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Marriage is over. What do I do now?

  • 15-05-2024 09:51AM
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭


    Been married for 11 years, but we've been together for almost 20 years. I'm a man in my very early 40s

    My wife has left me, we have 3 kids together and have agreed to share custody 50:50.

    It's been about a month since she moved out. We're still working out financial stuff but aiming for a full 50:50 split in all assets, we have both agreed this.

    I tried everything I could to save the marriage but it wasn't enough and even though I still love her, I have to accept that it's over and need to move on.

    What next for me personally? I now have the prospect of whole weeks on my own and even thinking about that is making me feel lonely.

    I've been getting back in shape, walking loads and going surfing and trying to find things to fill my time but my entire life was my family for the past 16 years and the friends I have have moved away and don't live locally anymore.

    I have some plans in my head of using my free weekends to travel and see the friends I haven't met in years, but that still leaves the other 5 days a week of sitting on my own feeling sorry for myself, and every other week is gonna be me trying to be the best dad I can be.

    Any advice for a newly single 41 year old who hasn't even thought about chatting up another woman in 20 years?

    How long should I even wait before jumping back into the 'dating' scene?



«1

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭Gary_dunne


    Sorry to hear this, really hope that you're doing ok.

    Best advice I could give is not to even think about rushing back into the dating scene. Take the time to work on yourself, it sounds like you have been doing just that and have a plan in place which is a great start. Concentrate on your kids too, as you have said "be the best Dad you can be".

    I'd always advocate for some therapy, you've just had a major change in your life and seem unsure what the future holds for you. Talking with a therapist can help you to understand and deal with this emotional shift that has just occurred.

    Good luck with it all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,549 ✭✭✭Padre_Pio


    I wouldn't even bother with dating for a good while, especially only month after a 20 year relationship.

    You're doing all the right things, focus on your hobbies, your health both physical and mental, your children and your work. No need to feel sorry for yourself, just start planning events and giving yourself things to look forward to.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 180 ✭✭_H80_GHT


    I scho the opinions above. Also, best not to have a new partner until the divorce is finalised lest your wife takes umbrage to that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 58 ✭✭KingFling


    I'd 100% recommend counselling to talk through everything with a professional. It might take a few experiences to find a counsellor who you match with, but you will click with one and feel the benefits. Time to invest in yourself and give yourself every opportunity to find your new self.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,179 ✭✭✭✭Calahonda52


    As I wrote earlier in another thread

    1: eat well

    2: exercise well

    3: sleep well unaided: if aided do more of 2

    4: be a positive contribution every day to family/friends/community/whatever

    5: only interact with folk who have a positive influence on you, so friends who only lament with you don't cut it!

    6: control what you do on social media and keep away from negative stuff, including radio TV news

    7: live in the present, past is past and future, well we dont know

    I would put some paperwork in place re the 50 50 deal because you need to cover off all the bases before dating again as a vengeful spouse, prompted by a lawyer, could get dates mixed up and suggest she moved out because you were….

    “I can’t pay my staff or mortgage with instagram likes”.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 460 ✭✭martco


    find some practical useful things to fill your life with

    and it doesn't have to cost a fortune either, for example…

    I like driving so worked on filling my driving licence entirely…now I'm A,B,C and taking my D test soon

    I took night classes, certified responder amongst other things

    maybe get involved in local vocational voluntary things even politics where there's a ton of things to do and need doing



  • Site Banned Posts: 2,799 ✭✭✭Bobtheman


    Create new routines. Join a gym

    Join a tennis club. Get lessons.

    Keep busy.

    Look up a men's shed. There might be separated people's groups to support you.

    It will get better and eventually down the road you will meet someone and wonder why you didn't leave her.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    Boxes are helpful someone taught me that

    A box for the marriage .Another box for stuff that's unhelpful

    A box for where your at and another box for where you want to be

    Keep everything in the boxes and focus on the where you want to be box



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,021 ✭✭✭YellowLead


    You’re still young, plenty of time to cultivate a social life and eventually meet somebody. I wouldn’t advise going near dating apps or actively looking to date somebody until 6 months or so pass, and only then if you are ready. This is coming from somebody who has been the first person guys have dated post marriage break up - they’re never ready.

    I recommened looking up solo events with Ecofitness. Nobody really dates from it, but it’s an excellent social platform for older people (35-55) to meet other single people. You go on one of the solo hikes or trip and then get access to the main whattsap group and regional ones where people post that they are going for a walk or drinks and whoever is free joins them. No pressure for dating and loads of people attending have been through divorce etc - it’s a great way to meet people of your own gender who are in the same boat. Loads of friendships form and it’s an avenue to socialise.
    Other than that, you’re lucky you are doing 50/50 custody - a lot of men get every second weekend with their kids and a mid week evening and that’s it.

    Go on a solo mini break to a European city. Take up a class if not a sport. Volunteer. Got to free events. Enjoy your alone time because one day you might be in a relationship again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,894 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    Any advice for a newly single 41 year old who hasn't even thought about chatting up another woman in 20 years?

    I'm not gonna sugar coat this for you OP, It's a sh!tshow out there. It's all on apps now. Bubble, Tinder, POF, Hinge and what not. The apps are awful, I've been through it, and as an average looking man myself it is absolutely soul destroying. If you're in bad place now I would advise NOT to use those dating apps. That being said I've been dating the most amazing woman ever the last few years, IE there is light at the end of the tunnel but the tunnel itself is a long as nasty place, you need to be in the right frame of mind before entering it.

    How long should I even wait before jumping back into the 'dating' scene?

    As long as or as short as you want. (Just make sure you're in the right head space for it)

    But you don't need to do anything, It's only been a month.

    It will take time for you to figure out what you can do in the evenings.

    My time was taken up building a gaming PC and playing games on it, and motorcycling.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,857 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    very sorry to hear op, i really enjoy our posts here, always very well informed, but id agree with all of the above, consider a therapist, its something i really should have done earlier in life, and id really have to agree with not dating for a good while, just rediscover yourself. you will go up and down and sideways for the next while, this is a very traumatic experience, this is to be expected, tons of really good youtube channels out there for advice, best of luck and look after yourself



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Thanks for all the kind comments and suggestions. I used to play tennis years ago so might take that back up, had a motorbike too and am tempted to get another one, give myself permission to go full mid life crisis mode :)

    I'd never heard of EcoFitness but I'll check them out too



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭Spore


    Some good comments here. I'm going through a similar thing, splitting with my partner, house dog etc. no kids however. I'll be homeless in the near future which scares me. But I'll soldier through, I take heart in knowing that I'm not the first to experience this. I've plenty to give and if anything I've more freedom to give with. Losing the dog will kill me to my core… but I'll try see the little fur ball as often as I can. And I'll get another dog. Keep the faith brother. You're far from done.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Sorry to hear it Spore. Hope you find somewhere to stay and can start rebuilding



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    The hardest times for me are right before bed, and just as I wake up. All the other times I can pretend that she's coming home soon.... Or distract myself.

    I do still love her, so much.

    I know she's gone.

    But I still love her. Need to learn how to stop loving her



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,343 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    Akrasia, I'm so sorry to read what's happened. It's only early days and it's bound to be so difficult at this stage. I can only think with time the hurt will pass. For now, get a routine going, a new pattern to your day that will keep you going.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 598 ✭✭✭Avatar in the Post


    You’ve made a great start.

    No harm taking baby steps into the online dating scene. It might help kick start the moving on phase. Might take your time actually going on a date. But, see the ‘lay of the land’.

    Therapy sounds like a great idea.

    How’s work going?



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,918 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    I would say don't try to not love her. You love her but your not together, almost everyone has someone who ticks that box. Try and be a good father, be civil and friendly to her, and leave it at that. One day, sooner than you think, you will still love her but you won't want/need her. Try and find hobbies and social outlets, tennis sounds like a good call, typically a social scene with a club. Best of luck out there.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Work is happening but I'm very distracted, so I'm far from performing at my best.

    Maybe doesn't help that I'm WFH so literally everything around me reminds me of her all of the time.

    If we didn't have kids I'd move to another city, or even leave Ireland, but we do, and they're the most important things in the world to me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,096 ✭✭✭Norrie Rugger Head


    You're not in the headspace for dating. You need to find, or rather rediscover, who you are. What's your identity alone.

    Any relationship, for now, is literally a rebound where you're just trying to fill a void and not be alone. Unfair to yourself and, more importantly, any prospective partner.

    Book some therapy. This is a trauma, no denying. You're whole life is being upended. Give yourself a few months

    On things to do. You're getting in shape and exercising is good for your mental health but your mentioned exercises are very solo activities.

    Barring chronic injury, at 41, you should look to a team activity. Did you play sports? Are there veteran teams you can join or Junior "Z' levels?

    Can you coach an adult team if you can't play (many clubs would snap up help even if you can only do every 2nd week). That will start a new social circle at the least

    They're eating the DOGS!!!

    Donald Trump 2024



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,021 ✭✭✭YellowLead


    It’s very natural to feel this way. It will take a lot of time for the feelings to change. Perhaps try not to pretend she’s coming home soon. Allow yourself to miss her and feel the feelings, but do accept that it’s over. That’s a big step.
    Getting back into tennis would be brilliant - if you join a club as well as practice nights and leagues there is usually social events. Just getting out takes you away from wallowing and gives room for the feelings to lessen in intensity.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,133 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    hope you ok OP. I split from my partner after 13 years many years ago now. It was not amicable, so in many ways was easier than what you going through (if that makes sense).Also no children, so no need to keep in touch.

    Some great advice from others here. What I would also recommend is to some solo travel- ie solo group travel. Go somewhere very different culturally. If you walk- consider doing something like a stage of the Camino - there are some groups you can go with, while also taking reflection time alone.

    Do not consider at this time going near dating apps/sites, you are not in the frame of mind for that.

    You will need to take time to sort through everything like paperwork etc. Hopefully you ok financially (I was not) and focus on that if you need to as well. Nothing worse than money worries on top of emotional ones.

    Eat well, read, consider an evening course and stay away from booze.

    Good luck

    Post edited by anewme on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    That does actually make sense. When I was still trying to save the marriage we were getting on fine, still having loads of good days and very few rows but she still wanted to separate because she said she didn't feel in love with me anymore. I said to her 'If our relationship was worse, it would almost be better, because at least then I would know that splitting up is the right thing to do."

    The fact that it's amicable is way easier in a lot of ways, especially for the kids, but it is a head wrecker for me because I, and me alone, still have it in the back of my mind that this is all just a terrible mistake and she'll figure it out and come back.

    I still see her almost every day and we're still working out the details of getting the house and financial things sorted. The fact that she can come over here and sit next to me and be all smiles and jokes is good for the long term, but stings a whole lot inside. And every time she gets in the car to leave, feels like she's leaving again for the first time.

    I know it will get easier with time, but there will probably need to be some milestones. The first time she starts a new relationship (or my first new one) might be that final act of closure?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,329 ✭✭✭SuperBowserWorld


    Don't beat yourself up mentally over it. And don't fall into that trap. As soon as you feel it coming on, stop and breathe and let it pass. And don't feel like you have to justify anything to anyone. Just be kind to yourself.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,021 ✭✭✭YellowLead


    ’Closure’ is difficult to define. But one thing is for certain you won’t find it if you are seeing her every day! It will be confusing for the children also. It sounds like a bit of a cake and eat it too situation (I don’t mean to speak negatively of your wife of course) - if you are in each others faces every single day and both looking after the children that’s not really a clean split. I understand you want to put the children first, but you won’t be a good parent if miserable and pining and they need to be secure in the NEW reality.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    I feel a little bit like Schrodinger's cake myself tbh

    She thinks she'll be able to see the kids whenever she wants even though I told her that when she chose to separate that this was literally breaking up our family.

    I'm torn between short term pain for me, keeping the kids happy and everything as 'normal' as we can for their sake, and avoiding a long drawn out messy divorce and keeping on good terms with her, because us having the kids together mean we'll always be part of each other's lives.

    If I can just compartmentalise and put her into a friend zone I feel it will help me to move on.

    The last thing I need is to keep thinking she might change her mind. I need to be able to accept that it's over and part of this is picturing my life in the future without her. And because I don't want to live alone, part of that means trying to find someone else. I know I'm not ready for a serious relationship right now, but in time, I'll need to be.

    I have been to a couple of therapy sessions and didn't find them that useful TBH. they were just telling me the things that I've already been telling myself



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 978 ✭✭✭taxAHcruel


    While I can get behind the idea of making choices to keep the kids happy - some moderation there is always advisable too.

    A lot of people of course stay together "for the sake of the kids" and try to keep things on the surface as happy and normal as possible. But kids pick up on and process a hell of a lot more than we generally give them credit for. And such relationships maintained in that way - well meant as they are - can cause more harms than you might predict.

    Now while you are not doing exactly that - it still pays to be congnizant of just how much ground you give and concessions you make in the interest of keeping the kids happy. Not everything you do for your own sake and your own well being and your own agendas and towards building your own new path into the future is going to be ideal for the kids. Nor should it be. Consider the cost of each concession to you as an individual and reconsider the ones where the price is too high for the gain. Kids are robust. They can take at least some hits due to the breakup.

    As to your main question - what can/should you do with the 5 days "every other week" where you are both child and friend free - there is simply too many answers to that question potentially for anyone here to really give you any.

    Of course it would be entirely out of character for me not to shout "Try Jujitsu" at this point because it is one of my main loves in life and the thing that has brought me more positivity than anything else. So I throw it in here tongue in cheek.

    But the reality is - There are already numerous threads around the forum(s) here on topics like "What hobbies can I try" "How can I meet women" "How can I make friends" "What should I do with my life". I can tell you from my own experience that there - is - so - many - things. So much to try and do and learn and attempt in life. Worse many things you might not expect to like - or even positively expect to hate - until you try them and discover you love them.

    Take horse riding for example. I half looked at that as something for either little girls - or people engaged in high level sports like racing and show jumping. Someone got me to try it though and I instantly became addicted. I had no idea I would love it so much. Nor the effects it would have on me physically and emotionally and so forth. I simply adore it. Especially since I combined it more recently with another of my loves - archery. It's hard to describe the feeling though of an animal that powerful under you - in the moments when you sync and it feels like you are "one" with them.

    Until I tried it I simply had no idea.

    You now have a life where for 10-15 days a month you have no real ties stopping you going out and just trying what you want. It's "you" time. You can relish it or rue it I guess. I can only tell you which I would pick in your position. Try it all. Stick to what you discover you like.

    Finally the WFH issue. That could actually be one of the simpler things to deal with depending on your location and money and so forth. You might find it healthy to find a work space you can go to work in. A rented hot desk in a hot desking facitility. A local library. A mates house if his house is empty during the day and he has a desk or table you can use (two of my friends did this and it worked out extra well as the spare house had a stay at home alone dog in it so it helped both parties in the end). Or go into work some days in the week even if you do not have to. Or some combination of all of the above. I know one guy who goes one day a week from WFH to work in Bewleys cafe. Sometimes I myself (also WFH) go out and work in the kids Tree House :-)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,511 ✭✭✭✭Dial Hard


    You need to formalise the kids' access situation, for everyone's sake, including theirs. I don't mean via court or anything, but just agree a set "they spend X days with you and then X days with me" situation. Obviously you can be flexible within that as needed, but at the moment the kids are in as much of an "Are they or aren't they?" situation as you are with her turning up every day. The sooner they can start settling into a new normality, the better.

    As for closure, my own opinion is that there's no such thing - you just get a little better and a little better and a little better, day by day, month by month, year by year, until finally it doesn't hurt any more. It's not a linear process, unfortunately, you'll have setbacks and regressions and as many bad days as good, at times. But you will get there. The only way out of it is through it,, as I always tell people. There's no magic bullet, much as we might like to think there is.

    The very best of luck to you.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,549 ✭✭✭Padre_Pio


    Time is the only healer I think, and nights are the worst when your brain goes into overdrive. I maintain that any thoughts after 10pm should be taken with a pinch of salt. Tiredness and darkness increase my sense of paranoia, so I don't listen to my internal monologue.

    In my past breakup I used to watch box sets until I was too tired to stay awake. Sometimes 4 or 5am, but it only lasted a fortnight before I could sleep at a reasonable time.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,268 ✭✭✭jackofalltrades


    Sorry to hear what you're going through Akrasia.

    You seem to be doing very well though. Just keep yourself busy, exercise, try and eat well, get proper rest and keep yourself busy. Hopefully it'll get more tolerable in time.

    One thing that raised a red flag for me though was "She thinks she'll be able to see the kids whenever she wants" and "I still see her almost every day… she can come over here and sit next to me and be all smiles and jokes". I wonder has the reality of the situation really hit her, how will she be when she can't see the kids for a week because you have them. Best bet is to get some kind of formal custody agreement and see if she can stick to it. I'd minimise contact with her to the minimum needed to get everything sorted out, just so you have some space to mourn the relationship.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Its getting to the difficult time of the day. Kids are asleep. I'm all on my own. Have just re-watched the Munster Connacht match for the third time already because I can't bring myself to watch anything good on Netflix. For me, good tv just isn't good unless you can share it with someone, and I could watch some mind numbing rubbish but that just feels worse. .. and then there's nobody to complain about how terrible it was…

    Next week she'll have the kids and I've lots of little plans. Go see a Joy Division tribute band, go surfing after work at least one evening... There's a singles event nearby that I know I'm not ready for but I need to know I can have a conversation or at least maintain eye contact with another woman for long enough (but not too long) to prove to myself that there is a future to look forward to...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    I've also done lots of pushups and am seriously considering joining a local BJJ group, but need to be a little bit fitter before I can even start that



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Actually, feck it, I'm not that unfit. I've just emailed the local BJJ group for more info



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,096 ✭✭✭Norrie Rugger Head


    They're eating the DOGS!!!

    Donald Trump 2024



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 978 ✭✭✭taxAHcruel


    Remember BJJ is like a soap opera or TV series. Most people who are into it did not enjoy the first few episodes :) How often do we hear people say a series is great but you need to watch at least X episodes before you get into it. BJJ is usually very like that.

    BJJ is life for me. But thinking back on my first few classes - and looking at newbies from a black belt teachers perspective today - its getting through the first few classes that is the biggest hurdle. Because you will inevitably feel terrible at it at first. Especially as many schools will allow you have your first full wrestle from the first class.

    But definitely give it 10 or 12 classes before you decide if it's something you are into or not. Do let us know how you get on too. I may even know or have competed against your teachers - though of course you likely will not want to name your school for fear of doxxing yourself :)

    Good luck with it either way.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    My kids used to do BJJ lessons about 5 or 6 years ago and I do remember watching them and thinking it looked fun but I had a super busy life back then and didn't make time for 'me only' interests

    The guy who ran it was actually an old school mate and a really nice fellah so looking forward to giving it a proper try now!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,821 ✭✭✭JVince


    avoid counselors or therapy - they dwell on the past and try to find a "reason". That then transposes into finding blame and that does no-one any good.

    Best phrase ever - learn from the past, but never dwell on it.

    Marriages end - people change - life moves on.

    From friends who have separated, they joined a couple of clubs.

    Rotary Club. Lions club, Toastmasters clubs (brilliant for building speaking confidence) - all have a very good social aspect and there are clubs all over the country

    Park Run - this comes up so often as there's a great social aspect. You could blend this in with meeting up with friends from years back as there are park runs everywhere. You can also be a volunteer.

    With the Kids - find a project that could take weeks to complete. EG creating a garden feature or building some giant lego contraption or bring them on a park run - again this can be somewhere else in the country and make a day out.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 978 ✭✭✭taxAHcruel


    It sounds like you are great with your kids and close. They might enjoy you starting a BJJ journey. If your kids like to read I highly recommend the first two books in the "Way of the warrior kid" series (soon to be a movie with Chris Pratt I believe) which you might enjoy reading together. It's a book even adults can get something out of.

    One of the things I often like to do when a new person starts - is pair them off with my 13 year old daughter. Especially if they seem in any way overly cocky or two into their own muscles that they have built over 20 years of lifting.

    Usually the class goes 1) Warm up 2) Show a new technique to drill with your partner 3) Fight time. And you generally fight your first partner and then switch partners two or three times before class ends.

    Anyway when they find themselves turned into a puppet by my slim petite daugther the effect tends to be strong. Either they are so humiliated by it they never come back again - or they are so awe struck by the sheer magic of BJJ that they feel "I have absolutely got to learn this voodoo!" and they never leave. I can usually see it in their eyes as they tap to her for the first time which one it is. I'm almost never wrong.

    After that - quite often you do not really realise how good you are getting at BJJ until someone new starts after you. Because generally people improve at the same rate you do. So you see your progress as slower than it is because you are judging it against the students around you. But then some new guy comes, maybe bigger and stronger than you are, and you fold him every which way and you realise just how far you have come.

    The students who progress faster tend to be the ones who spend time watching all kinds of you tube videos at home to learn techniques to try - or they enjoy the videos showing drills and movements and work outs you can do at home that improve the movements and positions and joints and so on related specifically to BJJ. Lots of those videos showing solo things you can do at home which improve your fitness generally anyway - but also specific to BJJ movements and demands. I find working out alone at home more fun and motivated if it's towards a purpose rather than just general fitness.

    We have "open mat" in our school too which is just times when people can come in and fight outside class. Recently had a white belt who wasn't into this because open mat tended to be the higher belts. But off his own bat he started a whatsapp group just for the white belts and as open mat approached they would arrange if any of them were going. Which was good because if one or two white belts were going to show up for open mat - it tended to make the others feel good about coming too. So I was glad he did that as I had kind of dropped the ball on enticing the white belts into using that time.

    Anyway let us know how you get on. As you can see its a hobby that can take up 1 or 2 hours of your week - or it can be something you allow take over every waking moment of your spare time :) You can compete at white belt level against other white belts which is great. It can be inspirational just to go to an event and simply watch the white belt matches. There is one in Athlone tomorrow I believe. Irish open is in meath in June and just before that there is one in Tullamore. Dublin June 1st and Galway July 7th. So plenty to watch throughout the year if you want any more details.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,297 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    Awful situation and while you are torn about trying to move on and hoping it can be fixed just try to give it some time. It will sort itself out one way or another and while things may look set in stone now it can all change in a while.

    She may realize what she lost and who knows what will happen in future.

    One thing is certain, this kind of situation is tough and it is hard to deal with so stay positive and try to do few things you did not have time to do before.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 978 ✭✭✭taxAHcruel


    On another note - as any discussion of BJJ can take over my mind as you have just seen - I myself am someone who struggled with self doubt, self hated, anxiety and dark thoughts for many years. It took me awhile to get on top of it and now I live without it - though I am constantly aware it's still there and can come back at any moment.

    Like Diabetes. If you check your levels and take your meds you can often live a life entirely "free" of the effects of diabetes but if you drop the ball it can come rushing back fast. My issues are like that. I feel entirely free of them. But I know I have to stay constantly on top of that like weeds in a garden.

    Anyway the reason I mention any of that is I got on top of it not through any one thing but a combination of things. No one thing helped on it's own. I have to maintain a few things in my life and everything goes well.

    One of those things in that my demons and self doubt and anxiety and inner negativity was always strongest at night. The "difficult time of day" as you call it above. So one life change I made was for me obvious and simple but powerful. I started going to bed a bit earlier and getting up a bit earlier. I am now in that Jokko Willink group of people who get up around 04:30. Which is relatively extreme of course.

    Anyway it may not be for you. But if you find depression anxiety and negativity piling on you at night - consider perhaps an early to bed early to rise mentality. It does not have to be 04:30. But even an hour shift can have profound effects by knee capping the night time demons of doubt. And everyone benefits because if you get up at the same time as the kids you have the stress of getting them fed and out to school. Get up long before them and you can have much of that done before they even wake. Even their breakfasts can get better and healthier if you have time to make some effort before they get up looking to feed.

    I find for me it also boosts sleep quality as my Garmin Watch shows me that my body is in "stress" to recover after work outs and the like. Which means in the morning after working out I feel alert and full of energy and craving good healthy foods. But if I work out hard late I can not sleep right and crave crap comfort foods. And even when I do sleep - my Garmin is showing me the sleep quality is rarely even near as good.

    Thankfully late BJJ doesn't have the same effect on sleep :) It's generally if I work out hard at home or go for long runs. So I tend to keep that stuff for early morning and active sport like Martial Arts, Archery, Dance or horse riding for the evening/night.

    In short (which I clearly never am) a simple hour shift in sleep patterns can knee cap the bad and empower the good in your life and routines. As Tom Waits sang in one of his songs "The night does funny things inside a man - old Tomcat feelings he can't understand".



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Thanks mate. I appreciate the thought (and length :) ) you've been putting into these comments.

    I'm really excited about the BJJ thing now. First class is Monday evening, and what you said about your 13 year old daughter clicked with me too, My daughter just turned 13 and I noticed this gym's kids classes are up to 12 YO so I'm gonna ask my daughter to come with me on Monday and if she wants we can do this together. The timetable actually really suits both of us. She's already really active and a high level gymnast but has Mondays and Wednesdays free

    I have a feeling there's gonna need to be a montage



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 978 ✭✭✭taxAHcruel


    Funny I was just considering re-watching that movie lately and wondering if my daughter is old enough for it.

    Repeat my recommendation for the Warrior Kid books so. My daughter re-read them a few times. In one of the books the Navy Seal recommends the kid make their own "Warrior Kid Code" and I found her doing that off her own bat. And she decided recently to deal with a bully in her school in pretty much the exact way the kid deals with his bully in the book. By having her and her friends build him a bike as a gift. So quite the effect the book has had on us overall.

    So quite the inspirational book and BJJ was one of the cores in it :) 5 books but to be honest 4 and 5 are just filler. But I've given the books to adults and it's inspired and changed them. But if you are considering getting into BJJ together they'd definitely be good books to read together.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    really useful advice.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,133 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    The comment to avoid therapy is really ill advised.

    Not everything has to look back to a detailed reason in the past or blame. counselling should never be a blame game. If it is, you’ve got the wrong counsellor.

    A lot of people separate at this age, particularly those together a long time. You are not the same person you are when you met and neither is your wife. People grow apart and usually one realises it before the other. She’s done her grieving already.

    your counselling should focus on who you are now, moving forward and the great future ahead of you. Positivity!

    One of the best therapies is fresh air and nature. Get yourself a daypack, flask of tea, up early and out for a walk.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭Terrontress


    I went through similar when I was the same age as you. Together 18 years, married 10, 2 kids.

    It sucks, it really does. I had a life in mind and felt that life was snatched away from me. First things first, things will get better. Your wife and you will start to go on a different path and a time will come when you realise you are no longer the man from that relationship, and she is no longer the same woman. And you are not the one and only for each other now. My thought process went from "She will realise her mistake, come back to me, and we will get together again" to "She will realise her mistake, come back to me and I will reject her" to "I no longer care what she does, and I wish her every happiness".

    Your future for now is being there for your kids. My ex and I went 2:2:3 on a weekly basis. It means I see my kids 11 days out of every 14. Sometimes only in the morning before school, sometimes only in the evenings after school, sometimes the whole day long. Being there for the kids includes making sure you keep things up at work, keep healthy, keep your home in good order. It's tempting to lie in bed until midday, eat chinese at midnight in your underpants, drink lots because you have a new found freedom. It isn't the best idea.

    I also felt that part of my identity was being as part of a couple, and threw myself into dating, using apps. I came across as too needy as I wanted a stepmother for my kids, a lifelong partner to live with, and carried a massive chip on my shoulder about my ex. And that was just so intense that I had no success at all. I was deeply unattractive, given my state of mind. My advice to you is to leave that for at least a year. I only had any meaningful relationships (more than two dates with the same person) once I no longer cared whether I was in a relationship or not, just met up with some women to have a good night out and see what happens next.

    You'll get there mate. Focus on the kids and living the best life for you. Try to make sure that the lad who goes to bed at night is a better one than the one who woke up this morning. Tomorrow always comes, even when it seems it won't, and it's always better than the day before when you look for the positives.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭Terrontress


    That was one of the first things I did! The Camino de Santiago. I only did the last 100km from Sarria and, instead of flying to SdC, taking the bus out to Sarria and walking back, I flew to Barcelona and got the train up to Sarria and walked from there.

    The night before the train, I was in Barcelona and felt so alone. Looking at restaurants, at happy couples, and thinking how lovely they look and how I could never go in.

    On the Camino itself, I met so many wonderful people. I never once felt lonely. If anything, there were too many people that I had to say goodbye to that I had built a connection with in such a short period. I ended up finishing a day early and was in SdC by myself for a few days, without the other pilgrims on the Camino, so was a bit lonely, but then took the bus to Porto, then headed home from there.

    That November, then, I went to Nuremberg by myself for the weekend and, on the Saturday night, took the big step and went into a beautiful restaurant on my own, had a lovely dinner and had a great time. Now, I do the lot. Cinema, theatre, galleries, pubs, restaurants. Sometimes I am glad to be on my own because I don't have to worry about others enjoying the show or whatever.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,133 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    You can go with a small group also, there some really good irish ones!

    The first time I went (Sarria to Santiago) I went with had only 5 people in the group and we are still in strong contact nearly 10 years later. The beauty of the small group is that you dont have to worry about luggage or anything, its ahead for you. All you need is to get up, hot shower and wonder if you can make it to the kit kat break stop or if the rain in Spain stays mainly on the plain (there's a lot of rain in northern spain)

    You can walk and talk with someone or take some time alone to walk with your own thoughts. Or a bit of both. Everyone had their own reasons for being there and it was great getting to know everyone. It was like free therapy. Every day it finished with a glass of whatever in a local spanish bar by way of achievement and by the time we walked into the Square in Santiago, it was overwhelming and very emotional, nothing to do with being religious at all. We met the some people on their way and their stories are humbling, really puts your own into perspective. And lots of laughter on the way, belly laughs.

    At one lunch stop, we met a lovely Polish couple in their very early thirties. He had been diagnosed with six months to live, so they left life as they knew it and went on the Camino, one day at a time. They were already walking 9 months, so he said he said he'd already beaten the F*****. He was full of smiles and life. I often think about them and hope he made it to Santiago.

    From the OP's posts and style, it sounds like something that would suit him when he's ready.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,105 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Yeah that sounds great. So many options :) And all excellent motivation for me to keep fit, positive and away from those awful bars.

    Some of the worst times I've had since this whole thing started were when I was walking around the town I'm in (literally, walked every single road and lane in the place over the past 6 months) and looking for something to do socially as a middle aged separated man and coming to the conclusion that it's just depressed old alcoholics sitting at a bar and wondering If I would end up like that.

    I've been to a couple of gigs on my own already and it's been fine but I need to stay away from the whiny singer songwriters for now… don't need to hear about their breakups for hours while sitting on my own mulling my past mistakes 😂



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭Terrontress


    Listening to sad songs will make you feel sad! That is what they are designed for. If I am feeling low, I watch something that I know will make me laugh. Old Simpsons, Alan Partridge, that sort of thing. When I finish watching them, the problems which caused me to feel sad are still there, but I have had a good laugh in the meantime and it doesn't feel so bad.

    You mention that you're doing, or are going to do 50:50 care with the kids, but also that you are going to have several weeks without them. Is that due to summer holidays? That's the ideal time to plan some solo travel. In the past five years I have been to Ukraine, Finland, Albania, Sweden, Estonia, Germany, Spain, Greece all on my own. I've also travelled with male friends during this period if someone fancies coming away. Getting these trips organised takes a bit of time, so uses headspace, and gives you something to look forward to.

    Sitting on your own in a bar is no good, no better than sitting at home alone, but it's grand to go to a bar and talk to someone you don't know. But you just need to be cautious about the drink.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,944 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    I think the trick is to keep your self busy,

    Your going to have a hell of a lot more time on your hands & instead of looking at that as a time that will make you lonely make it a time to try new things or get things done you never had the time for before,

    Its hard to take on board now but your born alone you;ll die alone you need to make peace with being alone & not relying on others to make you happy, Focus on all the good things relationships bring like your kids & that but don't make them define who you are,

    Keep off the drink ads much as you can it just leads to trouble in times like this , Give your self a year at least before you even start to think about dating ,

    A huge issue for blokes getting out of long term relationships is the feel the need to jump striaght back into one to show they are doing "GOOD" & are "over " the previous partner, They feel like people pity them being alone, Don't fall into that trap , You might feel the urge & fair enough your only human but don't just fall into a relationship with the first women that looks your way,

    Get your diet cleaned up & go work out, walking ,running, gym whatever you fancy but it'll give you a confidence boost

    Best of luck & try to enjoy yourself,



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