a comment about things happening in the US as if I support it. I never gave any indication that I did.

    People have to stop turning this into a black and white thing, it's ridiculous.

    'He doesn't support the Iranian regime, therefore he must be pro the US'.

    It is possible to support neither and think they're all insane.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,321 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    In theory? 175 years from 18 counts, though nobody thinks that's likely.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,523 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    But could have also faced the death penalty, that's why his extradition has taken so long because Gb want assurances from the US that he wouldn't receive the death penalty as some have been calling for.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,411 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Like the “peaceful protest” out in Jobstown was it?



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,321 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    Not under any of the charges under which he was indicted. And should new charges be placed in the future (not that I can think of any which would be capitol crimes) the US provided the requested assurances to His Majesty's Government two weeks ago that no death penalty would be sought.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,523 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Yup, but it's tool 4 years for them to do that hence the reason he wasn't sent, up until 2 weeks ago he faced the death penalty for reporting the truth.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 277 ✭✭freebritney


    Looks like as predicted the whole Iran distraction seemed more performative than anything. The Israeli government has a serious predicament now though with the student protests in America. These aren't state or community colleges, these are the ivy league that produce the next generation of CEO's, presidents and leaders. They've had their eyes opened to the reality of what a colonisation is and have seen how the sausage is made, there is no going back. The baby boomers who felt a tie to Israel will be replaced by a generation that saw their fellow students get arrested and beaten on the orders of a foreign government. Long term Israel is going to further become a extremest pariah state isolated by the whole world.



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